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Old Apr 09, 2012, 08:47 PM
MJF
Waiting Fer Da SEFF
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hey ya'll......dang its been awhile since i been in here
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Old Apr 09, 2012, 09:25 PM
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United States, CA, Ukiah
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Originally Posted by turboparker View Post
Matt,

Well-put. I would not be happy if the manufacturers added weight to thier purpose-built pattern, 3D or unlimited aerobatic planes to make them more 'crashable'. That would be like adding weight to a sports-car so that it can handle a few trips down the ditch without damage. If the only vehicles a person has driven are economy-cars, one does not buy a lightweight, high-powered sports-car, and then complain because the suspension & chassis couldn't handle jumping the curb or bouncing through ditch a few times while they were learning how to apex the turns.

Same goes for RC planes. Pilots who still place a higher priority on crashworthiness than specific flight-characteristics, scale appearance, aerobatic performance, etc., when choosing their aircraft may be better-off looking at entry-level planes, aileron trainers, and sport-planes. Master the basics of aerobatic flight on a more rugged sport-plane before moving to these purpose-built aerobatic ships - where performance is the primary goal & crashworthiness isn't even a consideration.

An exception would be the Sukhoi XP. It is nearly indestructible when flown over grass, and it is a great aerobatic performer with a 5043 prop & a high-performance battery. The XP is an excellent choice for those who are looking for a rugged plane on which to learn aerobatics. Practice with the XP until one is comfortable doing KE passes & inverted passes right down on the deck. Practice until snaps, rolls, harriers, elevators & flat-spins are second-nature. Once a pilot has mastered the XP, he/she will be able to fly pretty much anything - in any scale.

BTW - what's up with this 'one-crash-wonder' phrase? That's a new one to me. I have never expected my planes to survive a real crash without needing major repair. None of the balsa planes I've ever had would be able to handle a realcrash without needing extensive rebuilding. For example, I've never had a balsa ship that could handle a cartwheel without needing major surgery afterward. I've never had a balsa ship that could handle an inverted landing without sustaining serious damage. A hard nose-in often requires major surgery on the fuse. Snapping-in at low altitude usually requires a major rebuild, at minimum. A dumb-thumb maneuver during a high-speed inverted pass down the runway usually results in a new 'parts plane'. These little foamies are the only RC planes I've owned that can handle such things without sustaining major, if not terminal damage.

In comparison to everything else I've flown over the last 28 years, these UMs are already bulletproof!

Joel
Agreed 100% with thinking these things are already pretty rugged, it took me a LONG time not to cringe over something like ground looping one. I have a durafly micro slick that has to be well into 150 flights, and about flight 130 or so I managed to fold the wing in the most spectacular fashion in a very abusive blender with WAY more energy than far too much......Then of course like a shot duck it came right in on the spinner. Long story short, It was fixed and flown the next day and without a REALLY close look you couldnt tell it had 5 flights on it, let alone well over 100 hard flights and one real good case of spectacular structural failure and subsequent loss of controlled flight. Best part was as soon as I saw it go I knew the best thing to do was enjoy the rest of the show on the way down.....Hehe, its a sad thing when you fondly remember a blatant case of pilot error ( thats not right, it wasnt error at all, I was going beserk with 3/4 throttle downlines from high up building up WAY to much E and then slamming the thing into the flatspins confident that every one would be the last but completely unwilling to not find out how bad I could treat it, and at full throttle and about a 60 foot vertical downline seemed to do what it should have long before ) Anyway, the thing still looks mint and flys great, but the other ones I have nib stashed away are going on a serious diet and getting a tiny bit of the milled out weight back with some carbon in places it really shouldnt need....Moral of the story, it should have looked like someone chucked a bag of packing peanuts on the field with as hard as it went in on the prop, and when that weight is gone full throttle entries into a 60g blender should an all day thing! I left the field with a smile after that for some sick reason.....Im smiling now.......

I dont think I really made a point anywhere in there, oh wait I did.....100% in agreement with everything you stated above Joel, with the exception of the sukhoi xp.........as I never have had one. ( its shameful I know )

Mendo
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 04:27 PM
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United States, GA, Grayson
Joined Mar 2008
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Hey fellas.

My Beast is finally dead, but I plan to use the guts in a scratch built project. The only problem is that I need to extend the length between the motor and ESC a few inches. Is there a commercially available extension for this? I checked on rc-connectors.com but didn't see one.
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Hey fellas.

My Beast is finally dead, but I plan to use the guts in a scratch built project. The only problem is that I need to extend the length between the motor and ESC a few inches. Is there a commercially available extension for this? I checked on rc-connectors.com but didn't see one.
I ran into the same problem and resorted to whipping out the trusty soldering iron. Another solution is to fork over for a 300kv motor from the Stryker. It has about another 1.25" in leads... doesn't sound like much, but in the UM world it makes a big difference. I didn't do this because I like the quiet 2300kv motor.
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 05:02 PM
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East Bethel, MN USA
Joined Jul 2009
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Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Hey fellas.

My Beast is finally dead, but I plan to use the guts in a scratch built project. The only problem is that I need to extend the length between the motor and ESC a few inches. Is there a commercially available extension for this? I checked on rc-connectors.com but didn't see one.
I am not aware of a ready-made extension. However, adding another set of connectors in the motor leads will cause a reduction in power. If you do not want to lose power, I suggest cutting the wires & soldering in an extension. Be sure to use quality, flexible wire with a decent strand-count - of at least the same gage as the original motor wires.

Joel
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 05:10 PM
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United States, GA, Grayson
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Originally Posted by turboparker View Post
I am not aware of a ready-made extension. However, adding another set of connectors in the motor leads will cause a reduction in power. If you do not want to lose power, I suggest cutting the wires & soldering in an extension. Be sure to use quality, flexible wire with a decent strand-count - of at least the same gage as the original motor wires.

Joel
Thanks Joel.

What is the best method to solder in an extension? Twist one wire around the other then solder together?
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 05:54 PM
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United States, CO, Colorado Springs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Hey fellas.

My Beast is finally dead, but I plan to use the guts in a scratch built project. The only problem is that I need to extend the length between the motor and ESC a few inches. Is there a commercially available extension for this? I checked on rc-connectors.com but didn't see one.
I could certainly make one if you're not comfortable doing the extension. All you gotta do is ask! Check out my 'custom orders' section to see all the stuff people have requested and I made. Then go to the 'Contact Us' link at the bottom of every page to send me a note.

Glenn
RC-Connectors.com
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 06:12 PM
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United States, CA, Sebastopol
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Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Thanks Joel.

What is the best method to solder in an extension? Twist one wire around the other then solder together?
Don't forget to slip on the shrink-wrap first! And somehow arrange to keep it away from the heat while soldering. Can be challenging while doing small work.
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Old Apr 10, 2012, 07:54 PM
Gopher huntin' stick jockey
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East Bethel, MN USA
Joined Jul 2009
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Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Thanks Joel.

What is the best method to solder in an extension? Twist one wire around the other then solder together?
Strip, twist, tin, and then solder. As Erkq noted - don't forget the shrink-tube! If you are good at soldering, it's an easy task. However, if you don't know a cold solder joint from a good one, I'd take Glenn up on his offer. He does excellent work. I use his charge harnesses to charge my 2s UMX packs on my TP 820CD, and I use his charge leads for my UM cells. I also tested his 2s UM cell harness for running a pair of UM cells in the Beast. It was only down 100 RPM from the same Hyp 180 cells made into a 2s pack, which equates to a barely measurable 2% drop in thrust. In comparison, Eflite's 2s harness was down 400 RPM from the 2s pack, for an 8% drop in thrust. On top of that, Eflite's harness weighs over twice as much.

In short - if you are not comfortable with soldering, definitely take Glenn up on his offer!

Joel
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Old Apr 11, 2012, 02:56 PM
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United States, CA, Ukiah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tripleup05 View Post
Hey fellas.

My Beast is finally dead, but I plan to use the guts in a scratch built project. The only problem is that I need to extend the length between the motor and ESC a few inches. Is there a commercially available extension for this? I checked on rc-connectors.com but didn't see one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by turboparker View Post
Strip, twist, tin, and then solder. As Erkq noted - don't forget the shrink-tube! If you are good at soldering, it's an easy task. However, if you don't know a cold solder joint from a good one, I'd take Glenn up on his offer. He does excellent work. I use his charge harnesses to charge my 2s UMX packs on my TP 820CD, and I use his charge leads for my UM cells. I also tested his 2s UM cell harness for running a pair of UM cells in the Beast. It was only down 100 RPM from the same Hyp 180 cells made into a 2s pack, which equates to a barely measurable 2% drop in thrust. In comparison, Eflite's 2s harness was down 400 RPM from the 2s pack, for an 8% drop in thrust. On top of that, Eflite's harness weighs over twice as much.

In short - if you are not comfortable with soldering, definitely take Glenn up on his offer!

Joel
And here I am always trying to shorten leads and eliminate connectors.......If you cover the shipping cost I would be happy to extend the leads for you free of charge sir, without my tx Im at a bit of a halt on most of my projects so this would be productive lol. ( Although I got most of my 40in Albatros D.III together yesterday )

Mendo
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Old Apr 11, 2012, 10:52 PM
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I got a new aileron servo last week thursday, then it was super windy windy windy forever. but tonight was calm, so I got to remained my Beast3D. such a nice plane. so is Beast ver1.0.
#goodtoflyagain

now I want a 30" Beast.
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Old Apr 11, 2012, 11:30 PM
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More fun with the B3D - on fully-charged 3S packs

Couldn't have asked for a more perfect April flying day in Minnesota. Clear blue skies, temp in the high 50s, and hardly a breath of wind. So I headed to the field with the B3D & my Hyp 180 3s packs.

Took her up on a short-charged 3s 180. She performed flawlessly, as usual. The guys at the field were more than impressed. I played around with CG settings, and moved aft just enough so I could hold a hover for about 30 seconds. I even managed to pull off a few torque-rolling tail-slides!

I flew a bunch of short-charged packs. I swear that running on 3s makes me much more brave with the plane. I was flying KE harrier circuits at just over a wingspan off the deck! I did half-throttle KE loops, an inverted flat-spin (yeah, I finally got it to do one!), elevators, parachutes, snaps, spins and a few Lomcevaks. At least they looked sort of like Lomcevaks.

It was getting dusk. I figured I had time for a a few more flights. I thought about trying a full-charge, and then decided against it. Took her up for another round on 12V. What an evening! Timer went off, so I brought her around & landed. Got back to the car, and thought 'to hell with it - I'm gonna try 12.6V. If the brick pops, it pops.'

Charged up a pair of 3s 180s to a full 12.6V. Popped one in the B3D, flipped on the tx, crossed my fingers, and plugged that sucker in. Nothing happened! Well, nothing except for a normal AS3X boot-up & ESC arming sequence, that is! Everything was working, and no parts were 'letting the white smoke out' - so I figured she was good to go. Taxied out to the runway, rolled into the throttle, pulled back on the stick, and she went ballistic after a 2-foot roll! Slammed the ailerons hard to port, and watched her drill herself into the sky at what looked to be close to 50 MPH! Despite the 1440 degree-per-second (or higher) roll-rate, she accelerated vertically to speeds well-beyond what she can attain in level flight on 2s!!

Brought her in when the timer went off, and the motor was barely above ambient. For reference, I'm running the 2300/5043 combo. Popped in a freshly-fully-charged 3s 180 & took her up for another romp with Bernoulli. Again, she leapt from the runway after a 2-foot roll. I flew lots of WOT passes, hovers, KE loops, and pretty much everything else I could think of. I brought her in when the timer went off. It was getting dark, so I called it quits.

Charged the 3s 180 packs to a full 12.6V, and only put 130 mAh back in after a 4.5-minute flight - which equates to a 72% discharge. That's ~28.9 mAh/minute, so the 80% discharge point would be ~5 minutes. Not bad, all things considered! However, a bit more flight-time would be nice. Hmmm....I wonder how she'd perform with the 50302300Kv combo. Might have to try that & see.

I will be running fully-charged 3s packs in my B3D from now on!

Disclaimer for the newcomers & those who may not have been following our 3scapades: Try this at your own risk. You may toast the brick on 3s, or it may perform just fine.

Joel
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Old Apr 12, 2012, 06:54 AM
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Nice report Joel! I think adding the disclaimer at the end is a great idea too, just in case.

(From a big chicken who's still scared to tried it on 3S myself!)
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Old Apr 12, 2012, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by BobaFett1138 View Post
Yeah, the beast wings are very easy to damage. My SU-26XP has been abused SO badly, and yet I've only had to put some tape over the leading edge where it went into a fence to restore the airfoil shape.

Also, on the topic of new wings, anyone try mounting the aileron servos in the center of the wing? Right where the top/bottom spanner is located? I was thinking that might reduce some of the stress where the control horn meets the wing. I have a wing set on order, and I was thinking about re-locating the servos there.... any thoughts?
If you do the cartwheel tear mod I have found that the beast holds up extremely well, and yes the wings do break but usually it's just a crack and can easily be repaired with some CA and kicker. I just replaced my wingset last week after flying my beastie for 5 months or so, and I piled it in many times, even straight in at full speed into pavement. While the wings sustained damage I actually found that the battery tray inside seems to take the most abuse since the battery has a lot of momentum when you stop very quickly nosefirst into the blacktop ;-). When I put my new wings on, I definitely put the servos on the top of the wing instead of the bottom. Before I even flew it, I also put .5mm cf rod along the edge of each control horn for the ailerons going the entire width of the aileron, honestly if you do that and lay a nice bead of CA over it and use kicker, there is NO flex of the control horn since the force is distributed across the entire aileron width. Another thing worth noting, if you buy takeout SAVE the containers, when you get a new wing set you can use the new parts to cut out duplicates of things like the interplane struts etc. out of the takeout container foam it's pretty much the same stuff and you can get a lot of mileage out of it. ALSO be sure you don't confuse CA with CA debonder, my nice new wingset has a little melted crater in the top above one of the interplane struts since those damned bottles look so much alike at 2am...why isn't this drying wait NOOOOOO!!! LOL. Love my beast, with all my planes it's still my fav to fly and I try out all my new techniques on the beast well before any of the bigger planes (after the sim of course). Beast is like the mcpx of fixed wings for me...

Tom
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Old Apr 12, 2012, 12:26 PM
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United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Originally Posted by pugsam View Post
The bottles looking similar doesn't seem terribly important.

How about the claims of improvement?

Is there anything to that, from what you're experiencing?



Dave

ps - I agree with you about the strings!
Just a little up date about Beacon Foam Tac.. As many of you know I have posted many times that I didn't like the stuff as it to darn thick to use, takes for ever to get any out of the bottle, stringy as heck.. So after receiving my new stock which is better that my old stuff...

Thinking I had nothing to lose I shot a bunch of Ronsonol lighter fluid into the old bottle it was just about full yet. After spending a hour turning the bottle over and over watching the air bubble mixing up the glue and lighter fluid and also shaking it up it all mixed together nicely.. So I added more till I got it to the point of being as thick as thick paint. I then brushed some on some paper and let dry overnight. It makes a nice thin yet still flexible coating, it sure makes the paper a lot harder to rip. I'm thinking of using this easy to apply firm in place of the Scotch tape that I normally use to reinforce wings etc..
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