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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:05 PM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
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Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
okay so 'will be saved' = sounds like 'salvation' /agree

where did the working for it come from , in your other post?
The idea that all the good deeds you do being counted towards your salvation, i.e. working towards your salvation, like the Big Man is keeping score!
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:09 PM
Suspended Account
Mentor, OH
Joined Dec 2004
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Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
Prayer shouldn't be about what we want. as in it isn't about gimmie this, and gimmie that, and gimmie one of those..... etc

to truly grasp the "power of prayer" People need to get over their selfishness, demanding, self centered attitudes.
ok then, how about this;
you are diagnosed with some kind of cancer. you pray and pray. for what, i don't know. after several bouts of chemo and maybe an operation, and many hours on your knees praying, the cancer goes into remission.

was it the praying that saved you or was it all the medical help? or could it be that your own body tried to heal itself.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:11 PM
Low, slow and dirty
maine
Joined Jan 2008
427 Posts
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Originally Posted by sgtdirt View Post
ok then, how about this;
you are diagnosed with some kind of cancer. you pray and pray. for what, i don't know. after several bouts of chemo and maybe an operation, and many hours on your knees praying, the cancer goes into remission.

was it the praying that saved you or was it all the medical help? or could it be that your own body tried to heal itself.



Ever think "all of the above" .... Praying isn't going to have any Ill effects ,only positive
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:13 PM
All under control, Grommit!
leccyflyer's Avatar
United Kingdom, Aberdeen
Joined Sep 2000
12,588 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgtdirt View Post
ok then, how about this;
you are diagnosed with some kind of cancer. you pray and pray. for what, i don't know. after several bouts of chemo and maybe an operation, and many hours on your knees praying, the cancer goes into remission.

was it the praying that saved you or was it all the medical help? or could it be that your own body tried to heal itself.
It's a choice that could be offered to believers, especially those with a well documented total disain for science. They could be given the choice - prayer or chemo-therapy, waiting for a miracle or anti-biotics, in the case of infectious diseases. Maybe they could have the choice of 14th century remedies, or modern antibiotics developed as a response to growing resistance in bacterial strains.

They say that there are no atheists in foxholes, how many true believers in the power of prayer are there in pharmacies?
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:13 PM
Foam flies better
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From Canadia and proud of it!
Joined Jan 2006
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Originally Posted by jumpinjo View Post
Ever think "all of the above" .... Praying isn't going to have any Ill effects ,only positive
So what if your an atheist?
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:16 PM
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Mentor, OH
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Originally Posted by leccyflyer View Post

They say that there are no atheists in foxholes, how many true believers in the power of prayer are there in pharmacies?
never thought about that. funny though.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:17 PM
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North Texas
Joined Nov 2002
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Originally Posted by leccyflyer View Post
They say that there are no atheists in foxholes, how many true believers in the power of prayer are there in pharmacies?
I know one. If you think that belief in God forces non-reliance on pharmaceuticals, you haven't been listening to us very well, nor reading the Bible.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:23 PM
All under control, Grommit!
leccyflyer's Avatar
United Kingdom, Aberdeen
Joined Sep 2000
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Originally Posted by madsci_guy View Post
I know one. If you think that belief in God forces non-reliance on pharmaceuticals, you haven't been listening to us very well, nor reading the Bible.
Disbelief and disdain for the scientific method and espousing young earth creationism would put one in a rather awkward position as regards acceeding to the use of modern antibiotics, that take account of bacterial development of resistant to older treatments. The choice is there though - YeCs should be able to choose to use those anti-biotics that have been developed from creation scie....oh, hang on, there aren't any.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:23 PM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
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I think this now needs to be carefully civil, or the thread will simply degenerate into the standard "For / Against" Religion, i.e. become a boring waste of time.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:28 PM
Figure Nine Champ
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North Texas
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Originally Posted by leccyflyer View Post
Disbelief and disdain for the scientific method and espousing young earth creationism would put one in a rather awkward position as regards acceeding to the use of modern antibiotics, that take account of bacterial development of resistant to older treatments. The choice is there though - YeCs should be able to choose to use those anti-biotics that have been developed from creation scie....oh, hang on, there aren't any.
Uh, never heard of Penicillin?

I daresay that I use The Scientific Method more than you, it being part of what I get paid to do, so let's not try to go there shall we?
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:39 PM
Useful Idiot
Asturias, Spain
Joined Mar 2001
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Originally Posted by madsci_guy View Post
Uh, never heard of Penicillin?

I daresay that I use The Scientific Method more than you, it being part of what I get paid to do, so let's not try to go there shall we?
I hope it is not in botany/agronomy, otherwise your finding it reasonable for a tree to grow from a seed and bear fruit the same day might find you at odds with your colleagues.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:40 PM
All under control, Grommit!
leccyflyer's Avatar
United Kingdom, Aberdeen
Joined Sep 2000
12,588 Posts
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Originally Posted by madsci_guy View Post
Uh, never heard of Penicillin?
Yep.

Contract a penicillin-resistant strain of bacteria and take the penicillin and let someone else contract that same strain of bacteria and use a modern antibiotic instead. See who does better.

There are quite a few strains of bacteria that will laugh at penicillin. Well, so much as bacteria do laugh, some strains just smirk a bit, apparently.

How though, would you attribute the discovery of penicillin to creation science?

Quote:
I daresay that I use The Scientific Method more than you, it being part of what I get paid to do, so let's not try to go there shall we?
You don't have the first clue as to the actual details of what I do, nor what it involves, so that leaves you in a position that your "daresay" is nothing more than a bald assertion, based on a lack of salient information.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:42 PM
dont play with rc anymore
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United States, MO, St Joseph
Joined Feb 2005
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Originally Posted by jumpinjo View Post
I don't always agree with E.T. but this is pretty low! So I "commend him" for not slamming that button, just hope the post police doesn't do it for him!

I only hope that you can "take it" as much as dishing it out... Hopefully, we'll all find out in the future...
Ummm...what?

You are apparently jumping to conclusions. It was not an attack or anything. I was having some fun with him about his posted "location" and if you had actually read the thread, you would have seen his response and realized that we were trying to have some fun in an otherwise tense environment.

Lighten up dude!
And read before jumping to conclusions.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:46 PM
All under control, Grommit!
leccyflyer's Avatar
United Kingdom, Aberdeen
Joined Sep 2000
12,588 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norman Adlam View Post
I think this now needs to be carefully civil, or the thread will simply degenerate into the standard "For / Against" Religion, i.e. become a boring waste of time.
I'm never anything but civil Norman, it's stood me in good stead for many years
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 04:48 PM
All under control, Grommit!
leccyflyer's Avatar
United Kingdom, Aberdeen
Joined Sep 2000
12,588 Posts
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Originally Posted by micronut View Post
Ummm...what?

You are apparently jumping to conclusions. It was not an attack or anything. I was having some fun with him about his posted "location" and if you had actually read the thread, you would have seen his response and realized that we were trying to have some fun in an otherwise tense environment.

Lighten up dude!
And read before jumping to conclusions.
Well, exactly.

It beggars belief that anyone could be so lacking in perception as to not recognise the self-deprecation in the joke in ET's custom user text. That some should try to turn it into an insult just illustrates a complete lack of "getting it".
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