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Old Aug 15, 2011, 12:24 PM
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Here ya go -- half priced because they are the old P/N and over stocked -- $4.64 for two blades - so for less than $10 you get a complete set of three, with one spare! :

http://www.bphobbies.com/view.asp?id...2&pid=D1016338
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Old Aug 15, 2011, 09:02 PM
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United States, MS, Columbus
Joined May 2011
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I might order a set of these just to give plastic a try. The 4F200 is definitely not a beginner helicopter. I bought one but only because I believe in pushing the envelope in order to force progress. I also thought three blades would be more stable than two. Wrong again. Learn the hard way again. Should have done more research first but I probably would have bought one anyway. I bought a 4F180 because it is fixed pitch. It is definitely more fun and easier to fly. If all I ever flew was a CB180D which I love to fly, I'd be stuck.

The picture of the blade broken at the blade grip seems to show epoxy reinforcement which was done at the time of manufacture. Maybe the epoxy did not extend all the way around. It looks like it just stops at the half way point where the blade grip end broke.

The manufacturer starts with a foam core, glues carbon fiber fabric over it and finishes with something I am assuming is epoxy. Then they grind it to shape. Since I have not seen the manufacturing process, I'm just guessing at this. I have seen a similar process for airplane props on "How Its Made."

The brass insert I am assuming is in lieu of epoxy reinforcement and gives something substantial to tighten down on. I have repaired the blades pictured in the previous post. I dug the foam out from around the hole in the blade grip end. Then I put scotch tape over one hole and filled the other with epoxy and worked it in. After the glue dried, I drilled the hole out and put the brass insert back in. The one good blade had some reinforcement around the blade grip hole because I couldn't dig it out.
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Old Aug 15, 2011, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperJack View Post
I might order a set of these just to give plastic a try. The 4F200 is definitely not a beginner helicopter. I bought one but only because I believe in pushing the envelope in order to force progress. I also thought three blades would be more stable than two. Wrong again. Learn the hard way again. Should have done more research first but I probably would have bought one anyway. I bought a 4F180 because it is fixed pitch. It is definitely more fun and easier to fly. If all I ever flew was a CB180D which I love to fly, I'd be stuck.

The picture of the blade broken at the blade grip seems to show epoxy reinforcement which was done at the time of manufacture. Maybe the epoxy did not extend all the way around. It looks like it just stops at the half way point where the blade grip end broke.

The manufacturer starts with a foam core, glues carbon fiber fabric over it and finishes with something I am assuming is epoxy. Then they grind it to shape. Since I have not seen the manufacturing process, I'm just guessing at this. I have seen a similar process for airplane props on "How Its Made."

The brass insert I am assuming is in lieu of epoxy reinforcement and gives something substantial to tighten down on. I have repaired the blades pictured in the previous post. I dug the foam out from around the hole in the blade grip end. Then I put scotch tape over one hole and filled the other with epoxy and worked it in. After the glue dried, I drilled the hole out and put the brass insert back in. The one good blade had some reinforcement around the blade grip hole because I couldn't dig it out.
CJ:

I can't tell you how much I appreciate your attempt at dissecting the failure of that blade!

It really bugged me, and I had some discussion at HF, but there was really no insight gleaned from the discussion as to what the real cause might have been... I appreciate your feedback and interest!
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Old Aug 15, 2011, 09:42 PM
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Glad to do it. It just looks like they poured epoxy in there and the way it is rounded off appears as though it comes to a full stop where it shouldn't. Just guessing.

Thanks for the web site! I ordered three sets of those "close out" blades. I'm thinking 200 mm should be about right.

I'm also checking out Align 250 plastic blades for my 4F180. The set I ordered is 205 mm I think and 4F180 blades are about 190 mm. Hope I don't have a conflict with tail blades.

While shopping around, I discovered some of the really big helis require giant blades which cost around $120. I think I will stick with 180 sized helis for a while. Much cheaper to crash
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Old Aug 15, 2011, 11:09 PM
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You could probably cut and balance something like these without too much trouble.

Link- http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2-Set-Yel...item3f0cefad18

but like AC has mentioned you may have some trouble holding the tail well due to extra main rotor torque.

Mick
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Old Aug 17, 2011, 04:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tracknoob View Post
Here ya go -- half priced because they are the old P/N and over stocked -- $4.64 for two blades - so for less than $10 you get a complete set of three, with one spare! :

http://www.bphobbies.com/view.asp?id...2&pid=D1016338
I ordered 3 sets. Support emailed me to let me know 2 sets shipped because they are now out of stock. Bet they are happy about that. I can give these a try.

The last Walkera carbon fiber blades I received were not good. 4F200 blades one was separating along trailing edge (I repaired w/epoxy and clamps). The other two were acceptable. 4F180 blades 1 acceptable the other three pitted and fractured on blade grip end.

The vendor seemed to be concerned with poor quality coming from Wlkera.

In my opinion, these carbon fiber blades could use reinforcement around the fastener hole. I am experimenting with digging the foam core out from around the hole and pouring epoxy in then drilling out epoxy to fit the brass collar. I am also filling in the surface pits. These blades are crap so might as well try to make them better - all I'm going to do is crash them until I can learn how to balance a BB on a beach ball!
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Old Aug 17, 2011, 06:50 AM
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Austin, TX
Joined Dec 2009
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IMHO, the cf blades are not worth messing with considering that they are expensive, crappy, and stiff enough to damage other things in a crash. I think you'll like the plastic blades--moreso after your first crash with them (have an extra set balanced and ready to go, as they are designed to dissipate force by shattering).

Rafa

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperJack View Post
I ordered 3 sets. Support emailed me to let me know 2 sets shipped because they are now out of stock. Bet they are happy about that. I can give these a try.

The last Walkera carbon fiber blades I received were not good. 4F200 blades one was separating along trailing edge (I repaired w/epoxy and clamps). The other two were acceptable. 4F180 blades 1 acceptable the other three pitted and fractured on blade grip end.

The vendor seemed to be concerned with poor quality coming from Wlkera.

In my opinion, these carbon fiber blades could use reinforcement around the fastener hole. I am experimenting with digging the foam core out from around the hole and pouring epoxy in then drilling out epoxy to fit the brass collar. I am also filling in the surface pits. These blades are crap so might as well try to make them better - all I'm going to do is crash them until I can learn how to balance a BB on a beach ball!
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 05:26 AM
1 year flyin' & lovin' it!
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United States, CA, Covina
Joined Aug 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperJack View Post
The picture of the blade broken at the blade grip seems to show epoxy reinforcement which was done at the time of manufacture. Maybe the epoxy did not extend all the way around. It looks like it just stops at the half way point where the blade grip end broke.

The manufacturer starts with a foam core, glues carbon fiber fabric over it and finishes with something I am assuming is epoxy. Then they grind it to shape. Since I have not seen the manufacturing process, I'm just guessing at this. I have seen a similar process for airplane props on "How Its Made."

The brass insert I am assuming is in lieu of epoxy reinforcement and gives something substantial to tighten down on. I have repaired the blades pictured in the previous post. I dug the foam out from around the hole in the blade grip end. Then I put scotch tape over one hole and filled the other with epoxy and worked it in. After the glue dried, I drilled the hole out and put the brass insert back in. The one good blade had some reinforcement around the blade grip hole because I couldn't dig it out.
Hello guys,

My 2cents worth, I recently bought a crashed 4F200 as a fixer-upper, and I pulled the blades off. At first it looked like two of them were useable, but...I read CJ's post and decided against. I noticed nicks at the neck of the blade, near the mounting point. These were probably caused by contacting the blade holder during the crash. They would probably be suspect after a failure like CJ's. I have used slightly damaged CF blades before by using CA and filing it smooth after curing. I have not had one come apart after sealing it with CA.

I HAVE had a feathering shaft bolt failure on my HIKO 400 in idle up mode (ST1). That scared the crap out of me, which is why I wouldn't recommend using any CF blades with damage near the neck or mounting collar.

Thanks to all of you posting here, I have rebuilt the 4F200 and flown it with no problems. I put a 2618 from a 4F200LM in it. It flies smoothly from take-off to landing.

I included a few pics of the blades that came off of the 4F200. The nicks are hard to see, you may have to zoom.

Happy flying!
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 08:00 AM
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If you don't mind my asking, what difference did you notice going from the RX2612 (4F200 stock Rx) to a RX2618? I am finding my 4F200 very unstable - likes to just blast off in any direction.

I've also noticed a few comments about installing a RX2702 in a 4F180. I have asked why this is recommended. One person said 2702 would be good for 6ch heli that needed fast response. HobbyKing support sent a short one liner saying faster tail response. Another person said you really don't need it in the 4F180. I'm a beginner and about all I can do right now is hover three and four blades. I figure it will be a while before I can appreciate something like this.
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 12:56 PM
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OldGuyHelifly11's Avatar
United States, CA, Covina
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RX2618 in 4F200

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperJack View Post
If you don't mind my asking, what difference did you notice going from the RX2612 (4F200 stock Rx) to a RX2618? I am finding my 4F200 very unstable - likes to just blast off in any direction.

I've also noticed a few comments about installing a RX2702 in a 4F180. I have asked why this is recommended. One person said 2702 would be good for 6ch heli that needed fast response. HobbyKing support sent a short one liner saying faster tail response. Another person said you really don't need it in the 4F180. I'm a beginner and about all I can do right now is hover three and four blades. I figure it will be a while before I can appreciate something like this.
CJ,
It' actually a drop in PNP replacement. After talking to Walkera directly, they say the difference is programming. From what I have read here, the 2612 3G system only becomes active around 40% throttle, where the 2618 is active at 0% throttle. I disconnected my motor, adjusted the throttle and tested it myself to confirm this. Also, flying the heli is challenging from take-off, as you well know. After changing the RX, I am able to do slow, controlled take-offs, and hover at 2-3 feet without a problem. I have a 4F200LM, which is modded, and that gave me the idea to change the RX. The main differences between going with the 2702 and 2618 would be price, approx $130 vs $60, and size. the 2702 is a bit larger, but will still fit in the same place.
Good luck!
AB

BTW, the 2612 went into one of my 1#A's. Going FBL!
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 05:17 PM
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I'm reading this that you are recommending the RX2618? I don't really want to pay $130 for a 2702 right now if the 2618 will do what I want it to do. I need stable hover to fly this (or any) RC helicopter. I've crashed this one twice taking off. I'm waiting on parts right now. I can use "slow, controlled take-offs, and hover at 2-3 feet without a problem" really bad!

I'm not having that much of a problem with my 4F180 but wondering if the 2618 would help it too.

Thanks! - Jack
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperJack View Post
I'm reading this that you are recommending the RX2618? I don't really want to pay $130 for a 2702 right now if the 2618 will do what I want it to do. I need stable hover to fly this (or any) RC helicopter. I've crashed this one twice taking off. I'm waiting on parts right now. I can use "slow, controlled take-offs, and hover at 2-3 feet without a problem" really bad!

I'm not having that much of a problem with my 4F180 but wondering if the 2618 would help it too.

Thanks! - Jack
CJ,
Don't forget, the 2618 is a 6CH RX, the 4F180 is a 4CH heli. I LOVE the 2618 in my 4F200. Its just THAT MUCH better!

AB
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 07:18 PM
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I think the 2618 would be worth a try. Did you have to move your throttle trim all the way down to make it work with a 2801 Tx and keep the tail from spinning? I'm guessing you didn't.

I discovered turning the bal switch off on the Rx nullifies the throttle trim adjustment and allows the tail to spin.

Jack
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Old Aug 18, 2011, 07:42 PM
1 year flyin' & lovin' it!
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United States, CA, Covina
Joined Aug 2011
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Jack,

Try it. You won't be disappointed. Also, I turn my throttle trim all the way down on all of my helis. I was taught that's what you're supposed to do. I had one spin up on me while sitting on a table in front of me once. Got my attention fast! I was able to get under it and grab it by the tail stabilizers and skids before it could do any damage. Turns out, as I was programming it, I initiated binding and it started going! The trim wasn't down.

I normally counter any tail rotation with a little opposite rudder as I start it off, then the gyro takes over.

Good luck!
AB
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Old Aug 24, 2011, 02:34 PM
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Heads up on any 4f200 owners looking for replacement blades -- given the quality issues with the originals and their similar carbon fiber replacements, some have gone to the CF "3D" blades or Align items. They are a known quantity, and I think that is a good call. But with the original Align part now obsolete, and pretty high prices for everything out there for the 4f200, I went to ebay and poked around.

I don't want to endorse any pzrticular vendor, since I have not checked them out yet, but if you just type in 205mm for RC parts, and select "helicopter" to narrow the search, you will be able to find a gazillion vendors, giving terrific prices (from China of course) and some even include free shipping, for as few as one or two pairs!

You can also choose from woodies (would not recommend) glass fibre (chopped fibreglass), carbon fibre (exactly like originals but cheaper), CF "3D" white-clad items (I have had very good success with these on 450 sized helis), and also plastic.

I decided since I have run my 4f200 the original CF, and now plastic (which works very well, BTW) that I would now try out the fibreglas ones. The weight is lower than CF, and they look to be decent quality.

So, I bought three sets of these at $5.78 pair, shipped, just because I like the color scheme:


but these look to be even nicer:


and the price is 4 for $10, so for $20, you get two full sets and two spare blades, as well in case one gets chipped or broken in your flying.
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