HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Aug 14, 2012, 08:32 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,812 Posts
Today i defaulted my ESC's settings again! That seemed to even things out a little bit after i reprogrammed the throttle limits. I don't know maybe it was just all glitched up. So, the collective stick is feeling better and a lot of the revving has gone away. Tomorrow i will try and adjust the timing again and see if I can't smooth the whole thing out. /shrug


Quote:
Originally Posted by Heli Biggie View Post
I just put my orderin for the pheonix sim, i cant wait to fine tune my skills into something worth a dam lol. Finally real sim sticks , ...no sticks on ipad sim,
Awesome! The most frustrating thing about phoenix is setting up your TX so that all the controls operate properly. Once thats done right you can actually make new model data inside your TX for each virtual heli in the sim. If you wanted. I just use one basic one. But don't expect it to just work right away as is..

Well, here. To help you out so you don't have to hunt. Take a look at this post. It helped me get things running. http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...49&postcount=4

BUT! I might be able to do you one better. If you download THIS FILE. Then after installing phoenix. Copy that file into your windows "\Documents\PhoenixRC\Settings\mappingProfiles\Cus tom" folder. The custom TX profile should be available in phoenix when you go into the menu "system/your controls". You should see it right there on top. You should be able to just select it and go flying after setting up your TX like described in the above link. Not really sure... You might have to/want to go though calibration anyway.

It is a valuable learning tool. Not very entertaining though, so make yourself some lesson plans or something to actually follow to make it beneficial and entertaining. It does have some training modes for AR landings and things like that too. Kind of cool. Good luck!
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Aug 15, 2012, 06:03 AM
Semi Expert
iflyhelis's Avatar
United States, MA, Norton
Joined Aug 2012
281 Posts
You should be able to find a E-clip at either a RC store that carries RC cars & trucks, or at a good hardware store that has a selection of metric hardware.

I forget what transmitter you are using & I am a little confused when you are talking about using throttle port 1 & 2. You are mixing your throttle with your collective?

I have had my share of bad electrical connections causing crashes. It sucks!

Are you actually doing a mechanical adjustment to your motor timing, or are you doing this via the transmitter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
I know the head speed is too low, but with the problems i've had in the past i need to determine what the actual cause was. The problem seems to be weather or not the ESC's throttle limits are being set properly. If i use the throttle port #2 to set the limits the motor is way more powerful even with the lowest timing set on the ESC. Every time i fly it though, something would electronically fail and bring the heli down. About 10 times now actually. Some of that was my battery plug too though. I finally got the thing to make it though 5 packs by using the throttle 1 port. However, because of the RX's protections on TH1 port the esc does not enter programming mode using normal methods. You have to trick it by using the throttle hold switch. Once i set my limits that way, i was able to fly without any electronic failure. BUT with low head speed. Now i'm working my way up the motor timing to see if thats it or if the TH1 port's throttle limits are just not good enough. One way or the other it has something to do with either the timing or the ESC's throttle limits. I've gone over everything else. like 10+ times in rebuilds..... /sigh

For all i know the motor is shot anyway. The sound you hear is because the E clip on the motor was missing since i got the heli used. It might have came off at some point too, but i don't have another to replace it and can only find C clips as replacement. Still looking though. I'll probably just replace the whole motor before that happens. For now i have a brass bushing over the motor shaft to prevent the bearing from lifting under the torque. It just tends to make a little noise.
iflyhelis is offline Find More Posts by iflyhelis
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 15, 2012, 09:58 AM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,139 Posts
Thanks , i will look into all that when i get it. I need some real flying soon , im going crazy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
Today i defaulted my ESC's settings again! That seemed to even things out a little bit after i reprogrammed the throttle limits. I don't know maybe it was just all glitched up. So, the collective stick is feeling better and a lot of the revving has gone away. Tomorrow i will try and adjust the timing again and see if I can't smooth the whole thing out. /shrug




Awesome! The most frustrating thing about phoenix is setting up your TX so that all the controls operate properly. Once thats done right you can actually make new model data inside your TX for each virtual heli in the sim. If you wanted. I just use one basic one. But don't expect it to just work right away as is..

Well, here. To help you out so you don't have to hunt. Take a look at this post. It helped me get things running. http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...49&postcount=4

BUT! I might be able to do you one better. If you download THIS FILE. Then after installing phoenix. Copy that file into your windows "\Documents\PhoenixRC\Settings\mappingProfiles\Cus tom" folder. The custom TX profile should be available in phoenix when you go into the menu "system/your controls". You should see it right there on top. You should be able to just select it and go flying after setting up your TX like described in the above link. Not really sure... You might have to/want to go though calibration anyway.

It is a valuable learning tool. Not very entertaining though, so make yourself some lesson plans or something to actually follow to make it beneficial and entertaining. It does have some training modes for AR landings and things like that too. Kind of cool. Good luck!
Heli Biggie is offline Find More Posts by Heli Biggie
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 15, 2012, 06:40 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,812 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by iflyhelis View Post
You should be able to find a E-clip at either a RC store that carries RC cars & trucks, or at a good hardware store that has a selection of metric hardware.

I forget what transmitter you are using & I am a little confused when you are talking about using throttle port 1 & 2. You are mixing your throttle with your collective?

I have had my share of bad electrical connections causing crashes. It sucks!

Are you actually doing a mechanical adjustment to your motor timing, or are you doing this via the transmitter?
Oh that all has to do with the ESC and the RX. The RX has 2 throttle ports. Each with a different thresholds. The first port also has protections built in and the second port does not. So typically to get the ESC to enter programming mode, so that you can set your throttle limits, advanced timing and other options, you would have to use the second port. Then switch the throttle cable to the ESC back to the first port. When doing this previously i think it was over throttling the motor or something like that or possibly it was just glitched and set all wrong. This is what i'm trying to figure out. because the throttle and punch out was much stronger and the pitch response was better previously. But i kept geting failures no matter what "advanced timing" setting i was using on the ESC. Now it seems more stable and not failing as easily. So i think i got most of the "problems" solved. Now i just have to go back though and figure out what i did wrong. Then what the right settings are for the ESC's throttle limits and advanced timing. It's all quite fun for me. If i never crashed i wouldn't have anything to do when it gets dark and I'm bored! I'm not much for TV. I'd rather hit the "random article" button on wikipedia for a few hours. But when i have a heli to fix, thats fun too. But this v450 is wearing on my last nerve for a while now. I feel the end of the dark tunnel is near and the sun will warm my face once more! But until then i have to continue troubleshooting until i figure it all out in depth. Maybe when it's all said and done it will be worth it. Maybe not. Kind of stuck with it at this point
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 15, 2012, 09:21 PM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,139 Posts
I just painted my canopy. The red sucks. Added a few stickers and wala! Please enjoy. I also using new battery 2200 mah 40c turnigy. They are a bit heavy but it flys like a beast.


walkera v450d01 fresh painted canopy (5 min 46 sec)
Heli Biggie is offline Find More Posts by Heli Biggie
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 16, 2012, 07:49 AM
Semi Expert
iflyhelis's Avatar
United States, MA, Norton
Joined Aug 2012
281 Posts
You didn't tell me what transmitter & receiver you are using.

I am using the Devo 10 Tx & the 2703H=D RX they are different than what normally comes with the 450.

Mine doesn't list a throttle 2 on the receiver but the Tx does have control in airplane mode to control a twin engine plane separately for throttle hold? Why I don't know.

So I looked up the 8 channel Rx & found that throttle 2 is used for non-electric & doesn't have throttle protection. I take it that throt 1 is to prevent a over-speed on the electric motor? I didn't see anything referring to programing the ESC limits in the Tx or Rx manual, I'll have to look at the ESC manual & get back to you.

I once had a 3D airplane that the engine was inverted (never had inverted before) it caused me so much trouble running so rich the engine wouldn't stay lit. It turns out that the fuel tank was set too high (above center point of the carb.) so it pissed me off so much I quit flying. Don't let your heli do that to you, it will be figured out!


Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
Oh that all has to do with the ESC and the RX. The RX has 2 throttle ports. Each with a different thresholds. The first port also has protections built in and the second port does not. So typically to get the ESC to enter programming mode, so that you can set your throttle limits, advanced timing and other options, you would have to use the second port. Then switch the throttle cable to the ESC back to the first port. When doing this previously i think it was over throttling the motor or something like that or possibly it was just glitched and set all wrong. This is what i'm trying to figure out. because the throttle and punch out was much stronger and the pitch response was better previously. But i kept geting failures no matter what "advanced timing" setting i was using on the ESC. Now it seems more stable and not failing as easily. So i think i got most of the "problems" solved. Now i just have to go back though and figure out what i did wrong. Then what the right settings are for the ESC's throttle limits and advanced timing. It's all quite fun for me. If i never crashed i wouldn't have anything to do when it gets dark and I'm bored! I'm not much for TV. I'd rather hit the "random article" button on wikipedia for a few hours. But when i have a heli to fix, thats fun too. But this v450 is wearing on my last nerve for a while now. I feel the end of the dark tunnel is near and the sun will warm my face once more! But until then i have to continue troubleshooting until i figure it all out in depth. Maybe when it's all said and done it will be worth it. Maybe not. Kind of stuck with it at this point
iflyhelis is offline Find More Posts by iflyhelis
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 16, 2012, 09:32 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,812 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by iflyhelis View Post
You didn't tell me what transmitter & receiver you are using.

I am using the Devo 10 Tx & the 2703H=D RX they are different than what normally comes with the 450.

Mine doesn't list a throttle 2 on the receiver but the Tx does have control in airplane mode to control a twin engine plane separately for throttle hold? Why I don't know.

So I looked up the 8 channel Rx & found that throttle 2 is used for non-electric & doesn't have throttle protection. I take it that throt 1 is to prevent a over-speed on the electric motor? I didn't see anything referring to programing the ESC limits in the Tx or Rx manual, I'll have to look at the ESC manual & get back to you.

I once had a 3D airplane that the engine was inverted (never had inverted before) it caused me so much trouble running so rich the engine wouldn't stay lit. It turns out that the fuel tank was set too high (above center point of the carb.) so it pissed me off so much I quit flying. Don't let your heli do that to you, it will be figured out!

Yeah, sorry. It's the 2801-pro TX and the 2702V RX. The ESC is a Hobbywing Platinum Pro 40A. The motor is a Turbo Ace 804. I'm pretty sure i got it figured out now. I plugged the WK stock ESC back in to help me "remember" how this turbo ace motor feels with the stock ESC. Also to make sure it's not a motor issue causing the weird over revving. The heli flew nice and smooth with that ESC. I determined that my ESC was set pretty well with the timing and the over all ESC programming. So i went ahead and went through the throttle limit setting using the TH1 port and the throttle hold switch to negate the protection features on the #1 port of my RX. I was still feeling like the "punchout" or pitch up was feeling soft. Well, i figured out that a lot of that was my fear of flying in a enclosed area with trees over hanging above me. Also, the fiberglass blades are in fact flexing under the higher rotor speed and causing a slight delay in the "pop" in pitch up motion. I put the stock CF blades back on and the pitch was a lot better. But i put the $7 blades back on. Waiting for my test flight packs to charge and i'm going to the field. Wish me luck! I think i got it now.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 16, 2012, 09:51 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,812 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heli Biggie View Post
I just painted my canopy. The red sucks. Added a few stickers and wala! Please enjoy. I also using new battery 2200 mah 40c turnigy. They are a bit heavy but it flys like a beast.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSTfq...e_gdata_player

Nice flying. I can't wait for the day when i can trust the v450d01 enough to fly it like that! hopefully i have the electrical issues sorted out now though!

The canopy looks good too! As you know i've done my fair share of painting canopies. I noticed a little bit of bleed under your tape where you masked off the canopy "cockpit" or whatever. Masking tape always seems to have little cracks and pockets that the paint bleeds into. Next time try a good vinyl electric tape. It seals better to the plastic of the canopy, and is especially useful on rounded surfaces because it can be lightly stretched to shape. The masking tape will ripple, making pockets for the paint to bleed into. Otherwise you can also wipe it of within the first 7 hours. I usually wait about 7 days for the paint to fully cure and harden before i use them too. That way it won't chip off as easy. But that really is more useful for the skids because they make contact with the ground and receive impacts that can crack and chip the paint. But the same can be said for the flexibility of the canopy while putting it on and taking it off. Anyway, hope this helps you on your next painting endeavor.

Edit:
Oh yeah, if the electric tape leaves black residue behind from the glue. Wait for the paint to dry then use a little alcohol to remove the black tape's glue. Some tapes do this, others no so bad.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 16, 2012, 06:50 PM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,139 Posts
Thanks so much, i am using ur profile right now, but my is about the same l

How doi set up throttle hold . And st1 and st2
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
Today i defaulted my ESC's settings again! That seemed to even things out a little bit after i reprogrammed the throttle limits. I don't know maybe it was just all glitched up. So, the collective stick is feeling better and a lot of the revving has gone away. Tomorrow i will try and adjust the timing again and see if I can't smooth the whole thing out. /shrug




Awesome! The most frustrating thing about phoenix is setting up your TX so that all the controls operate properly. Once thats done right you can actually make new model data inside your TX for each virtual heli in the sim. If you wanted. I just use one basic one. But don't expect it to just work right away as is..

Well, here. To help you out so you don't have to hunt. Take a look at this post. It helped me get things running. http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...49&postcount=4

BUT! I might be able to do you one better. If you download THIS FILE. Then after installing phoenix. Copy that file into your windows "\Documents\PhoenixRC\Settings\mappingProfiles\Cus tom" folder. The custom TX profile should be available in phoenix when you go into the menu "system/your controls". You should see it right there on top. You should be able to just select it and go flying after setting up your TX like described in the above link. Not really sure... You might have to/want to go though calibration anyway.

It is a valuable learning tool. Not very entertaining though, so make yourself some lesson plans or something to actually follow to make it beneficial and entertaining. It does have some training modes for AR landings and things like that too. Kind of cool. Good luck!
Heli Biggie is offline Find More Posts by Heli Biggie
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 16, 2012, 09:04 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,812 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heli Biggie View Post
Thanks so much, i am using ur profile right now, but my is about the same l

How doi set up throttle hold . And st1 and st2
For phoenix? Really however you like them to feel. But read over this thread again:

http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...49&postcount=4

Quote:
Enter the 2801 menu again and select MDSET.
Go to GYRHLD->THROHOLD. Change it from INT to ACT. Change HOLD Pos. to 0%. Press ext when done.
That takes care of the throttle hold function. Now for the curves, starting with throttle.
Make sure you're still in the MDSET menu.
Select CURVES->THRCURVE. Use up/down to move between the points and curves. Each curve has 5 points; L 1 2 3 H. L indicates the lowest position of the stick, up to H which is the highest position. Moving past these points will switch you to the next curve.
There are three curves; NORM, ST-1, ST-2. Make sure you are editing NORM.
Set the values for the points as follows- L:0%,1:75%, 2:100%, 3:100% ,H:100%.
For curve ST-1, set all the points to 100%.
For curve ST-2, set all the points to 100%.
Look through the values again to check everything is right. Press ext to finish.
And finally, the pitch curve.
Make sure you're still in the MDSET menu.
Select CURVES->PITCURVE. Move around the points and curves the same way. This time you have an extra curve (HOLD) and as before 5 points per curve.
Start as before with the NORM. Set the values as follows- L:46%, 1:48%, 2:50%, 3:75%, H:100%.
For curve ST-1, the values are- L:0%, 1:25%, 2:50%, 3:75%, H:100%.
For curve ST-2, the values are- L:0%, 1:25%, 2:50%, 3:75%, H:100%.
For curve HOLD, the values are- L:0%, 1:25%, 2:50%, 3:75%, H:100%.
ST-1, ST-2 and HOLD probably already had the correct values by default, but double-check the values of all the curves to be sure.
Everything else should be okay. We should be ready to fly a heli now. We just need to map the channels in Phoenix.
In Phoenix, go to System->Your Controls. In the "custom" list should be the one you set up in your previous calibration. Select it and press "Edit Profile".
Select the "Detailed" button.
In "General", map "Throttle to "Controller channel 3".
In "Helicopters", map "Collective pitch" to "Controller channel 6".
Map "Cyclic pitch" to "Controller Channel 1" and check the "Invert" box.
Map "Cyclic roll" to "Controller Channel 2" and check the "Invert" box.
Map "Tail Rotor" to "Controller Channel 4" and check the "Invert" box.
And you should be good to go. Don't worry about mapping the Throttle-hold and Idle-up controls, you don't need to as they're programmed into the controller now. Should you need to calibrate the controller again at some point, select an empty slot on the 2801 and go as far as the calibration part of this rather long list. Once you calibrate Phoenix, you can switch back to your 2801's proper profile.
It tells you how to set the TX up for phoenix.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17, 2012, 06:34 AM
Semi Expert
iflyhelis's Avatar
United States, MA, Norton
Joined Aug 2012
281 Posts
I forget where I read it, but! It said you can not use a Walkera receiver & not use a Walkera ESC. It said they would not interact together properly.

Also, when I told you rotor head speed of 2800 R.P.M max, that was for carbon fiber blades only. I don't know what the max is on fiberglass blades.

Different subject: I got my heli back yesterday, Tx antenna got broken in shipment/they sent me the wrong power cord (220 volt) for the charger. Also the battery charging cord/adapter has a open circuit in it so I can only charge one battery instead of 3 batteries at once.

I did one flight with it all of about 3-4 mins. before the motor started to slow down, it was almost like it was on rails, a couple of trim clicks & it was hovering with no hands. So beside the fore/aft pitch servo being wanged, I noticed that they changed out the receiver too. Now this thing does un-balance compensation like it is supposed to do.

It was nice to fly a heli again, it has been 7 years since last time that I flew, & I didn't have one problem flying again, just like riding a bike again.



Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
Yeah, sorry. It's the 2801-pro TX and the 2702V RX. The ESC is a Hobbywing Platinum Pro 40A. The motor is a Turbo Ace 804. I'm pretty sure i got it figured out now. I plugged the WK stock ESC back in to help me "remember" how this turbo ace motor feels with the stock ESC. Also to make sure it's not a motor issue causing the weird over revving. The heli flew nice and smooth with that ESC. I determined that my ESC was set pretty well with the timing and the over all ESC programming. So i went ahead and went through the throttle limit setting using the TH1 port and the throttle hold switch to negate the protection features on the #1 port of my RX. I was still feeling like the "punchout" or pitch up was feeling soft. Well, i figured out that a lot of that was my fear of flying in a enclosed area with trees over hanging above me. Also, the fiberglass blades are in fact flexing under the higher rotor speed and causing a slight delay in the "pop" in pitch up motion. I put the stock CF blades back on and the pitch was a lot better. But i put the $7 blades back on. Waiting for my test flight packs to charge and i'm going to the field. Wish me luck! I think i got it now.
iflyhelis is offline Find More Posts by iflyhelis
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17, 2012, 08:21 AM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,139 Posts
Thats good to hear , now for some video
Heli Biggie is offline Find More Posts by Heli Biggie
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17, 2012, 11:04 AM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,139 Posts
I have set it up word for word but setting ch 3 on throttle doesnt work , what am i doing wrong , i set it to 6 and it works , what am i missing ,


On my v400 , it lost power at 40 feet up. Then the motor and was twitching with something beeping. And thats my # 1 heli.
.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
For phoenix? Really however you like them to feel. But read over this thread again:

http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...49&postcount=4



It tells you how to set the TX up for phoenix.
Heli Biggie is offline Find More Posts by Heli Biggie
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17, 2012, 05:00 PM
Team WarpSquad
Japan, Tokyo
Joined Jun 2011
2,786 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heli Biggie View Post
I have set it up word for word but setting ch 3 on throttle doesnt work , what am i doing wrong , i set it to 6 and it works , what am i missing
.
when you select the channels in controller setup of Phoenix you can see the levels of all the channels after you click the drop down.
thwaitm is offline Find More Posts by thwaitm
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17, 2012, 08:20 PM
Registered User
Apphoard's Avatar
Joined Mar 2011
462 Posts
I didn't have much of a problem setting up the 2801 with Phoenix. But it was over a year ago. If you keep having problems I will try to figure out what I did.
Apphoard is offline Find More Posts by Apphoard
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wanted Walkera 400d or Walkera Brushless Cb100 or Heli max 6 channel heli blueindian Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 Jul 07, 2010 08:03 PM
Discussion Walkera 4#6 or Walkera 4#6s? red_storm Micro Helis 8 Jul 07, 2010 12:17 AM
Discussion Upgrade my Walkera 4#3B or just get a Walkera 4#6? tumble2k Micro Helis 7 Mar 26, 2010 07:30 PM
For Sale Walkera 68 & Walkera 36 Parts bretware Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 Aug 29, 2009 05:23 PM
Wanted Walkera Lama2 or Walkera 5G6-1 night_life Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 2 Aug 27, 2009 04:20 AM