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Old Oct 13, 2012, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by pappaflyer View Post
Sorry about that, a little quick on the draw. you are right, but he could scale it down as it looks like a nice little plan.
Cato.
Dear pappaflyer your plan for Perseus IIIa plane is 34 inches wingspan.
Scaling the plan and upload a file pdf ok.

Elijah Greece.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 12:43 PM
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Dear pappaflyer here is pdf file with the same plan plane Perseus IIIa but wingspan 20in. scaling.
Inside the file has been plan full houses and new size rib for this.

Elijah Greece.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 06:16 PM
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Curtiss Robin Scale Planviews

Greetings fellow modelers,

I've been searching for some detailed planviews of the Curtiss Robin suitable to use as the basis for a satisfying scale model project, and have finally turned up some old James Triggs drawings that are pretty nice.

I've done some work on these drawings and have scaled up 1 inch=1 foot and 1.5 inches=1 foot PDFs using the metric of the 41-foot wingspan on the full size aircraft, preparatory to working up my own construction drawings for models at one and/or the other of these scales.

I'm pleased to share these drawings with any other scratch builders who may also be interested in modeling the Curtiss Robin. I've also included two images of the Curtiss R-600 Challenger radial engine that was used to power C-variant Curtiss Robins.

At my scaleviews.com web site are photographs detailing Curtiss Robin Model B NC263E, a restored-to-flying condition aircraft, that I took at the Historic Aircraft Restoration Museum at Creve Coeur Airport (Dauster Field), St. Louis, Missouri. Powered by an air-cooled (tank) version of the Curtiss OX-5, this is a rare bird.

Bob Keller
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 11:35 PM
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Perseus

Quote:
Originally Posted by hlsat View Post
Dear pappaflyer here is pdf file with the same plan plane Perseus IIIa but wingspan 20in. scaling.
Inside the file has been plan full houses and new size rib for this.

Elijah Greece.
Thank you Elijah.
Cato.
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 10:54 AM
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Bob
Many thanks indeed for posting the scale views for the Curtiss Robin.
I am currently building one of these to 82" span with all scale details
incuding cockpit ect. The plans I Cad developed from 3 views by Neito
The 3 views you sent are very useful to use and as a cross reference
Do you by any chance have any sections.
Many Thanks again.

Does anyone have any good schematics, 3 views for the Curtiss OX5 90HP.
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 12:45 PM
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Propellerheads,
Not real detailed, but a start. Lots of good reference here if you already handn't known.

http://www.finemodelworks.com/arizon...s/Curtiss.html

The engines are under "Aircraft Fittings"

http://www.finemodelworks.com/arizona-models/reference/
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 02:14 PM
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RE: Curtiss Robin Scale Planviews

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Originally Posted by propellerheads View Post
...Do you by any chance have any sections?...
Hi propellerheads,

I'm sorry but there were no cross-sections published in the magazine version of the drawings that I scanned to assemble these Curtiss Robin planviews. However, it does appear there may have been fuselage cross sections provided in the original James Triggs drawings, as there are sections A-F indicated on one of the fuselage side views.

I also don't know the original publication of the Triggs drawings, other than a circa 1990 credit and reference to being published in Air Progress "decades ago".

The Neito planviews also look very nice - excellent detail. There is a copy of them recently posted in the rcgroups.com form at:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1751039

Can you put me onto the book or magazine where the Neito Curtiss Robin drawings you worked from to create your construction plans were published? Or could you possibly source some high resolution scans of these drawings? I'd like to add the Neito drawings to my scale documentation for the Curtiss Robin and work up some scale enlargements from them to serve as the basis for construction plans well.

Thanks in advance,
Bob Keller
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 02:39 PM
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RE: Curtiss OX-5 Drawings

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Originally Posted by propellerheads View Post
Does anyone have any good schematics, 3 views for the Curtiss OX5 90HP?
Hi again propellerheads,

There is also an OX-5 drawing online at:
http://www.enginehistory.org/Before1925/curtissox5.jpg

Probably not the full detail you're looking for, but at least it is dimensioned. I'm almost positive I've seen very good OX-5 planview drawings published somewhere... the OX-5 is such an historically significant engine it's hard to imagine it not being documented in detailed drawings somewhere along the line.

If I turn should turn them up I'll post copies to this forum, or contact you by private mail if there are copyright issues with that.

Bob Keller
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 05:51 PM
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Scalviews and other interested parties.

Thanks for posting Curtiss Robin drawings by J. Nieto. He was a one man force of scale images at Model Airplane News for decades. He's right up there with W. Wylam in output and accuracy. Can't comment about the Robin, but his other works, such as the Travel Air2000, Nieuport II, Fokker Triplane , Sopwith Snipe, and probably his most famous work, the JN-4, have serious accuracy issues. In a historical modeling context, he like Wylam was producing the best, most accurate references for the time. But sadly, they do/did not hold up as more accurate data became available. lt is sad that there was no context offered for their voracity (or lack of) at the time of their original pubication. For me the nostagic value will have to suffice and the reason for my thanks. I do enjoy seeing them again!

On another note, regarding the Curtiss Wright 21 "Demon", there was an interesting article which appeared in The American Aviation Historical Society Journal. Said piece, which contended that the Model 21 was erroneously dubbed "the Demon" from somebody missing the intent of the abreiviation for the word "demonstrator" appearing in the title block. IIRC, it is shown as "Demon." (note the period) and appears on several company drawings. Also noting fact that CW products of that time period were named after birds, such as Hawk, Owl, Seagull etc.
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 07:13 AM
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Speaking of engines, I'm looking for detailed drawings and the like, similar to what has been posted above, of the Pratt & Whitney Wasp R1340 engine .

Does anybody have any or know where they might be found?

I've been looking for quite a while now. For an engine what almost in everything ... it amazing that there are no drawings available anywhere.
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 12:12 PM
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Drawing Veracity

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Originally Posted by packardpursuit View Post
Scalviews and other interested parties.
...lt is sad that there was no context offered for their voracity (or lack of) at the time of their original pubication. For me the nostagic value will have to suffice and the reason for my thanks. I do enjoy seeing them again!...
I long ago accepted that when I build a scale model based on published planview drawings, I am in fact building the drawings, which may be a more or less accurate rendering of the full size aircraft depicted in them.

The Smithsonian isn't about lower and give me the kind of intimate access to the Spirit of Saint Louis that would be required to personally verify or correct the Karlstom drawings I am currently working on to serve as the basis for model construction plans.

When and where I do have fuller access to other aircraft of potential interest to me as scale model subjects, I still don't like touching or physically contacting other people's aircraft, particularly restored antiques with significantly more value that my entire net worth...

So I'm content to work from the scale planview drawings of others as the foundation of my construction plans, even though their veracity may be questionable here and there. I figure the likes of Wylam, Matt, Karlstrom, Nieto and others draw much better than I ever could, and their access to the various aircraft and their factory drawings that are the subjects of their renderings was also indubitably much better than mine.

I do take photographs - I took something like 5000 walk-around photographs of dozens of vintage and antique subjects during the 2011 Oshkosh fly-in. Documentation-wise, photos trump drawings of course, at least for that particular subject on that particular day...

I'm still undecided regarding the particular Curtiss Robin I want to model. There is a restored B-model Robin in a museum about two hours from where I live that I have extensively photographed and could re-visit if I felt a need for additional documentation. I am also partial towards its colorful orange and yellow paint scheme.

There is another Curtiss Robin, this one a C-model in Montana, that was retrofitted with a non-factory Continental W-670 radial engine during its 'restoration', for which I have about a half-dozen serviceable photographs taken by another party. The personal appeal of this particular Robin is that I have flown in it. Bolted onto 220 horsepower, I recall it climbing with authority (for a Curtiss Robin), a definite asset in the Kalispell, Montana area.

http://www.aircraftexchangenetwork.c...ings/l0001.php

Regardless of which particular Robin I choose, and which planview drawings I base my model(s) on, I'll be making a number of changes in my construction drawings based on documenting photographs.

Bob Keller
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oddshot View Post
Speaking of engines, I'm looking for detailed drawings and the like, similar to what has been posted above, of the Pratt & Whitney Wasp R1340 engine .

Does anybody have any or know where they might be found?

I've been looking for quite a while now. For an engine what almost in everything ... it amazing that there are no drawings available anywhere.
google is our friend...
http://harrysite.net/hsrefs/index.ph...x_chart_1_of_2
http://harrysite.net/hsrefs/var/albu...g?m=1338128086

This site regarding aviation engines
http://www.enginehistory.org/

Found this site with lots of Australian historical aircraft
http://dbdesignbureau.buckmasterfamily.id.au/index.htm
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 06:26 PM
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Pratt & Whitney Wasp R-1340 Detail Photos

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Originally Posted by oddshot View Post
Speaking of engines, I'm looking for detailed drawings and the like, similar to what has been posted above, of the Pratt & Whitney Wasp R1340 engine.
Hi oddshot,

No drawings yet, but I just ran across a nice collection of photos detailing a Pratt & Whitney R-1340 Wasp S1H1-G at that may be of some interest at:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4633242...7625357618053/

Bob Keller
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 11:00 PM
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The Baby Duration Trainer

Here is a full size PDF format plan and the accompanying constructruction article for the Baby Duration Trainer, a 30-inch wingspan, parasol type rubber-powered endurance model designed by Felix Gilbert and published in the October 1939 Model Airplane News. I employed the "flat" wingspan, given at 30 inches, as a metric for scaling the full-size plan.

Bob Keller
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Last edited by scaleviews.com; Oct 15, 2012 at 11:36 PM.
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by scaleviews.com View Post
Hi oddshot,

No drawings yet, but I just ran across a nice collection of photos detailing a Pratt & Whitney R-1340 Wasp S1H1-G at that may be of some interest at:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4633242...7625357618053/

Bob Keller
Thanks Bob and Rick. I had not seen the flickr pictures before. They are very useful and gives me views of the engine I'd not seen before. If only the photographer had put even a rude paper scale anywhere in one of the fotos.

Perhaps I should have said ALMOST no drawings of the Wasp. I have copies of the two oiling system drawings ... one of them does yield the very useful overall diameter measurement.

I've been to the Australian site ... the only drawing of the Wasp engine is a very rough rendering of the front of the engine on the plans for the Whirraway.

I've also been to that Aviation Engine History site. This place has a LOT of information on a/c engines ... and a lot of spaces where information on the Wasp should be ... but there isn't anything there. Either I've overlooked something ... or its a work in progress.

I might be better off just buying a Williams Brothers kit, take my measurements from it ... and sell it on ebay.
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