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Old Sep 19, 2012, 01:24 PM
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Athens, Greece
Joined Oct 2003
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So... I ran my SBK-spec bike this afternoon, again, and right where I was in a good mood, pushing harder and harder, suddenly I am braking at the end of the main straight and the bike is... well... not slowing down as it was doing all the previous laps...
Back to the pits, the Ace C1016 is not responding... changed the port in the receiver, still no response.
Well... I did some light search in here, and it seems everyone prefers the Futaba 3156, only there's a small pricey problem: It costs around 40-45 euros! OK, the C1016 is exactly half that, but my guess is it lasts about 5 batteries...
I'd love to get the Von Elling (Tusken) caliper and a 3156, but this would mean in excess of 75 euros total, just for playing around with a 5.5T motor for a couple of months, before converting back to stock. The bike is almost undriveable with no front brake...

So, is there any cheapo alternative servo that would fit into the stock brake caliper?

Edit: And please save the lectures about me converting to Superbikes! I will stay in Stock!!! Thank you!!!
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 05:22 PM
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San Jose, California, United States
Joined Apr 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steliosh View Post
So... I ran my SBK-spec bike this afternoon, again, and right where I was in a good mood, pushing harder and harder, suddenly I am braking at the end of the main straight and the bike is... well... not slowing down as it was doing all the previous laps...
Back to the pits, the Ace C1016 is not responding... changed the port in the receiver, still no response.
Well... I did some light search in here, and it seems everyone prefers the Futaba 3156, only there's a small pricey problem: It costs around 40-45 euros! OK, the C1016 is exactly half that, but my guess is it lasts about 5 batteries...
I'd love to get the Von Elling (Tusken) caliper and a 3156, but this would mean in excess of 75 euros total, just for playing around with a 5.5T motor for a couple of months, before converting back to stock. The bike is almost undriveable with no front brake...

So, is there any cheapo alternative servo that would fit into the stock brake caliper?

Edit: And please save the lectures about me converting to Superbikes! I will stay in Stock!!! Thank you!!!
** I will be awaiting the answer to this one as my brake servo went out too!**

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Old Sep 20, 2012, 02:37 AM
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I used the C1016MG for 1.5 Seasons, and used 3 of them.

The only good thing about it: You get a C1016 (Plastic Gear) with the brake kit, so if you buy a C1016MG, you essentialy have 2 Servos. So if the electronic or the motor fails on the MG, you just take the metal gears over to the normal C1016, and use that.

As far as I know, the Futaba 3156 will not fit the original Caliper well.
One very good Servo is the Graupner DS 292MG. It fits in the SB-5 Brake Caliper, but you have to make your own Servo Horn. And it's pricey..
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Old Sep 20, 2012, 02:54 AM
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Germany
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You can also use the brand new Thunder Tiger DC1016MG (Item# 8171). It is Digital and much more reliable than the C1016. Marc and Oli used it at the Worlds 2012 without any problems.
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Old Sep 20, 2012, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Gartenzwerg View Post
I used the C1016MG for 1.5 Seasons, and used 3 of them.

The only good thing about it: You get a C1016 (Plastic Gear) with the brake kit, so if you buy a C1016MG, you essentialy have 2 Servos. So if the electronic or the motor fails on the MG, you just take the metal gears over to the normal C1016, and use that.

As far as I know, the Futaba 3156 will not fit the original Caliper well.
One very good Servo is the Graupner DS 292MG. It fits in the SB-5 Brake Caliper, but you have to make your own Servo Horn. And it's pricey..
Drill out the center of the original brakecaliper part, cut off the ears on the servohorn, made some slots in black plastic and then glued them together with CA glue.

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Old Sep 20, 2012, 05:44 AM
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steliosh's Avatar
Athens, Greece
Joined Oct 2003
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thanks for the input, friends!
I did a call to my local TT importers and they will supply me with a 8171 servo very quickly, in fact as soon as their next order is arriving. And the price is not that pricey, either, which is what I wished in the first place, so I can fool around with the SBK setup a bit more!!! It seems there's some issue with analog servos when worked with a digital radio, or something similar, to my understanding... Anyway, I m waiting for the DC1016MG!!!
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 09:11 AM
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well its taken a while, due to my work going mad and keepnig me busy, but finally got the bike how I want it, wheels in the middle, bearings and shims etc all sorted and extremely smooth running

gone is the slipper clutch and the crappy plastic front pulley, now has an alloy front pulley

so simple to sort, the work was well worth the effort, gone is the annoying clicking as the silly plastic pulley moved about due to the fitting being rubbish and not on straight.

no more pokey out shaft and bent bits making the spur gear run out of true

instead now the bike uses Kimbrough spurs, like my other bikes, and I bougth a pile of them dirt cheap so thats even better
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 04:57 AM
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ok after a little bit of help, what sort of starting point should I be at with gearing

Im going to be running a 19T brushed motor for the UK GP next weekend as I dont want to spend money on a brushless system that I wont use again.

any suggestions?
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 01:12 PM
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Athens, Greece
Joined Oct 2003
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Very long essay... Grab your coffee!!!

As I said elsewhere, last night I re-read all the story that Edi Winter shared with us about his incredible bikes! Also, during last week, I spent a few (well more than a few, actually!) reading about setting up the SB-5...
So, the last couple of days, I was preparing for the last 1/10 electric TC race of the Greek Champs: How?! I cleaned all the ball bearings of the Xray T3/2011, checked that every screw is tight and that all plastic parts are not broken or twisted. Total time: Two whole hours. Then the car sat in its shelf, waiting for the race. By the way, I finished 6th in the B-main, in total 16th out of 21 racers. OK. It was fun, my hands did the most terrible job, enough about cars, right!?

So, after the car was race-ready, I got down my (old) SB-5 and started poking it up and down... After I had read the setup tips in this very thread, I decided to do some things:
I have a Savox 1251 low profile servo, mounted with two "thick" spacers, front and rear. By doing this, the front suspension movement was limited when going to extend, when the rear part of the servo posts were hitting the lower suspension arm. So, I dremelled the suspension arm, to the point that I got to the shiny rod inside it, and still the rear servo posts were blocking the arms from extending downward.
I recall I read somewhere (maybe it was at rcbike.fr forum, which I read regularly, using the babelfish translator, don't ask why, I just do!), that you can use no spacers in the rear of the servo mount. So, I removed the rear thick spacer, test fitted it and suddenly my bike was nose high! Ops!
Then, I recall from my notes (while I was reading this thread, I kept notes: Who said what!) that Edi said that you should have some 32mm from the bottom of the battery to the ground, when trying to lift the front of the bike off the ground. Mine was 42mm, while I was using the TT long front fork plates. Edi has also said that he did an SB-5 front once, and he inserted limiters inside the front shocks. After some trial and error, I found that inserting 4.5mm inside the shocks, below the shock piston, the ground clearance at the front, below the battery was exactly 32mm! Great!
I also checked that the steering shocks and springs didn't touch anything while the suspension was moving from extension to full compression.
In these shocks I am using orange springs, with two black o-rings and a washer, while inside them, I use twin AE red orings (the ones Torrance once suggested) and I have one shock filled with 350cst oil and the other empty.

I also remember Clark's advice on suspension shock oils (we talked at the Worlds!) to use 2000cst front and rear, so I also filled the fronts with 2000, instead of the 3000 I was using till now. At the rear, I still have 2000, filled them at Riccione, a couple months ago! I am using orange springs in all four shocks, and the 2-hole (and two-marks) pistons. I have also inserted a red oring on the outside of each shock shaft, so the bottoming will not be so harsh on the shock. Inside the shocks, I am using green orings from Acer Racing, which are perfectly oil-tight.

I am still using Fredrik Von Elling's lower fork triple, which is modified by him with a long 1.5mm setscrew, limiting steering movement. I just made very sure the movement is limited exactly the same at both sides.

So, what else is there left on the bike setup? I mounted a new wheel hub to a "Riccione" front tire (made by SharkLaps) and OLP rear wheel hub (aluminum hub with glassfiber "star") on an also used at the Worlds rear tire (also from Shark Laps).
The steering angle is maintained as kit: (---**) top and (**---) bottom, as seen on the left side.
I am using Clark's Lightscale swing arm plates, Edi's swing arm box and that's it.

Nice, all that and how it works?!
As I said at the beginning, today we had a TC race, so of course I had the bike ready with a good battery in it... Actually the first Nosram 6200 I ran with the xray, I reharged and installed in the bike! The race director gave me the exclusive use of the track during the lunch break, so I ran the bike maybe 25 minutes, all in one session!

First of all, the steering is what I wished of this bike all my life: Linear, the bike stayed on the chosen line, and the line could be soooooo easily changed using the throttle and/or brakes occassionally. The TC race managers didn't record my laps, even though the bike carries a transponder, since it would mean to alter the race schedule for them, so I can't tell about lap times, but only the feeling: Which was superb, for the very first time, in my almost two years with this bike, I felt confident and started pushing really hard and NOT crashing... ok, I crashed maybe 2-3 times, but I was really happy...
After said duration, the tires came back the rear looking almost like a slick and the front having made a nice soft edge which for the first time, I never felt affecting the handling of the bike!!! People were absolutely amazed, as I was, too, and everyone gathered and started asking the usual things!
We should make a trademark on these: "How fast?, does it wheelie?, how much?"
Being the bad old me, I told them:
a. 100km/h and maybe more, given the conditions (a complete lie with the stock bike, ok, we all know that, but the "ton" does impress people who want to be impressed!)
b. Yes, but it's a waste of time, in a race.
c. Around 800 euros (hahaha! The actual cost of the bike, the Lightscale, Edi's and TT option parts, the servo, the electronics, and the tires -I had 4 sets with me- were this much more or less!) THAT was Impressive indeed!
Unfortunately not a single pic in action, and I'm not sure anyone bothered to shoot video...
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 01:26 PM
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United States, TX, Houston
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Originally Posted by steliosh View Post
As I said elsewhere, last night I re-read all the story that Edi Winter shared with us about his incredible bikes! Also, during last week, I spent a few (well more than a few, actually!) reading about setting up the SB-5...
Steliosh,

Thank you for posting about your setup. Now its time to try a few more things on my sb-5.

-rskip
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 01:32 PM
www.steliosh.net/rcmoto/
steliosh's Avatar
Athens, Greece
Joined Oct 2003
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"My" setup is really what makes me feel good with the bike... Poking on other people's bikes, at the pits, at the Worlds (the only... race I've been in the last 3 months!) you could feel, see and talk a lot of different approaches to what suits everyone...
I first started with Thomas Feilner's setups, as published at the rc-motorradshop.de site and went on from there, depending on what I wanted, always asking for advice, myself being a newbie with just 5 bike races under my belt...
So far so good, then!!!
It's really things you can do with no cost, like making the bike slimmer, or that little thing that Fredrik did, that make a lot more sense!
One final note: On this track, at this time, I used the 3rd upper hole in the Lightscale plates (another incredibly valuable option, and no, this is not advertising! As Gartenzwerg said, you have 10 different swing arms to try)
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 02:10 PM
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Awesome steliosh!
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steliosh View Post
I have a Savox 1251 low profile servo, mounted with two "thick" spacers, front and rear. By doing this, the front suspension movement was limited when going to extend, when the rear part of the servo posts were hitting the lower suspension arm. So, I dremelled the suspension arm, to the point that I got to the shiny rod inside it, and still the rear servo posts were blocking the arms from extending downward.
So is there actually a solution for this besides limiters? I don't really feel like re-bleeding my shocks.. I'm using the "thin" spacers with a standard HPI servo and it hits the lower cantilever on the down travel, which doesn't allow it to go down as far as it should. I don't like the fact that there is always pressure on the springs and servo..
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Old Oct 08, 2012, 02:51 AM
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steliosh's Avatar
Athens, Greece
Joined Oct 2003
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There are a couple solutions to front shock travel limiters:

One is to bolt two M3 screws on the top arm. Check the attached pic.

The other is to use Ricou-Corps' aluminum arms and/or the travel limiter he has devised. Check the new thread, posted this morning:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1747529
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