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Old Sep 02, 2010, 08:25 AM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
Hi Dan thanks! The further I get with this the more I'm thinking that it would be really cool to get a SC&H cruiser and modifying her to Snakes configuration. We will see that when I have my new workshop equipped
Right now I'm asking myself how I'm gonna do it with the rigging.. Dan your tack&sheets for the courses are purely dummy right? I'm asking myself if I should try to make these a continuous loop with the main winch.

Oh and I'm Austrian but I've been reading English as long as I van read and grew up as a proper computer kid with a comodore 64 and the first text adventures
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Old Sep 02, 2010, 08:54 AM
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DanL's Avatar
United States, MN, Brainerd
Joined Oct 2004
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The forecourse tacks and sheets are dummy. The forecourse has to be stiffened with a wire frame or wire spreaders to hold tha sail shape. The course braces pull the yard and wire frame of the sail around, and the tacks and sheets easily follow. I don't think you will need to run them off a winch, but it could be done.

Maybe buy the SC&H hull kit and build/modify from that. The hull is really strong and well done.
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Old Sep 02, 2010, 12:27 PM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
I think if then i would get the complete kit and ask Philip to include some dowel he uses for the masts/yards in teh kit to fabricate teh mizzen from.

I just layed a sparplan from Petreus Brig Irene (which i understand is very close to the cruiser) over the HMS Snake masting plan and you can see in that in teh pic below.
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Old Sep 02, 2010, 02:31 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
United States, MD, Severna Park
Joined Apr 2008
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Snake and her sisters were basically Cruiser class hulls with ship rigs. SC&H could set up their Grasshopper kits to be rigged either way - a quick low-cost way to add another ship to the line-up and might boost sales a little. Variety is the spice of life.
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Old Sep 02, 2010, 05:06 PM
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DanL's Avatar
United States, MN, Brainerd
Joined Oct 2004
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I hate Snakes.....

Oh man, a ship rig the size of the cruizer class brig - perfect!!!
And the Snake is beautiful! I can't get sucked in, I can't get sucked in....
Aaaaaaarghhhh....
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 03:20 PM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
i`d like to invite you guys all for a bit of a brainstorming session on how to rig the Snake..

The Rigging shall be sailable. e.g. not 100% scale doesn`t matter, this is a small model if it`s 10ft away it`s even smaller and so extremely small details won`t show up at all..
I want to use this time Suplex Sails.
I would like to have cross over jibs
i`d like to use only 2 winches if possible.. space and weight considerations don`t allow for much more, but i think if absolutely necessary a small size (15g) Servo or 2 i can still be fit below decks for either the spanker sheet or the jibs if it has to be.

I had always troubles to get a wire in the foot of the courses around shrouds (thats why i lef them off on Somers) so if at all possible id like to not use the wire in the foot of the courses.

I`d like to show what Jimmy James a fellow modeller in the UK did to control his Square riggers sails, he is using bowlines on courses and topsails as well as tack and sheet for his courses hooked to an endless sheet driven by a "capstan" winch, pretty ingenious
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 04:16 PM
SCALE Sailor
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United States, MD, Severna Park
Joined Apr 2008
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Looking at how models this small handle - I'd say you could control all three masts together and not loose a thing. They move so quick that you actually loose ground trying to bring the mains around before the fore.
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 04:47 PM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
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well what i found with Bounty and Somers was that due to their very low momentum they really need to be sailed through the tack, just throwing all yards to the other side must be very well timed to work, the real square rigger way in this case works better and more consistent so i rather have sails before and sails behind the CE separated.
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 06:39 PM
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DanL's Avatar
United States, MN, Brainerd
Joined Oct 2004
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wires in courses

Instead of a wire surrounding the sides and foot of the sail, try using spreader wires per pics.
Also other pics and diagrams from the Syren build. Might help some with crossover headsails, etc.
Also included an old diagram of how I was considering controlling a 3 masted sqr rigger.

Jimmy James gave me lots of great info and help when I was building. I love the stain and mottled coloration of his sails - they reflect the actual appearance of what he has seen in a long career sailing. No white for him - and his models look spectacular.
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Old Sep 04, 2010, 12:29 AM
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Vlaardingen, The Netherlands
Joined Nov 2008
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Looking good!

This thread is starting to look like a very good lesson Ship-English

Greetings Josse
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 07:00 PM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
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allright the second layer of planking is done... now just the gap filling and sanding to be finished. Took of teh bulkhead tabs above the deck too (also clean up required..)

all up weight of the hull now 414g.. even tho most of teh structural weight is already there i can`t yet estimate how much all the masting and deck furniture weights.. i fear i`ll have to make the carronade barrels from wood to get the weight down.
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Old Sep 08, 2010, 05:32 AM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
I just did another test with the waterline actually marked on the hull and it seems i gained 100g of displacement to ballast her to the planned waterline the cool thing with these full hulls is that around the load waterline they are very full so you must add quite a lot of weight to get the hull deeper in the water.

I also just did a check on my GWS IQ-710BB Sailwinches, they are usually single turn winches and with an external servo stretcher i can reliably stretch them to 2 turns If i set the stretcher to a higher value the servo keeps spinning and looses its endpoint reliability. But 2 turns should be plenty for all i want do do with them.
They are 50g each and have 76Ncm torque, so plenty to move everything even if there is a bit of drag somewhere.. I`ll just have to make sure there is enough amperage coming out of the UBEC when both winches are running.
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Old Sep 08, 2010, 07:54 AM
Square-rigger
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Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
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some more drawings from Jimmy James
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Last edited by meatbomber; Sep 09, 2010 at 08:43 AM.
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Old Sep 21, 2010, 09:16 AM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
I finaly finished filling and sanding the hull. i`m pretty happy with teh final result Tho i have to say now in retrospect i should have not followed teh instructions so closely and cut a rabbet and bearding into teh false keel... now there is a bit of a step at plank termination.. oh well we count that as a lesson learned.
Now on wth the build. I`ve been looking for options for coppering teh hull and found a copper coated alu foil in a hobby shop. That one weights only 1/3rd of teh original coppering foil. I tried to scratch coating and found it very durable, so i`m trying with this now.
I built a tool to transfer the relief of the original copper plates onto the foil strips, which works pretty well and started then coppering along the keel.. this will be a pretty long job...
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Old Sep 24, 2010, 05:33 PM
Square-rigger
meatbomber's Avatar
Klatovy, Czech Republic
Joined Mar 2004
3,341 Posts
got some more done.. well not so much coppering but i got the hull painted and the wales installed.

i`m really happy with the hull so far.
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