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Old Nov 30, 2012, 10:54 PM
It flies!!! ... so who cares ?
erdnuckel2's Avatar
Joined Mar 2009
8,869 Posts
I honestly expect that EVERYBODY will tell you the same ... "I am fine going right/cw, but I got problems going left/ccw"
I think I read once (btw, I have this exact same problem too, which is why I practice more left circles than right circles ...) this is "system immanent" (or however this is called ...) ie, some kind of a physical problem of helis in general (that it is easier to do right turns/circles than left ones ...)

(maybe one of the aviation engineering whiz kids reads this and can throw in their expert 2 cents ...)
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 11:18 PM
Which way is up?
stuball56's Avatar
Michigan, USA
Joined Mar 2008
686 Posts
I must be like dyslexic when it comes to flying. I make left circles all the time, in heli's and planes. But I have a real problem going right, it has always seemed "unnatural", even when driving RC cars.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 11:53 PM
Against Helicopter Cruelty
Heli Pad's Avatar
Joined Aug 2011
6,162 Posts
That's because you're living in the Northern hemisphere. If you're down under, you'll be turning right.

Nah, I just made that up.

It's good for you, because left turns are harder for me. I can do pretty right turns. Left turns, not so much.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 06:31 AM
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United Kingdom, England, Kent
Joined Sep 2012
396 Posts
Just had a play in the garden and she started to get away from me so I have called it a day. I thought I had done a bit of damage but it was just a couple of links that have gone astray and I have enough of them in my parts bin.

You forget how nippy she is when you have been playing with a coaxial for any period of time. Such a great heli.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 07:33 AM
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Oviedo
Joined Jun 2010
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The reasons why i got the 120SR were 1: Its a Spektrum product, i allready had a DX6i so it was the easiest way to have a single rotor ..

and

2: Local heli pilots told me clearly that if i wanted to learn to fly RC helis and wanted to go full collective pitch in the future i had to forget about coaxials.. i wouldnt learn anything with coaxials that i could use in single rotor..


Well i haven flight a big coaxial or a 4 chanel one.. i only have a Syma S107 and S108 as small "home coaxials" .. but i can tell the 120SR is many many times harder and challengin to fly.. also rewarding.. the coax is like it flies itself and you only tell it to go forward or side or up and down.. the 120 i have to fly it constantly.. if i let go the sticks it will began bouncing.. i cant simply press the forward colective and forget since that will get it into a death drop... etc etc
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 07:49 AM
Which way is up?
stuball56's Avatar
Michigan, USA
Joined Mar 2008
686 Posts
Right, I agree. Except for one point. Those who say that a coax will teach you nothing about flying a CP? That is simply untrue. Why? I wonder, would someone tell you that? Someone who has never flown a heli will benefit GREATLY from starting with a 4 channel coax. What better way to learn what the sticks do? And how the heli reacts to stick input. It surely helped me a whole lot! I tried to start out on a Nano CPx. Way too hard for me. So I picked up two coax, learned to fly them fairly well in all orientations. Then to the FP, and then to CP. I am one of the "new majority", those who are "self taught", with help, lot's of it, from the internet. These forums in particular.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 07:56 AM
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United States, NH
Joined Nov 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stuball56 View Post
Right, I agree. Except for one point. Those who say that a coax will teach you nothing about flying a CP? That is simply untrue. Why? I wonder, would someone tell you that? Someone who has never flown a heli will benefit GREATLY from starting with a 4 channel coax. What better way to learn what the sticks do? And how the heli reacts to stick input. It surely helped me a whole lot! I tried to start out on a Nano CPx. Way too hard for me. So I picked up two coax, learned to fly them fairly well in all orientations. Then to the FP, and then to CP. I am one of the "new majority", those who are "self taught", with help, lot's of it, from the internet. These forums in particular.
Agreed 100%, nose in flying is my biggest issue right now. I do pretty well on a sim, but indoors with my 120 I don't, probably because with the limited space it leaves little room for error and correction before it flies into a wall so I get more nervous trying it. A coaxial is just as good to learn this type of stuff as a FP.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 10:56 AM
450 Helis Rule!
450man's Avatar
United Kingdom, England, Saltash
Joined Aug 2012
51 Posts
I can fly my 120SR around now and hovering nose in is fine. I have had it for about 4 months now and I love it. However, doing banked turns is causing me a real headache. When turning right I have to use a lot of back cyclic at the same time to stop it racing away faster and faster and when turning left it stops completely unless I give it a handful to forward cyclic at the same time.

I have learned to fly it like this without using a mix but I am now finding that is now starting to limit what I can do.

Is there something wrong with the heli of do all 120SRs fly like that?
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 11:36 AM
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Brian VT's Avatar
United States, VT, Rutland
Joined Dec 2011
536 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulChurchley View Post
I...doing banked turns is causing me a real headache. When turning right I have to use a lot of back cyclic at the same time to stop it racing away faster and faster and when turning left it stops completely unless I give it a handful to forward cyclic at the same time.

I have learned to fly it like this without using a mix but I am now finding that is now starting to limit what I can do.

Is there something wrong with the heli of do all 120SRs fly like that?
It's the nature of the beast. Flying 8s has the right stick going from 4 o'clock to 10 o'clock rather than 3 o'clock to 9 o'clock.
My mSR behaves the same way.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 11:57 AM
450 Helis Rule!
450man's Avatar
United Kingdom, England, Saltash
Joined Aug 2012
51 Posts
I see. Thanks. Is this a feature of FP helis in general then?

Is it worth putting in a mix to add the forw/back cyclic automatically or should I just carry on as I am and compensate manually?
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 01:27 PM
Look ma, no hands!
1Pilgrim's Avatar
United States, WI, Sheboygan
Joined Aug 2011
1,252 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulChurchley View Post
I see. Thanks. Is this a feature of FP helis in general then?

Is it worth putting in a mix to add the forw/back cyclic automatically or should I just carry on as I am and compensate manually?
I use the mixes on my dx6i quite a bit to tame my 120, especially that nasty tendency to bank right in fff.

All single-rotor helicopters tend to bank right in fff due to asymmetrical lift. The CW rotation of the rotor combined with forward motion causes the apparent wind over the blade on the left side to move faster through the air and generate more lift on that side. The resulting right bank gets more pronounced the faster the heli moves forward.

To compensate I use MIX1 to add in some left aileron with the elevator when pitching forward. This helps a little but only while the stick is pushed forward; the benefit is gone as soon as the stick is centered or pulled back; after that the only way to compensate is by adding more left aileron manually, i.e. with the thumbs.

The effect is reversed when the heli is "backing up" but in general I don't fly as fast or as far in reverse so it's not as noticeable. If it ever became a problem I could always add some right aileron to the elevator when pitching backward.

The heli also seems to have a tendency to swing wide when circling to the right (CW when viewed from above) or fall inward when turning left (CCW when viewed from above). I'm experimenting with using MIX2 to add or subtract some aileron to the rudder depending on which way I want the heli to yaw.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 02:11 PM
USAF Retired - 1968-1988
Jake8131's Avatar
United States, IL, Mascoutah
Joined Dec 2010
3,131 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Pilgrim View Post
I use the mixes on my dx6i quite a bit to tame my 120, especially that nasty tendency to bank right in fff.

All single-rotor helicopters tend to bank right in fff due to asymmetrical lift. The CW rotation of the rotor combined with forward motion causes the apparent wind over the blade on the left side to move faster through the air and generate more lift on that side. The resulting right bank gets more pronounced the faster the heli moves forward.

To compensate I use MIX1 to add in some left aileron with the elevator when pitching forward. This helps a little but only while the stick is pushed forward; the benefit is gone as soon as the stick is centered or pulled back; after that the only way to compensate is by adding more left aileron manually, i.e. with the thumbs.

The effect is reversed when the heli is "backing up" but in general I don't fly as fast or as far in reverse so it's not as noticeable. If it ever became a problem I could always add some right aileron to the elevator when pitching backward.

The heli also seems to have a tendency to swing wide when circling to the right (CW when viewed from above) or fall inward when turning left (CCW when viewed from above). I'm experimenting with using MIX2 to add or subtract some aileron to the rudder depending on which way I want the heli to yaw.
Share your mixes, please!
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 02:28 PM
NotAnotherMomentLostToSei zures
Chap1012's Avatar
United States, MA, Malden
Joined Mar 2008
10,901 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulChurchley View Post
I see. Thanks. Is this a feature of FP helis in general then?

Is it worth putting in a mix to add the forw/back cyclic automatically or should I just carry on as I am and compensate manually?
Hi Paul, welcome to our nuthouse.

Many of us downloaded Mr Salt's ebook on the 120SR. Included in his book is a basic set up for the 120SR & DX6i among some other great reading...tips, tricks, etc. For me (and others) it was 10 bucks well spent. There are others that will disagree
http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/blade-msr-tips.html

Here is a vid that will shine some light on the Dual Rate and Expo (heli and plane)
DX6i Dual Rate and Expo (10 min 55 sec)



You might find an interesting Youtube vid here (compilation)
http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...x6i&aq=f&aqi=&

Mike.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 02:30 PM
Look ma, no hands!
1Pilgrim's Avatar
United States, WI, Sheboygan
Joined Aug 2011
1,252 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake8131 View Post
Share your mixes, please!
Wow, you're a fast typist Mike! I too encourage anyone who wants to get more out of their 120 SR experience to visit www.rchelicopterfun.com and get Mr. Salt's excellent "e-guide for the MSR/120 SR".

You have to download it as a .pdf file (the only way to get it) but at $9.95 it's a steal! It contains many mods, tips and tricks specific to these particular helicopters as well as clear instructions for initially setting up the dx6i/dx7 tx's. The throttle curve and mix settings are worth the price of admission in themselves.

Disclaimer: I've never met Mr. Salt and have no motive in offering this "plug" except to pass it along in the spirit with which it was shared with me - Happy Flying! Thanks again, Mike!

btw Mr. Salt's settings are a great place to start; I encourage everyone to start there and then try out different settings for themselves as they gain more experience.
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Last edited by 1Pilgrim; Dec 01, 2012 at 02:41 PM.
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Old Dec 01, 2012, 02:45 PM
NotAnotherMomentLostToSei zures
Chap1012's Avatar
United States, MA, Malden
Joined Mar 2008
10,901 Posts
Pilgrim,I like to think I'm a fast typist but, you make words sound like music
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