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Old Apr 25, 2012, 07:51 AM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
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United States, PA, Philadelphia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
Soooo, my 450 is marked for delivery. should have it soon and have to charge up and give it a once over. But do you think i should attempt my first flight in these conditions: http://www.checkthesock.com/rc_airfi...-aero-modelers

Its been like this for months and this is kind of why i wanted a 450.


EDIT:

ITS HERE! A quick look over and things appear in order. there appears to be loc tite on some of the screws and what not. I have not checked them yet though. I'm not sure if the ESC is stock or not, but new connectors have been soldered onto the ESC and batteries so thats good i guess. Overall for $470 shipped, this is freaking awesome! The blades don't even have scuffs on them and the only real damage i could find are some scratches on the front of the landing skids. The tail slider arm appears to maybe have some damage from a previous crash or repairs. The plastic looks a little warped to me. I will have to see how everything behaves. Todays wind is gusting up to 32mph though so maybe another time. I might strap it to a cinder block and give it a test spool up though. Something odd i noticed is that the TX reverse is set for channel 1, 4 and 6. The setup guide from wow hobbies says 2 and 4 should be. I'll have to go though when the batteries are charged and check things out. I'll check back later.


Update:

Well it passed the strap down test so after every thing was charged i took it out to the field. The first pack it flew nice. I just kept it in a tail in hover with some side in passes and slow turns. It flew beautifully. Very smooth and lots and lots of power. After the first pack i checked the motor and it was cool to the touch like it had not even been running. So i waited a minute and strapped in one of the turnigy 2.2 packs. Got my battery alarm installed and put the canopy back on. I suppose i didn't wait long enough because shortly after lift off on the second pack i began to loose lift. I set the helicopter down and unplugged the battery. Rebound the heli and tried again. This time i didn't even get to lift off. The ESC was just smoking. Lovely.
That ESC in the pic on your V looks like the Exceeed 60A/5v/3A switched, same as hobbywing. I had one on my V450 and it was a great ESC with tons of power for a 450 and also ran very cool. It was heavy though so I found best placement for COG was right under the battery tray. Sorry to hear it smoked, and thwaitm is correct in saying the stock servos could cause all kinds of power issues. If one of them decides to check out, it will take the whole heli down electrically because they basically dead short the power bus.

This causes the BEC on the ESC to short internally and get very very hot and eventually burn out if not unplugged. The good thing is Walkera at least designed the RX with protective circuitry so it doesnt get effected by a short. I suppose so its not a total loss and to keep the hobbyist on the parts merry-go-round, because we all know the money is in the parts after the sale.........Anyway, I had it happen on 4 Wk 08/09 Stock cyclic servos and a stock tail servo, the last time, it was the tail servo and it overheated the BEC until it shutdown. Hence all the upgrades

I cant be botherd flying a heli i have to second guess all the time, and unless you get very lucky thats what the V450 is all stock. I just never know when one of the various components was gonna fail. Funny thing is I got all the joke electronics out of the bird and go to spool up the other day and she throws a blade grip link........I put er back in the closet until I get a new set of links
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 07:45 PM
They call me plan B
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United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
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Calling all charlotte nc flyers!

Im headed to charlotte nc in the morning and trying to get a meet and fly going ,
Anyone in that area?? Hit me up.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 10:12 PM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
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United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
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Align DS520 Tail Servo for the V450 for sale - Drop in fit.
See post;
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1640415
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 10:32 PM
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
That ESC in the pic on your V looks like the Exceeed 60A/5v/3A switched, same as hobbywing. I had one on my V450 and it was a great ESC with tons of power for a 450 and also ran very cool. It was heavy though so I found best placement for COG was right under the battery tray. Sorry to hear it smoked, and thwaitm is correct in saying the stock servos could cause all kinds of power issues. If one of them decides to check out, it will take the whole heli down electrically because they basically dead short the power bus.

This causes the BEC on the ESC to short internally and get very very hot and eventually burn out if not unplugged. The good thing is Walkera at least designed the RX with protective circuitry so it doesnt get effected by a short. I suppose so its not a total loss and to keep the hobbyist on the parts merry-go-round, because we all know the money is in the parts after the sale.........Anyway, I had it happen on 4 Wk 08/09 Stock cyclic servos and a stock tail servo, the last time, it was the tail servo and it overheated the BEC until it shutdown. Hence all the upgrades

I cant be botherd flying a heli i have to second guess all the time, and unless you get very lucky thats what the V450 is all stock. I just never know when one of the various components was gonna fail. Funny thing is I got all the joke electronics out of the bird and go to spool up the other day and she throws a blade grip link........I put er back in the closet until I get a new set of links
I'm pretty sure that failing components is a regular with all helicopters, just more so with the stock walkera parts i guess. SOO now that you mention it about the servos. They are probably what keeps causing the brownouts on my 4f200. Also I watched my video from the first hover of the v450. I now remember it had an issue, maybe. I think because i bound the TX in throttle hold mode, maybe. But for whatever reason when i shut off throttle hold the heli would spin up. the stunt switch was on normal too. I had to rebind and it was fine. Also my tail servo is making a lot of noise, pretty much all the time. Sounds like static. I wonder if the 30 mph winds helped burn the ESC thing out. oh well. The one other thing that may have contributed to the burn out was me waiting for my battery alarm to go off on the helicopter. I had the alarm set at it's default 3.3 v so i completely over discharged the batteries to 3.68ish. I should have noticed the head speed dropping sooner but i was so excited my heart was racing. I have a video uploaded but the player (usually) will only work in Firefox or opera browsers. for some reason Internet explorer does not always show the actual player. I updated the player and changed some things so maybe it will work now. I just checked it in IE, it's a little slow loading the files but appears to be working now. Video is of course in the v450 section:

http://integrityhandiwork.com/ebay/Heli%20Fleet/

Since it's probably not good my tail servo is sounding like this i'd love to buy that tail servo. Too bad i'm completely broke after buying a new heli and having to get a new ESC already + parts for my 4f200. Poor timing, but if its still around later I'll check into it.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 10:47 PM
Team WarpSquad
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For the TX THHOLD issue, you have to make sure that the minimum throttle in NORM+BOTTOM STICK is the same as THHOLD. If not, the ESC recalibrates it's bottom point and spins up and then you have to jump on your heli and unplug... which isn't much fun with a 450!
User the MONITOR function in the TX to check it - no need to have the heli on at all until you're ready to test and that's best done with: the blades off, motor backed away from the main gear, or motor wires reversed and an un-jammed AR bearing.

The tail servo does twitch in HH, in RATE it should be quiet but do check that the rudder travel limits are setup correctly - that should save it from burning out prematurely in flight.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 11:19 PM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
HeliFlyer711's Avatar
United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
I'm pretty sure that failing components is a regular with all helicopters, just more so with the stock walkera parts i guess. SOO now that you mention it about the servos. They are probably what keeps causing the brownouts on my 4f200. Also I watched my video from the first hover of the v450. I now remember it had an issue, maybe. I think because i bound the TX in throttle hold mode, maybe. But for whatever reason when i shut off throttle hold the heli would spin up. the stunt switch was on normal too. I had to rebind and it was fine. Also my tail servo is making a lot of noise, pretty much all the time. Sounds like static. I wonder if the 30 mph winds helped burn the ESC thing out. oh well. The one other thing that may have contributed to the burn out was me waiting for my battery alarm to go off on the helicopter. I had the alarm set at it's default 3.3 v so i completely over discharged the batteries to 3.68ish. I should have noticed the head speed dropping sooner but i was so excited my heart was racing. I have a video uploaded but the player (usually) will only work in Firefox or opera browsers. for some reason Internet explorer does not always show the actual player. I updated the player and changed some things so maybe it will work now. I just checked it in IE, it's a little slow loading the files but appears to be working now. Video is of course in the v450 section:

http://integrityhandiwork.com/ebay/Heli%20Fleet/

Since it's probably not good my tail servo is sounding like this i'd love to buy that tail servo. Too bad i'm completely broke after buying a new heli and having to get a new ESC already + parts for my 4f200. Poor timing, but if its still around later I'll check into it.
You have a point! Well I hope my realism doesnt come off as negativity because thats not the intention. Of course I wish no one in this hobby ever had another problem or a crash. Believe or not the mid-grade and definately the high end stuff is pretty reliable. Walkera makes a good micro and the V450 is decent but the electronics suck lemons LOL

To me at this point in the game Im looking for a heli I can put in a case on sat morn take it to the field and fly it. Not having any weird issues, wobbles, overheats you know consistancy and I think thats what were all after. Biggie did the right thing and went with a 600 ESP runs on 12S is a real screamer and decent quality. Im surprised he hasnt commented on the night and day difference between it and the V450 and again believe or not the T600 ESP is just the beginning of the good stuff thats out there, you have the protos, Logo's, TDR's and SAB with the Goblin now. But thats a lot of money and if your just a weekender maybe not justified. My opinion of Walkera comes from flying thier micros for awhile starting with the 4G3 and some of the things they do as a company on a whole and how it has effects on us as consumers. With Walkera its like getting a crash course in heli repair, but you know some guys just like to fly and arent interested in the best flying heli, as long as it fly's and thats a good way to be too. if its not broke dont fix it

I like to tinker though so I usually have to work it out, and try to do it as economically as possible as it can be an expensive hobby. If you want I can hold the servo for you for a little while, but for the stock servo it is normal for it to be noisy.....the reason is because it doesnt have a tight deadband and is hunting, but this doesnt effect performance. The DS520 is as quiet as a mouse on the V450.
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 02:50 AM
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
You have a point! Well I hope my realism doesnt come off as negativity because thats not the intention. Of course I wish no one in this hobby ever had another problem or a crash. Believe or not the mid-grade and definately the high end stuff is pretty reliable. Walkera makes a good micro and the V450 is decent but the electronics suck lemons LOL

To me at this point in the game Im looking for a heli I can put in a case on sat morn take it to the field and fly it. Not having any weird issues, wobbles, overheats you know consistancy and I think thats what were all after. Biggie did the right thing and went with a 600 ESP runs on 12S is a real screamer and decent quality. Im surprised he hasnt commented on the night and day difference between it and the V450 and again believe or not the T600 ESP is just the beginning of the good stuff thats out there, you have the protos, Logo's, TDR's and SAB with the Goblin now. But thats a lot of money and if your just a weekender maybe not justified. My opinion of Walkera comes from flying thier micros for awhile starting with the 4G3 and some of the things they do as a company on a whole and how it has effects on us as consumers. With Walkera its like getting a crash course in heli repair, but you know some guys just like to fly and arent interested in the best flying heli, as long as it fly's and thats a good way to be too. if its not broke dont fix it

I like to tinker though so I usually have to work it out, and try to do it as economically as possible as it can be an expensive hobby. If you want I can hold the servo for you for a little while, but for the stock servo it is normal for it to be noisy.....the reason is because it doesnt have a tight deadband and is hunting, but this doesnt effect performance. The DS520 is as quiet as a mouse on the V450.
Yeah, on the smaller servos like on my v120d02S and v120d05 the servos develop this jitter and start making this noise because of a crappy potentiometer that develops play in it. I have not taken anything apart on this helicopter yet. I was hoping to get a few flights out of it before having to dive into work. I think thats why people buy walkera. Besides the fact that one could naturally assume that since align and others use Walkera RX and Gyros for their builds, that maybe walkera is good. They have gotten better in just the last few years apparently but i guess still far off on their QC and their servos just suck.

The sad fact is that the ESC on the v450 and the ESC on my 4f200 both have had issues, most likely due to servo loads. On my 4f200 for instance 2 noisy servos that worked perfectly created enough of a load to overload the 2a BEC and crash my heli. If it had a 3A or higher BEC this would probably not have been an issue. I don't know about the BEC that came on my v450's ESC but it is very possible this tail servo's hunting created a increased load. Only time will tell. Hopefully it was just bad luck and it was time for my ESC to fry.

Anyway i don't really want a helicopter bigger than a 450, though the goblin has grabbed my attention and really is not that expensive either. But 700 is just a little too big for the areas I will be flying in. Plus i don't really want to have to spend just as much on 4 batteries as i did for my whole helicopter. But i guess thats just typical of any electric now.

About the tail servo, i have no idea when i'll have money again, or if i'll be replacing this one yet. Its a time game at this point. I might just get the Fusonic MG-D-9257 Version 2: that wow hobbies sells. Its only $20 and metal geared.
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 12:25 PM
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anyone know anything about Dynam Dentum ESCs? hobbypartz.com carries them and I am thinking about getting a 40a or 50a one of these with a 3a BEC for my 450 and a 30a one also with 3a bec for my 4f200. Are they any good?
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 03:01 PM
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Joined Oct 2009
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Detrum makes all kinds of economy heli electronics, Gyro's, ESC's Servo's and even motors I think. They come on RTF heli's so its basically a lateral move IMHO and not really an upgrade. Hobbywing/Exceed puts out a good ESC with a decent price, for a 450 with the 500w motorlike you have, I'd go with a 50-60A ESC and 3A switched BEC. This way the ESC isnt stressed and has some headroom. Typical hovering only pulls 30A at the most, its when you get into the full punchouts that you can peak 40+A.

Check the Classifieds a lot of guys sell name brand stuff at close to 1/2 the cost and if it hasnt been abused its a great deal.
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 05:08 PM
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
Detrum makes all kinds of economy heli electronics, Gyro's, ESC's Servo's and even motors I think. They come on RTF heli's so its basically a lateral move IMHO and not really an upgrade. Hobbywing/Exceed puts out a good ESC with a decent price, for a 450 with the 500w motorlike you have, I'd go with a 50-60A ESC and 3A switched BEC. This way the ESC isnt stressed and has some headroom. Typical hovering only pulls 30A at the most, its when you get into the full punchouts that you can peak 40+A.

Check the Classifieds a lot of guys sell name brand stuff at close to 1/2 the cost and if it hasnt been abused its a great deal.
Well on my 4f200 i suppose one of these would be fine. I just want a 3A BEC to give the servos more headroom so to say. I don't know if Dentrum are switched mode BEC, probably not. But i can't find any ESC with a 3A BEC, especially switched, lower than a 40A. I think that might be a bit much for the 4f200 to spend. So i might try one of these.

As for the v450, I'm waiting for the stock ESC to arrive tomorrow. I will just be praying that it does not burn out on me also. If it does i suppose i have a bigger problem I need to track down. I'll cross that bridge when i get there. But hopefully it will be fine and the ESC that came on the helicopter was already used too much and it was just bad luck for me. I hope. When I can afford to i will probably get an exceed or hobbywing ESC. I kind of want one with a cooling plate to mount under the battery. I have so much room under there and though I have not gone over this heli much, I'm pretty sure it could use some extra weight up front. The 4f200 and v120d05 are both tail heavy as well. I guess its just normal for belt drive helicopters from Walkera to not have proper "all up" CG.

When my ESC burned out I had the suspicion that the Turnigy 11.1v 2.2Ah (2200mAh) might have caused the burn out. Since i flew on the stock battery fine. But that just can't be possible, can it? Each cell on the battery read a proper voltage and the pack seemed new, or very new as the seller advertised. I think i just had bad luck. Its just the way it is. My maiden flights are always ok, its the next one or the one after that the failure comes.

Here are some pictures of what is left of my burned out ESC. Its not labeled so I am still unsure of the brand. I will be keeping it for the capacitors and wires. The rest of the components are pretty much fried. My next ESC will have a custom extruded aluminum cooling plate. Probably minus the 12v fan
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 09:10 AM
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My V450 kept burning up the Esc when it first arrived it ended up being the pro motor wow put on. They sent me all new stuff and it's been fine.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 10:53 AM
"Watch this!.... Oh crap"
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United States, FL, Seminole
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Originally Posted by Apphoard View Post
My V450 kept burning up the Esc when it first arrived it ended up being the pro motor wow put on. They sent me all new stuff and it's been fine.
I had same issue, im now with a 35a Align esc and i love it, light, cool, soft start. WOW didnt do much testing on these pro versions, they shoulda known the turbo ace and the stock walkera ESC would be a bad match...

Additional note, posted some pics of my v450d01 FPV setup a while back, made some mods to it that lighted my weight by 60-70g and im now using immersionRC / fatshark on all my helies, FOXTech is crap in my book now.

HD video recorded onboard via the GoPro which also sends a live feed to the TX, love this one camera setup for FPV and DVR.



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Old Apr 27, 2012, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Apphoard View Post
My V450 kept burning up the Esc when it first arrived it ended up being the pro motor wow put on. They sent me all new stuff and it's been fine.
This is what I have been afraid of. Except I didn't buy it direct from wowhobbies. I bought it used on ebay. Since wow hobbies would not EXCHANGE my 4g6 tail drive gears i purchased from them (x5, still for sale if anyone needs) for the v120d02S gears i needed since these are not compatible. I some how doubt they will give me any support on this used helicopter. Mostly because they have no way to know it's one of their models or when it was purchased. It would be wonderful for them to give me some support since regardless of where i got my 450 i have spent around $2500+ in their store in the last few months. One would think good business practice would be to give some support anyway. But even if they did, i still doubt they will replace the motor or upgrade the ESC for me. Even more of a problem still they are out of stock. FARTHER adding to my problems is that i don't have a pinion puller/setter so even if i could buy a new one I can't exchange the pinion without possible damage. According to them this motor is better than the align motor, and it's self cooled? We'll see what happens. With any luck the new ESC will be here within the next few hours and i can fly later this afternoon.

EDIT:
Looking at the motor and pinion there is a set screw. Are these also pressed on like the smaller motors? or is the set screw solely relied upon for motor shaft traction to the pinion?
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 11:01 AM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
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Joined Oct 2009
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What kind of skids are those, I like the white contrast to the black frame........Details?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhebbel View Post
I had same issue, im now with a 35a Align esc and i love it, light, cool, soft start. WOW didnt do much testing on these pro versions, they shoulda known the turbo ace and the stock walkera ESC would be a bad match...

Additional note, posted some pics of my v450d01 FPV setup a while back, made some mods to it that lighted my weight by 60-70g and im now using immersionRC / fatshark on all my helies, FOXTech is crap in my book now.

HD video recorded onboard via the GoPro which also sends a live feed to the TX, love this one camera setup for FPV and DVR.



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Old Apr 27, 2012, 11:04 AM
"Watch this!.... Oh crap"
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United States, FL, Seminole
Joined Jan 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
This is what I have been afraid of. Except I didn't buy it direct from wowhobbies. I bought it used on ebay. Since wow hobbies would not EXCHANGE my 4g6 tail drive gears i purchased from them (x5, still for sale if anyone needs) for the v120d02S gears i needed since these are not compatible. I some how doubt they will give me any support on this used helicopter. Mostly because they have no way to know it's one of their models or when it was purchased. It would be wonderful for them to give me some support since regardless of where i got my 450 i have spent around $2500+ in their store in the last 2 months. One would think good business practice would be to give some support anyway. But even if they did, i still doubt they will replace the motor for me. Even more of a problem still they are out of stock. FARTHER adding to my problems is that i don't have a pinion puller/setter so even if i could buy a new one I can't exchange the pinion without possible damage. According to them this motor is better than the align motor, and it's self cooled? We'll see what happens. With any luck the new ESC will be here within the next few hours and i can fly later this afternoon.
when i reported my Turbo ace/ESC issued with them and told them it burnt up my ESC they offered to send me a new one but i declined and went with a better brand name anyway. avoid the walkera esc at all costs, dont want to risk your entire heli over a easy to replace part like an esc...
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