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Old Dec 20, 2012, 10:14 PM
Gopher huntin' stick jockey
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East Bethel, MN USA
Joined Jul 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlta Nvmbr Ynkee View Post
Is the beast 3D very sensitive and touchy ? And does anyone have any tips for trimming it and the maiden ?
Sensitive & touchy are relative terms. It is no where near as touchy as, say, the UM Sukhoi XP. But it is a lot more touchy than a typical 60" 3D ship. Sensitive? Yes! It's a short-coupled bipe with four huge ailerons. It rolls like a drill-bit & can easily chase its own tail. Flying this plane with a DX5e is going to be a real challenge for someone who has never flown an unlimited aerobatic plane in this scale before. You'll need to use low rates, for sure.

Regarding the maiden - roll into the throttle & the plane pretty much lifts-off from a 3-point position. Be smooth on the sticks. At WOT on a good pack, the Beast is over twice as fast as a stock Champ. Use throttle management & don't let it get too far away. On approach, carry a fair amount of power all the way down. Manage decent-rate with throttle & manage airspeed with elevator, just like you do in your Cessna. The Beast's natural tendency is to land a 3-point attitude. Go with it. If the plane is too sensitive for your comfort on low rates, move the pushrods out one hole, mechanically re-trim, and see how it goes.

Regarding trimming - reduce the aileron, elevator, and rudder end-points to 95-98% to prevent servo binding due to over-travel. Mechanically trim the plane before the maiden. Power-up & let AS3X initialize. Do not engage AS3X. Disconnect the pack. This ensures that the servos are centered. Mechanically trim the plane. Adjust the CG as described in the manual. To make the plane a bit more docile, you may want to go for 16-17mm rather than the recommended 19mm until you get used to the plane, as 19mm is the neutral-handling point on this airframe. Check the prop balance. Excessive vibration will screw up AS3X. If you need to add trim during the flight, be sure to transfer your tx trims to mechanical trim afterward & zero the tx trims, as more than a few clicks of tx trim will screw up AS3X. Zero tx trim is ideal. Never, ever use subtrim. For details on flight-trimming aerobatic planes, see my blog thread on the topic: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...51&postcount=1

Here's a simple method of checking the CG - courtesy of Pug:



Joel
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Last edited by turboparker; Dec 20, 2012 at 10:50 PM.
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Old Dec 20, 2012, 11:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboparker View Post
Sensitive & touchy are relative terms. It is no where near as touchy as, say, the UM Sukhoi XP. But it is a lot more touchy than a typical 60" 3D ship. Sensitive? Yes! It's a short-coupled bipe with four huge ailerons. It rolls like a drill-bit & can easily chase its own tail. Flying this plane with a DX5e is going to be a real challenge for someone who has never flown an unlimited aerobatic plane in this scale before. You'll need to use low rates, for sure.

Regarding the maiden - roll into the throttle & the plane pretty much lifts-off from a 3-point position. Be smooth on the sticks. At WOT on a good pack, the Beast is over twice as fast as a stock Champ. Use throttle management & don't let it get too far away. On approach, carry a fair amount of power all the way down. Manage decent-rate with throttle & manage airspeed with elevator, just like you do in your Cessna. The Beast's natural tendency is to land a 3-point attitude. Go with it. If the plane is too sensitive for your comfort on low rates, move the pushrods out one hole, mechanically re-trim, and see how it goes.

Regarding trimming - be sure to transfer your tx trims to mechanical trim, as more than a few clicks of tx trim will screw up AS3X. Zero tx trim is ideal. Never, ever use subtrim. Adjust the CG as described in the manual. To make the plane a bit more docile, you may want to go for 16-17mm rather than the recommended 19mm until you get used to the plane, as 19mm is the neutral-handling point on this airframe. Check the prop balance. Excessive vibration will screw up AS3X. For details on flight-trimming aerobatic planes, see my blog thread on the topic: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...51&postcount=1

Here's a simple method of checking the CG - courtesy of Pug:



Joel
Thanks Joel for your help are they usually well trimmed streight out of the box ? And on final approach does the AS3X keep it pretty rock solid or is the little beast at the mercy of the wind ? Because I know that a plane cruising around can be smooth in wind with 0deg angle of attack but once on the back of the power curve it can be a completely different animal cause wind is a significant factor where I fly. Thanks

Olly
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Old Dec 20, 2012, 11:36 PM
Gopher huntin' stick jockey
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East Bethel, MN USA
Joined Jul 2009
11,799 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlta Nvmbr Ynkee View Post
Thanks Joel for your help are they usually well trimmed streight out of the box ? And on final approach does the AS3X keep it pretty rock solid or is the little beast at the mercy of the wind ? Because I know that a plane cruising around can be smooth in wind with 0deg angle of attack but once on the back of the power curve it can be a completely different animal cause wind is a significant factor where I fly. Thanks

Olly
Olly,

You need to check the mechanical trims, as they may or may not be correct. Also - there is enough variability in manufacturing that it's best to measure the CG on your plane, rather than going by where others put their packs.

AS3X makes the plane fly very big until it runs out of control-authority. When the airflow over the control surfaces dies, the plane very abruptly becomes a 2-oz foamie again. As long as there is sufficient airflow, the system does a remarkable job of combating external forces. In the video I posted, I did a number of landings in the 19 MPH wind. As you can see, the plane handled it just fine. The plane was stock. I was running a GWS 5030 prop & a Hyperion 240 mAh pack. Here is a clip of me flying it in a 26 MPH wind. However, I am flying on 3s this time around. I would not recommend flying a stock Beast 3D in this much wind. Also - keep in mind that I started wind-surfing glow-powered planes many years ago. Flying in winds that are nearly four times the stall-speed is not for novice pilots.

Eflite UMX Beast 3D on 3s - in a 26 MPH wind! Stationary KE, elevator landings, etc (8 min 10 sec)


Joel
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 12:16 AM
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Thanks Joel your advise has been invaluable I shall update you when I do the maiden I'm looking forward to flying this little machine
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 01:11 PM
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Help reprograming a beast rx

The rudder and elev servos in one of my Beast 3d as3x planes were dead. Took them off and cleaned the contact surfaces but still they sort of try but don't move unless I give them a nudge with my finger. I found a used beast as3x rx on ebay. Got it all in and while all works, the elev is reversed and the left ailerons are reversed. Is there a way to reprogram this with the tx sticks like on the p51 ar6400 brick?? Maybe just a reset to the original beast settings? If so, or if not, can someone point me to how to deal with this?
Thanks and happy holiday flying.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 01:56 PM
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More help

As long as I am at it, I have another Beast as3x, servos all good but, the motor will only stutter and barely turn. If I go to full throttle it will quit and the rx light will blink a few times. I tried a different motor but same results. This Beast, and the Beast in my previous post, both came from ebay with these problems known. I just like to try to fix things, but I seem to be in need of more info here.
Thanks
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 02:38 PM
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United States, MI, Grand Traverse
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathrips View Post
The rudder and elev servos in one of my Beast 3d as3x planes were dead. Took them off and cleaned the contact surfaces but still they sort of try but don't move unless I give them a nudge with my finger. I found a used beast as3x rx on ebay. Got it all in and while all works, the elev is reversed and the left ailerons are reversed. Is there a way to reprogram this with the tx sticks like on the p51 ar6400 brick?? Maybe just a reset to the original beast settings? If so, or if not, can someone point me to how to deal with this?

As long as I am at it, I have another Beast as3x, servos all good but, the motor will only stutter and barely turn. If I go to full throttle it will quit and the rx light will blink a few times. I tried a different motor but same results. This Beast, and the Beast in my previous post, both came from ebay with these problems known. I just like to try to fix things, but I seem to be in need of more info here.
Thanks
You're going to have to do some micro-soldering. The one with the dead rudder you're going to have to buy new servo mechanics and replace the motor.

Reversing the servos is done via an adapter that shorts two of the wires, however I do not remember which wires, do a search to find which. To reverse the elevator You'll probably need the USB programmer: SPMA3060. This should allow you to set the elevator and rudder directions.

On the brick that blinks on throttle. You are going to have to inspect every solder point on the board. There most likely a solder blob bridging two points together. You'll need to desolder it and fix it. This is not for the faint of heart as these parts are tiny. First spot to check is the ESC to motor wires. I've seen them pretty poorly soldered before.

-Brian
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 03:01 PM
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Thanks
I was also wondering if I could just reverse the motor wires on the offending servos. Will the as3x still be going in the correct direction?
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 03:41 PM
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United States, MI, Grand Traverse
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Originally Posted by Mathrips View Post
Thanks
I was also wondering if I could just reverse the motor wires on the offending servos. Will the as3x still be going in the correct direction?
Don't reverse the motor wires! The RX doesn't just turn the motor off or on it uses a resistive strip to locate the servo position. Just search this and the B3D thread, somewhere in there there was a post on how the servo reversers work. I do know they short two wires. It is either the signal wire to ground OR signal wire to positive. All you do is short the correct pair and then plug the battery in, then unplug, remove the short and the servo will now work in the opposite direction.

-Brian
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 03:46 PM
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Ah!
That makes sense. Thanks
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 04:20 PM
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Ok, I found that I am to short the ground to the signal wire. Do I assume that is brown to tan?
Also I can do this on the offending aileron but I am assuming I will use the stick logic from the AR6400 manual for the elevator as it has no servo leads on the board, just the motor leads.
Thanks for any input.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 06:00 PM
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United States, MI, Grand Traverse
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathrips View Post
Ok, I found that I am to short the ground to the signal wire. Do I assume that is brown to tan?
Also I can do this on the offending aileron but I am assuming I will use the stick logic from the AR6400 manual for the elevator as it has no servo leads on the board, just the motor leads.
Thanks for any input.
Maybe a stupid question but have you checked to see if the AS3X is moving the correct way on the elevator? If it is just reverse the Elevator on the TX.

IMPORTANT: make sure the AS3X correction is going the right way!!!

See the instruction manual page 10. for channel reversing instructions.

-Brian
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 12:20 AM
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I bought a few used Beast 3d off ebay one has the foam a little beat up and the other the rudder servo motor seems to be bad or not getting enough power. I can flick it with my finger and it will spin. Is the motor itself just glued in? I'm thinking I can just replace the motor on the servo. Right? Seems like these go bad a lot from all the ones I've seen on ebay. Can it be pulled out with out taking out the RX? I'd have to cut the glue on the RX to get it out and how exactly to do get the linkages off? Is that heat shrink or glue?
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 12:31 AM
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Rudder servo will slide out. It is just held in by friction. Not sure about everyone else but my rudder and elev servos just needed new motors and now work fine. Looks to me like you could leave the rx in the plane and just slide out the rudder servo motor and replace it. Elev is more involved. If you decide to remove the rx just cut glue on both sides and pry up gently with exacto knife. I think you will need to remove the battery tray so that you can unplug the motor or the wires will hang you up. You don't need to mess with the heat shrink on the pushrods. The pushrods will come out by twisting the rx once it is free of the fuse. Disconnect the rods from the elev and rudder first so that you can slide the rx out.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 12:38 AM
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Thanks for your reply. I tried to pull it out but I'm afraid to break something. any tool or method you would recommend? So all I need is another servo motor and a little soldering and it should work? I should take the RX out to replace it?
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