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Old Sep 04, 2010, 12:24 AM
that's gonna leave a scar
KCinNC's Avatar
United States, NC, Mooresville
Joined Aug 2007
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every slightly used GY401 i have bought works awesome.....even a used one i bought in the classifieds (HERE) for $50..... but the ebay sellers 401's now seem way to sketchy !!!!!
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Old Sep 06, 2010, 04:06 PM
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Darker4308's Avatar
Amherst, NY
Joined Jan 2008
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Now they are trying to get me to accept 10$ to resolve the case.

I told them where they could shove it.

I think I know how the scam works though.

Some do not realize they are getting a fake gyro and the chinese make a profit in the area of +500% per unit. This assumes about 10$ shipping and manufacturing overhead. In actuality the overhead is probably much lower. They also may take advantage of some form of bulk rate shipping.

A small group of customers realize the gyros are fake and complain. It then costs them ~10$ per unit to ship the device back and they may issue a complete refund.

The way the scam works is that as long as only 1 outa 5 people do not complain the scam breaks even. If they fool any more than about 20% of the customers then they make a profit. Again this just goes on my estimate - the break even ratio is probably much much better than what I have predicted. Also, all units that you ship back to them can be reused in a future scam. So it is really a great way to steal money.

They also get to hold your money for about 3 months. While the entire deal is worked out. It's quite clever really.

You just don't see it in America because the cost of producing knockoff electronics is too high to make the ratio favorable.
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Old Sep 06, 2010, 08:46 PM
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They must like me better... i got offered $15 each...... this is soooooooo wrong... i hope paypal make an example of them... I have made a claim thru paypal now for both gyros....

Cost me $148aud for the both and they offer me $30..... what a scam...
Why should i pay even a dollar for someone comitting total fraud......
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Old Sep 06, 2010, 09:07 PM
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I'm not sure if they are offering us 10$ to ship it back or 10$ total. It looks like the latter.
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Old Sep 06, 2010, 09:22 PM
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hmmmm.. will be interesting to see if paypal does the right thing.... or favours the criminal.

No wonder he had at least 2 different names.. hobbyrc-y and planemodel88
ready to move on to the next one when one is shut down.

This really is a criminal charge of fraud.. I thought if he asured me they are genuine in an email BEFORE and after i bought them.. I would be safe or at least I would be covered by paypal. I guess we shall soon see..
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 07:45 AM
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From what my roomate tells me ebay always gets all your money back. It just takes a while. It is very rare that they find in favor of the seller. I've had to pay the return shipping on AS-IS products twice.

Worse case ever though. A buddy of mine sold some hub caps. The guy then said on the other end that the hubcaps were not right for him and he exercised the return policy. Friend gets the stuff back and it is a different set of hub caps. The guy stole his hubcaps. He then went thru the ebay arbitration process and sent pictures of himself holding the his hubcaps along with the info that the buyer had never complained that they were the wrong type. Endgame ... he got stuck with the worthless guys hubcaps.

It's really a great way to get car parts if you have a broken part to exchange.

Also in responce to kneekolaas : laws about defrauding americans doesn't really exist in the PRC, and you can't really get in trouble with ebay unless you actually do a credit card runner. It's not illegal to "unknowingly" sell a knock off - it is just illegal to not pay up.
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 09:32 AM
My hobby is why Im broke
darthdrk's Avatar
USA, TN, Millington
Joined Dec 2002
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As an Rc Community, we make them enablers because we keep going back to the trough. In our quest for cheaper goods its always an open door for nefarious activity by criminals. Here in the states we call someone that copies a product a criminal over there they call themselves entrepreneurs. Its all about separating us from the dollar either by hook or crook. Im wondering what Futaba is doing about it... Probably really cant do nothing.
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 04:25 PM
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I am going to be honest. I don't have much of a problem with a clone if the item has been out for a long period of time and if the retail price was pure gouge. That's capitalism. This wasn't a clone. This was just a fake.

Also an update .... I have managed to escalate the case thru ebay. It just takes 7 days after first opening the case. I wish could take that fake gyro money and just buy everyone a pizza. To bad we don't all live in the same town.
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 06:39 AM
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Seller has offered me $40aud each now to settle....
Thats half what i payed for a fraudulent item..
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 09:00 AM
life is an oyster. shuck it!
istandalone's Avatar
bennington, VT
Joined Mar 2008
3,175 Posts
lol. i've been having some dialogue with this shyster/ebay seller about these fake gyros. here's our conversation cut and pasted:

me: are you sure these are genuine futaba 401 gyros? if i was to buy one, and open the case of it up, what would i find?
misc hardware? maybe a hex nut?

them: hi friend
it is genuine futaba 401 gyros

thanks
rgds
sena

me: no, they're not. a friend of mine bought one from you, and instead
of the normal smm chip, it contained a hex nut. total counterfeit.
we've contacted ebay, paypal, and futaba about this.

them: hi friend
it's no need to cheet our customers,

all of them are original

maybe your friend get the wrong item , maybe the mistake was from our warehouse,

you can ask your friend send a picture to confirm that
thanks

me: there is a picture here, and more then one person has has this
issue. it's obvious you are selling counterfeit gy401 gyros.
here is a discussion thread including pictures:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?
t=1296848&page=3

them: hi friend
we insist our priciple. they are original
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 12:15 PM
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Amherst, NY
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Yeah I've been getting a lot of msgs from a "sena" too.

They are cheats. They wouldn't be dumping their stock if they wern't cheats. Just submit your case to ebay as soon as the 7 days are up. If anyone needs any help with how to escalate please PM me. I've got pretty good with ebays internal procedure. A few escalations should knock this account off ebay ... the guy will probably be back the next day, but at least we might be able to get rid of his good feedback.

The only thing that we can do is very simply make sure to keep awareness raised. I have a feeling a lot of new pilots and pilots that don't use the formus have these gyros. All we really can do show some pictures and ask around. I am going to try and get ebay to send out a mass email, but I doubt they will as it is basically shooting themselves in the foot.
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 12:18 PM
life is an oyster. shuck it!
istandalone's Avatar
bennington, VT
Joined Mar 2008
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i haven't even bought one. i'm just F'ing with them. it's fun.
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 07:53 PM
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Amherst, NY
Joined Jan 2008
310 Posts
I think i've been outmanuvered.

I got an email from ebay. I have to send the item back to china via registered post. As in delivery confirmation. When the item is confirmed to have arrived back in China I get a refund.

Now here is the interesting part. The item ships for free and in order for me to not send it back by 1-day air to screw the seller they say I get "the original shipping fee". So basically I have to pay outa pocket to have it sent back.

I am trying to contest this, but I think the cunning bastard has got me by the balls.

Also, If the guy refuses to sign the confirmation he gets the money.

"Dear XXXX,

Thank you for contacting eBay in regard to the Futaba GY401 Gyro w/SMM
Technology GY 401 Helicopter (item #300420353631) that you recently
purchased. After reviewing your email, I understand that the item you
received is not as described. I know how frustrating it can be when an
item arrives and it is not in good condition. I would like to thank you
for your time and the patience you have shown throughout this claim
process.

After reviewing the case, we have decided to have you return the item to
the seller for a full refund. In order for us to hold the seller
accountable and issue the refund on their behalf, we need to ensure that
the item is back in their possession. So, please complete these steps in
the next 10 days so we can give you a refund:

1. Go to the Resolution Center and get the seller's return address from
the case details page:
http://resolutioncenter.ebay.com

2. Ship the item back to the seller using shipping tracking so we can
confirm that the seller received the item. You can use the shipping
company of your choice.

3. Return to the Resolution Center and enter the tracking number from
the package.

4. After you enter the tracking information, you'll see another page
where you'll be asked to confirm that the tracking information is
correct. Be sure to click the "Submit" button--otherwise we won't
receive your information. You must enter the tracking information in
order to receive a refund.

Once we have confirmation that the item has been delivered, we'll refund
you for the cost of the item plus original shipping within 3 days (as
long as the seller hasn't issued you a refund).

XXXX, I see that you have been a part of the eBay community for 5 years
now. Thank you for continuing to do business with us over the years. We
truly appreciate you as one of our valued customers.

Again, thank you for contacting eBay about the item you received that is
not as described.

Sincerely,
Sheena K.

eBay Customer Support "
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Old Sep 09, 2010, 11:14 PM
Under Warranty!
2sicMiniT's Avatar
Washington State
Joined Feb 2006
495 Posts
When you send it back don't use your name or return address. Use a family members, but all ebay should need is a tracking number. Once they get confirmation you get your money. I would not worry about him refusing.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 12:00 AM
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Amherst, NY
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If I was them I would just cancel my mail. Either way I'm going to see what ebay say's about the shipping.
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