HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Feb 09, 2013, 10:08 AM
Registered User
United States, ND, Bismarck
Joined Mar 2012
296 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
I just ordered the Ino-Labs tail servo and some other stuff from helidirect. I also ordered a CB180Z fixing set from jaebeex2 / RC Heli Partz. I recently ordered a set of stock tail blades that should be here any day now. Hopefully after all of this, this heli flies like it costs! If it's not the blades, and it's not the servo, then i will tighten the belt a tiny bit. If it's not that, i'll probably get a new gyro. If all that fails to resolve the wag. V200 tail....


I hope you get yours back up and running soon flint. I know that one hurt after all that work balancing and having just installed new blades. I guess next time use another Velcro strap or something? Or tuck the wires in the battery strap. Something like that. After all that you still didn't get to log much data or really fly the thing. That always sucks.
I think that servo will sort your tail. Those 37mm t-rex blades actually look like they might be better than stock for high head speeds (smaller area). I might have to get a couple sets.

I actually logged like 6 flights total. 2 with the stealth blades. The stealths drew more amps, but they also actually performed well. But yeah, I took the ice 50 off and put it back in my 450 now that the 4f200 is down. I need something to fly besides the protos, 130x, and v120.

Esc logs with stealth blades:
http://i.imgur.com/GfZNYGV.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nj2Ka93.jpg

It'll probably be a while til I get it back in the air. That was my only battery, and my others are on the slow boat from china. That and I haven't found main gears available in the U.S. yet.
flint723 is offline Find More Posts by flint723
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Feb 09, 2013, 03:37 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by flint723 View Post
I think that servo will sort your tail. Those 37mm t-rex blades actually look like they might be better than stock for high head speeds (smaller area). I might have to get a couple sets.

I actually logged like 6 flights total. 2 with the stealth blades. The stealths drew more amps, but they also actually performed well. But yeah, I took the ice 50 off and put it back in my 450 now that the 4f200 is down. I need something to fly besides the protos, 130x, and v120.

Esc logs with stealth blades:
http://i.imgur.com/GfZNYGV.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nj2Ka93.jpg

It'll probably be a while til I get it back in the air. That was my only battery, and my others are on the slow boat from china. That and I haven't found main gears available in the U.S. yet.
I use ebay LOTS now. Especially for the 4f200. The ebay sellers are more reliable for keeping stock and cheaper shipping because they offer first class mail. If one guy is out of stock, another is likely to have stock. Just keep in mind that the V200D03 gears are your main source of gears these days. People stock the 4f200 gear but they sell right out.

This guy has been great. Fast shipping, cheap and usually better prices than wow hobbies too. Just depends on which item your getting.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HM-V200D03-Z...item43b8619b7a

This guy, i'm not so sure about. But he had good pricing too and when he's not on vacation, he seems pretty reliable.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Walkera-Part...item2c67e8bd7a


I flew a few packs though the 4f200 today with the Walkera 08-9 metal gear cyclic servo on the tail. I don't have a spec sheet for the WK, because obviously they are too incompetent or to lazy to publish one. But it feels like the 08-9 servo is much faster. Either way, today i had the least amount of wag and a few close calls. It's sooo windy i'm confined to my driveway. But i'll upload the video because at this distance you can probably see what is going on better. It does not constantly wag, it wags after i stop a piro or sudden rudder stop. Or if i move and let go of the rudder and let the stick snap back to center. If i keep constant movement on the rudder it will not wag. If it's still play, i have one last fix to remove the tiny bit of slop in the pitch arms. They need some play i would think. But i can put washers on the screw heads that hold the pitch arms together and there would be absolutely no slop left. I really can't see this tiny bit of play being the issue though. It's just very strange. It's still flying nice though, compared to previous flights.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 10, 2013, 12:55 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
The first video below the wagging was pretty bad. I'm using the Walkera 08-9 cyclic on the tail here. As i lowered the RPM the wag subsided. Though i was not able to completely tune it out with this servo. The servo it's self has play in it, so who knows. We'll see when the ino-labs gets here.


4f200C - 08-9 tail servo - Bad random wag (3 min 46 sec)


4F200C - 08-9 tail servo - lower rpm = less wag (3 min 51 sec)
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 10, 2013, 08:17 AM
Team WarpSquad
Japan, Tokyo
Joined Jun 2011
2,718 Posts
You're using a metal gear V450 cyclic servo or it's a plastic geared one? The slop in the MG servos would probably be a problem... it was terrible for flapping the blades when on the cyclics.
thwaitm is offline Find More Posts by thwaitm
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 10, 2013, 12:13 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by thwaitm View Post
You're using a metal gear V450 cyclic servo or it's a plastic geared one? The slop in the MG servos would probably be a problem... it was terrible for flapping the blades when on the cyclics.
The last two were both metal gear and used. The new ino-labs servo should be here some time this coming week. New mounting brackets for it and some other stuff. I'm hoping the servo fixes all the problems right off. I tightened my belt a bit. It seems to have done nothing much. But it's probably about time i give it a 1mm tightening on the boom.

It's getting warmer here, too quick... if it wasn't for the wind, i would probably be getting eaten alive by all kinds of bugs. I need to build a pvc screen enclosed hut to stand in
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 05:37 AM
Team WarpSquad
Japan, Tokyo
Joined Jun 2011
2,718 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
The last two were both metal gear and used. The new ino-labs servo should be here some time this coming week. New mounting brackets for it and some other stuff. I'm hoping the servo fixes all the problems right off. I tightened my belt a bit. It seems to have done nothing much. But it's probably about time i give it a 1mm tightening on the boom.

It's getting warmer here, too quick... if it wasn't for the wind, i would probably be getting eaten alive by all kinds of bugs. I need to build a pvc screen enclosed hut to stand in
It'll be interesting to hear if it gets fixed with the servo change. I was thinking to use my old WK-09-9s on a flying piece of board... I built it, got it off the ground twice but the CoG was so far back it just stalled and plummeted both times
Need to fiddle a bit (lot?) more but don't really have the time, space, etc. - I sometimes feel I need 3 of me... one to work, one to take care of the kids and one to fly stuff.
thwaitm is offline Find More Posts by thwaitm
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 08:33 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
I yesterday i though i was having a "Castle Cremations" moment. When my heli just shut right off while flying. Since it didn't soft cut, i figured something is really wrong. Thankfully the HARD cut of the motor saved all the mechanics and breakable bits that usually break in a crash. When i stuck it back on the pad, it would not spool up and some smoke started coming either from the motor, wires or ESC. My motor wires were tie wrapped together against the frame to keep them from moving around. Apparently one or more had a bad solder connection to begin with, after examining. They are fixed now. But while flying two of the connectors with bad solder were getting hot, apparently. They melted together and eventually parts of the bullet connectors touched. When i went home and fixed the connections and shrink wrapped everything again the motor worked fine once more.


Prior to the crash, the tail wag was actually not so bad this day:
4F200C - Super windy, Motor wires short out (2 min 11 sec)
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 14, 2013, 08:42 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Update to the build log.


4f200 - Upgrades, Repairs, Mods, Complete parts build

Click here to Subscribe to this build log!

Index:

#18: 4F200 - Ino-Lab D261HB tail servo install
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 14, 2013, 08:45 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Oh yeah, during the install i decided to do some maintenance. Mainly check the tail belt and probably replace it. Which i did do. The belt was fairly worn out. Possible cause of the tail wagging (slippage). Also i discovered the right side tail box bearing. The protruding side of the tail shaft. The bearing was completely shot and had tons of play in it. I replaced it as well. The tail did not seem to wag and held WAY better than ever before in a quick night time hover in my drive way with the lights on outside. Going now to the park to give it a flight test. But so far the tail wag is gone. I also removed the tail shaft/pulley shim i installed previously to remove the pulley slop. The heli is running nice and true now. Wish me luck. The park awaits.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:03 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
I added 3 pictures to the build log for the Ino-Lab tail servo install. They had gotten lost in the transition from the camera to the PC. The most important one, showing the CG after the install:

IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 15, 2013, 03:31 PM
Registered User
United States, ND, Bismarck
Joined Mar 2012
296 Posts
So did you fly it yet IH? I got mine back in the air today with the hitec servo on the tail. I changed back to stock blade grips because the 4f180 ones with the shorter arm created a lot more play when you turn the grip back and forth. Plus I don't need the extra throw those grips provide. It still has a wicked quick flip and collective response even with the shortest balls on the swash and 3700 rpm.
flint723 is offline Find More Posts by flint723
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 16, 2013, 02:32 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by flint723 View Post
So did you fly it yet IH? I got mine back in the air today with the hitec servo on the tail. I changed back to stock blade grips because the 4f180 ones with the shorter arm created a lot more play when you turn the grip back and forth. Plus I don't need the extra throw those grips provide. It still has a wicked quick flip and collective response even with the shortest balls on the swash and 3700 rpm.
Yeah, when i had the tail open i found all kinds of things. No matter how much preventative maintenance i do. Something always seems to happen. It was flying good. But the tail does not hold as well as i would like. Come to find out, the tail steering rocker screw was wearing out. It sheered in flight and i landed right on my main rotor. The only damage was 1 blade and a blade grip. Main gear screw sheered and the canopy didn't even crack, damn sure didn't shatter either with the durability liner and paint added. Thank god, it was the 2nd flight with that white canopy on.

Speaking of canopies, You know, i was in the LHS today to pick up some new 250 blades to fix the 4f200. Which BTW is ready to fly for tomorrow already. Took me 15 minutes to fix Anyway, Looking at the 500X. The canopy is vacuum formed just like Walkera but it's about 3-5 times thicker. It's real hard and i almost thought it was FRP for a second. Put's the 200 and 450 Walkera canopies to absolute shame. Especially since they are not vacuum formed as a single piece. They are glued together in 3 sections, making them even more brittle. Blade absolutely puts Walkera to shame every time i pick up one of their models and just hold it in my hand. The quality difference is so blatantly obvious, IMO.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 16, 2013, 09:12 AM
Mach One
captain MoMo's Avatar
Joined Apr 2011
2,018 Posts
Blade quality better than Walkera? I have Blade Helis as well as Walkera. I must say that in my opinion, for what it's worth, Walkera makes better quality helicopters. I have the Blade 450 and can't compare her with V450! A fair comparison may be the new FBL Blade 450 but its close enough. I do really like how Horizon Hobby and Blade have excellent support, I give them that. But with regards to value and quality of Helis, IMHO Walkera is slightly ahead, second to Align. This is just my experience in the last 4 years.
captain MoMo is online now Find More Posts by captain MoMo
RCG Plus Member
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 16, 2013, 12:42 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain MoMo View Post
Blade quality better than Walkera? I have Blade Helis as well as Walkera. I must say that in my opinion, for what it's worth, Walkera makes better quality helicopters. I have the Blade 450 and can't compare her with V450! A fair comparison may be the new FBL Blade 450 but its close enough. I do really like how Horizon Hobby and Blade have excellent support, I give them that. But with regards to value and quality of Helis, IMHO Walkera is slightly ahead, second to Align. This is just my experience in the last 4 years.



You can't compare Align to Walkera.... Besides that Align is a Horizon product, who is pushing Align aside and pushing blade forward with the "pro series". Which is looking just as nice as Align. Align is not the best, it's the minimum requirements for reliability. Thats all. Thats all you can expect from Blade too. I expect MUCH less from Walkera. Flybar and Flybarless are not the same.. The gyro is important... The most important actually, especially for 3D. I can't wait to get a beastX on this 4f200 so it will fly right. Others are following my example with the beastX on the V450 agree. The BeastX is better than the Walkera gyro.
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Last edited by IntegrityHndywrk; Feb 16, 2013 at 01:45 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 16, 2013, 12:48 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,643 Posts
Here are two flights with the Ino-Labs tail servo. The 2702V is still not keeping the tail as well as i would like. I think the disc loading with 3 blades and this powerful a motor. The torque is just too much at times. If i punch hard it will kick, but if i keep it calm. It flies great.


4F200 - Ino-Lab Tail Servo test 1 (3 min 50 sec)



This next one is where the tail rocker screw sheered on me (again). I don't know why the hell they don't put a bearing on this thing. Especially if they are only going to use a M1 bolt. I suspect some thread lock got into the bushing or something and started fatiguing the bolt. It was also a little bent from a previous crash. I should have replaced it, but didn't have the stupid M1 bolt to replace it with. On a side note, when i did install the new rocker. The new brass bushing was not reamed out enough on one end. The screw was actually able to thread into the bushing it was so tight........ WTH WALKERA!! That could be why my last screw sheered on me too. So i used a drill bit and reamed it out the rest of the way though.


4F200 - Ino-Lab tail servo Test 3. Tail pitch rocker screw sheers (2 min 36 sec)
IntegrityHndywrk is offline Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion Another new Walkera! HM 4F200 heli-parkflyer Micro Helis 84 Jan 08, 2011 02:40 PM
Off Site Walkera 4#3 2.4Ghz RTF - Metal Head Version nighthawk0077 Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 Nov 22, 2009 08:23 PM
Discussion Unique "mixer less" Bell Hiller Head design of the MSR plus Walkera 4#3 Mixer lesss EQMOD Micro Helis 47 Sep 26, 2009 11:59 PM
Discussion 45 Degree Flybar Conversion on a Walkera 4#3 V1 BELL HILLER head EQMOD Micro Helis 13 Sep 01, 2009 11:15 PM
Build Log Walkera 4#3 HH-65 USCG Dauphin--VIDEO 4 Blade head works page6 stevel48 Micro Helis 146 Dec 03, 2008 10:16 AM