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Old Nov 20, 2011, 12:25 AM
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Robart reminds me of a company run by old fashioned people, slow to learn. They are way behind the curve and always will be. The present electric market will blow them away, mark my words.

They wasted their money, they should have just taken what they had and retired.

Lov, send them a message...they are too late, the train left the station.
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Old Nov 20, 2011, 01:27 AM
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I don't know anyone in the company at all. I just know the guy that developed the electronics for it, then Robart bought the rights to the electronics off him, so they could modify their existing retract line from air to electric. so bsaically, they aren't going to be any different than what you may already have. they'll simply have an electric actuator, instead of an air actuator. wonder if they plan on selling the electric actuator only, so you can mod your own retracts if you've got the air version? should be interesting.
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Old Nov 20, 2011, 01:51 AM
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Makes total sense and I was hoping they would have done this. Its much like what Lado has done but it only works with some. If Robart did this for their primary line up and don't price them in silly country since the market price has come down..... this could be a good thing. Air retract designs are more sturdy. I could get my Tucano back on her legs
And it could mean we get a good linear actuator to boot for swing wings and flaps and such.......
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Old Nov 20, 2011, 01:59 AM
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the problem with a linear actuator in this form, is that it isn't positionable. it's either in or out, no inbetweens. that's kindof a problem for flaps. LOL. if your plane's wing is big enough, you could do a servo activated, sliding assembly with micro switches. the sliding assembly would make the linear actuator positionable. just an idea floating around in my brain. LOL.

of course, another option is to make the actuator with a stepper motor instead and that would be totally positionable, without going to any extra trouble to make it work.

as far as the retracts, I wasn't told too much, but from the hints I received, it sounds like how I described it above and would make perfect sense from a business standpoint. I can't see them making a whole new line, when they can mod what they already have. he went very hush hush after they bought him out. he was forced into silence by the company. guess I'll be making a phone call pretty soon. LOL.
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Old Nov 21, 2011, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by LuvEvolution7 View Post
the problem with a linear actuator in this form, is that it isn't positionable. it's either in or out, no inbetweens. that's kindof a problem for flaps. LOL. if your plane's wing is big enough, you could do a servo activated, sliding assembly with micro switches. the sliding assembly would make the linear actuator positionable. just an idea floating around in my brain. LOL.

of course, another option is to make the actuator with a stepper motor instead and that would be totally positionable, without going to any extra trouble to make it work.

as far as the retracts, I wasn't told too much, but from the hints I received, it sounds like how I described it above and would make perfect sense from a business standpoint. I can't see them making a whole new line, when they can mod what they already have. he went very hush hush after they bought him out. he was forced into silence by the company. guess I'll be making a phone call pretty soon. LOL.
So is he censured from making a controller circuit to position it like a servo? You should ask him or have him suggest he talk to Robart to make it as an add on. I think they would profit from it if they did.
Ultimately I'd like to see them use a hollow motor shaft so you could add a 2mm continuous threaded rod of desired length and timing much like you see in many sequencers. In fact the sequencer circuit should actually work as is to achieved desired positions.
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Old Nov 21, 2011, 06:41 PM
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I don't see why a circuit board could not be made to make it work like a POT in a servo. could the guts of a servo be made to work, I wonder? I mean, essentially, a servo is basically the same as the linear actuator in a e-retract, but uses the POT to give feedback for position. I would imagine the guts could be used to control this actuator in the same manner. we need an electronic guru to chime in here to see if it's an option.

I will ask him though.
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Old Nov 21, 2011, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by SCALEFAN View Post
Robart reminds me of a company run by old fashioned people, slow to learn. They are way behind the curve and always will be. The present electric market will blow them away, mark my words.

They wasted their money, they should have just taken what they had and retired.

Lov, send them a message...they are too late, the train left the station.
Don't kid yourself. The Robart gear will be good stuff. Just because they waited till someone else did all the development doesn't mean they are behind the curve. Your nuts if you think they are going to get left behind. Sorry you're butthurt over it, eat some ice cream.
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Old Nov 22, 2011, 09:37 AM
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Don't kid yourself. The Robart gear will be good stuff. Just because they waited till someone else did all the development doesn't mean they are behind the curve. Your nuts if you think they are going to get left behind. Sorry you're butthurt over it, eat some ice cream.
Wow pretty rough there. I have to disagree with you. While Robart was the "leader" for some time they did drop the ball on getting into the electric market. There's so much competition there now and most have found a supplier that fulfills their needs. Most will stick with what they know and trust rather than jumping on the Robarts because of the name. I also doubt they can hit the necessary price point to really be a player on this.
Mike
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Old Nov 22, 2011, 09:46 AM
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B; did you note the part where they had to hire an electronics expert to develop something for them. What was really happening there is they were losing pneumatic sales to all the new generation of electrics. JR was top of the world to many also and the 2.4 came along and they had to partner with Spektrum and 3 years later many are still wondering what JR is up to.

Robart was a standard at one point but they plateaued for sometime and rather than leading the new development they went quiet to see if it would stick. The result is with these other options now in the market, they have a struggle to justify their old market prices. Lets face it great stuff but very expensive. I now buy as good and better for 1/2 the price or less and not from them anymore. So Scalefan wasn't entirely off the reservation, but neither are you.
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Old Nov 22, 2011, 05:24 PM
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well, I mean, let's face it, Robart have been a little slow to get to the plate. you can't hit a home run, unless you make it to the plate in the first place. here's my take on this................

we can all agree to some extent or another, that the shortcomings of many e-retracts, is the durability issue. I think many companies are making leaps and bounds in that department, but it's still a long way from being perfect. I think the problem with many of them isn't the retract itself, or the electronics. it's the bits inbetween that drive the unit that have been the problem. I do know that the developement done before Robart came on board, had all that taken into account and had been designed out of the equation. in other words, my buddy had seen how some of these retracts were failing and figured out a better way to actuate them, without any issues on the operation of the unit. so in this case, you've got a tried and true retract, combined with top notch electronics and a trouble free drive system that will require little to no maintenance, other than the occasional lubrication of the moving parts. it can't get any simpler than that, can it?

I think another thing to look at, is who these retracts will be marketed at. we aren't talking about an E-Flite market, or any other of the small, mini and micro market. Robart are actively seeking out the market of larger jets, warbirds, scale, etc.. these will be a drop in replacement for those guys and I believe they will be comparitively priced to what you can buy now in an air system. they didn't want to just jump in without having some sort of solid background from which to work on and I believe they have found what they were looking for. so, to say that they are a bit late to the ball game would indeed be a correct statement, but there's a reason why. they needed a gear replacement that was/is just as reliable and trustworthy as their existing systems. imagine what a PR disaster it would be if they just blatently put out a product and they got hundreds of black marks against them. it wouldn't be good for them as a company. I think they did the right thing here and once they are out and in force, this will all be a moot point anyway, because they'll be selling these things by the thousands ove the next "X" amount of years anyway. there's no doubt that e-tracts are the way of the future and air systems will be the oddity, rather than the norm. I think Robart have played it very smart and while a little late, the quality of the gear will be better than anything you've seen to date.

Rich
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Old Nov 22, 2011, 07:32 PM
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Hey Rich!
No arguments here on if they will come up with a top shelf solution. But I'm sure one concern is the price point. I have a few sets of Robart retracts/struts/Wheels etc and in some cases they were more expensive than the entire plane that they were going on.
That was then. Competitors have changed that especially for struts, wheels, sequencer solutions, and other accessories. Robart for these are at a price point making one wonder if their materials choices or process cost are choosing solutions well above what is necessary for the job or just high profit.
Retracts.... apple and apples I started trying other pneumatic solutions to great success. It is my hope that their great fantastical E solution isn't like dreaming of owning the lunar buggy; that's still, on , the, Mooooon like it used to be.
It was for this reason when you said it was a piston replacement solution, i was happy cause then I don't have to re-buy the farm to resurrect what I have.
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Old Nov 23, 2011, 01:21 AM
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yeah, as far as I know, you should be able to buy the actuator to replace the air cylinder in your own retracts. then again, there are a few companies out there that do that already.
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Old Nov 23, 2011, 02:20 AM
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Thank God I found this Thread! Follow Rich & he'll lead you to the well.
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Old Nov 23, 2011, 02:23 AM
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just don't follow me to a bar. you Americans get drunk too fast off our Canadian beer. LMAO.
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Old Nov 23, 2011, 02:24 AM
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that's why Canadians go across the border to drink, cause we look like real heroes being able to drink a whole case without getting drunk. hahahahahaha.
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