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Old Sep 29, 2001, 10:25 PM
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Walled Lake, MI, USA
Joined Feb 2000
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30+ Minute Flights on GWS Tiger Moth with NiMH

I want to thank Hitec-Redneck for his great advice on using a 6-cell AAA 720mAh NiMH pack on a GWS Tiger Moth. Tonight, after the wind died down, I tried to run out a pack at full throttle. Flying with an APC 9x6 prop, I launched and left the throttle on full. Whenever the aircraft would get too high, I'd start doing loops or other maneuvers to lose altitude. My intention was to run the pack down until it wouldn't stay in the air. I came up a little short. I started the flight about 35 minutes before a dinner reservation about 5 minutes from the flying site. After 30 minutes of full-throttle flying, the TM was still capable of doing loops. I finally had to cut the throttle and bring it down in order to get to the restaurant on time. The heatsink on the motor was barely warm after 30 minutes of full throttle flight, so 7.2V is definitely the way to go for keeping GWS IPS motors from overheating and expiring prematurely.

When I got it home and recharged the pack, it took a charge of 726mAh. When completely run down, this pack has taken a charge of more than 800mAh. So I'm guessing there was probably another 5 minutes of flight in the pack. I'll have to try again tomorrow to run it all the way down and see what the max full-throttle flight time is. With throttle management, flight time could be much higher. I've also flown this combination with an 8x6 APC prop, and that also works pretty well. I had been thinking about trying a couple of the Li-ion cells to fly the TM. But I'm not sure that they would offer much over the performance and duration that I'm getting out of the 6-cell AAA NiMH pack that I assembled out of Energizer cells bought at the local WalMart. At 2.7 oz., the AAA pack is 1.3 oz. heavier than the Rayovac NiMH 9V that I was previously using. But at more than four times the flight duration, it is easily worth it. The TM has plenty of wing area to carry that extra 1.3 oz. What a great combination.
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 07:19 AM
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DaveG's Avatar
Houston, TX, US
Joined Jun 2000
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Wow, Dave, you must have had a stiff neck after that much flight time.

Yes, I really like the little 280, 6 cell NiMH pack I've been using for my Tiger Moth. Of course, I only get a little less than half the time of the NiMH pack you're using but it's been enough time for me and 6 cells are enough power for cruising and touch-and-goes without having to worry about burning up the motor. Are you using the GWS heat sink or something else?

Just getting ready to fly the 'lil Moth this morning. Happy flying.

Dave G
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 09:24 AM
Houng-wen Lin
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Shijr, Taiwan. DungGwan, China. City of Industry, California.
Joined Sep 2001
19,445 Posts
Dear Dave, are you still very young?

I did many hours continiously flew slope glider with special add on SC 1200 battery for TX, when I was 25 years but 20 years ago.

GWS also tested with Li-ion battery squre pack 1200mah. By EP9070 proppler, you may level flight with cut back throttle quite much, nearly one hours. But GWS will not recomance flyers to do so, we are affraid that you hurt your neck! You need to make sure your health condition allow you to do so, GWS will not reposible for any pysical problems may occur!

The battery technic getting lighter and more capacity. I am affriad GWS must put another tube of "BENGAY" together with glue in the kit!?
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 10:27 AM
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Walled Lake, MI, USA
Joined Feb 2000
11,182 Posts
It is an honor to have the CEO of GWS communicating directly with us on the E-Zone. Your products have brought me many hours of happiness, and I very much appreciate all that you are doing. I am 56 years old, and, yes, my neck does get a little sore after a 30-minute flight! But I am having so much fun that I forget about the pain in my neck. I am very happy to be able to make 30-minute flights, and do not wish to fly any longer without taking a break and changing battery packs.

You mention using the EP9070 propellor. I must be honest and tell you that the EP9070 is the only GWS product that I have used that I was not happy with. When landing my GWS Tiger Moth on grass, it often pitches forward onto its nose. Even with the motor turned off, I found that the EP9070 would break where the prop blade meets the prop hub. I broke several EP9070 props before changing to APC 8x6 and 9x6 props. The APC props do not break. Also, I have never broken any of the GWS props that are larger than 9 inches. The larger GWS props are much thicker and stronger where the blades meets the hub. My suggestion for you is that the smaller GWS props such as the EP9070 need to have more strength where the blades meet the hub.

Otherwise, I am completely satisfied with all GWS products. I am using the GWS heatsink on my GWS IPS motors along with some heatsink compound that I bought at Radio Shack. This helps the IPS motor run cool. I think that it will run a long, long time at 7.2V. I am also using GWS servos and a GWS receiver, and they work very well. I am looking forward to buying and using many more GWS products in the future. Thank you very much for helping your customers and listening to what we have to say.
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 12:07 PM
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Houston, TX, US
Joined Jun 2000
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Yes, I would like to strongly second what Dave H. said about his satisfaction with the GWS Tiger Moth and it's flight package. I think GWS has a real winner with the Tiger Moth and it's flight gear. I just came back from another fantastic flying session with my Tiger Moth. It is just great fun to do touch-and-go landings with the Moth and it's flight characteristics are very relaxing and forgiving. I've forgotten what a stall is since I've been flying the 'lil Moth. I've been flying off an asphalt surface and I guess I've been lucky with the standard propellor. No broken prop yet but I've been very careful on my landings and have been lucky enough to minimize my "nose-overs." I attribute that to the gentle flight characteristics of the Moth.

How do I feel about the Tiger Moth?

!!!

I'm anxiously looking forward to more great GWS planes. I understand an A-10 and a Zero are in the near future???

Keep up the great work!

Dave G
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 07:31 PM
Heli Bouncer
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At the Discount Clambake
Joined Feb 2001
3,931 Posts
Six triple a nimhs are the way to go!

Dave

I'm running a slighly overpowered twin GWS B motor on a repitched 10x8 in a poly film, balsa and carbonfiber tubed slowie that gets up to 25 minutes flying time, the motors dont even get warm running flat out. The plane weighs 9 oz. This plane also takes of from short grass in 10'. Mr. Lin's products are super..

Looee
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 07:35 PM
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Dallas,TX
Joined Jul 2001
1,656 Posts
Dave H,
Sounds like I need to try one of those AAA nimh packs. I stink at soldering so does anybody know who sells AAA nimh packs cheap. If the price difference is too great for pre-built, I might have to run up to walmart and pick up some and try my luck. If I go that route, which ones work best? I've seen panasonic, eveready, rayovacs.
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 07:48 PM
Heli Bouncer
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At the Discount Clambake
Joined Feb 2001
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Soldering AAA Nimhs

Hi Matt

I've only have done the R-O-V triple A's but I can recommend them for their ease of soldering. I do a 3 above, 3 below rectangular pack, gluing them, alternately aimed, with CA.

You'll need a 40 watt iron and good solder with rosin core flux, I scuff up the ends with a Scotchbright green scuffy. and then tin them before gluing the pack together, Just a touch of solder. not much bigger than 1/8". GEt on and off the cells quickly and make sure you're iron is hot.

After they're glued I tin the ends of some 18 gauge solid strand copper wire about 5/8ths" long, ends of the insulation stripped 1/8th" and bent over in a U to increase the contact area Work quickly and don't stay on the cells to long, no more than 2 or3 seconds I'f you muff a joint give it a rest and come back to it later.
Make sure that they are all in series, + to -, + to-, and so on , ( I've done this mistake twice. You can also glue the cells together with Household Goop..

Good Luck

Looee
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 08:03 PM
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Dallas,TX
Joined Jul 2001
1,656 Posts
thanks for the tips looee. I'm a clunkhead when it comes to soldering but I did buy a pretty good 40 watt iron at radio shack and have some rosin core solder so maybe I'll try one pack just to see if I can do it. I was thinking about doing up a 7 cell to get some extra power in my tigermoth. How should I go about the odd cell? Maybe 2 stacks of 3 cells with one on the end?

Matt
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 08:27 PM
Houng-wen Lin
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Shijr, Taiwan. DungGwan, China. City of Industry, California.
Joined Sep 2001
19,445 Posts
A-10 & Zero

A-10 & B2( a bigger one at 18dm sq) were delayed due to change power by push prop EP3020 to be EDF50 ducted fan unit. Sorry! But GWS want make it more like perfect.

Zero tooling is getting close to be tested. Should be avalible very soon into USA with friendly tough by no WAR! just for fun.

P-51 keep following Zero to be comming soon at the end of 2001. A great Christmas gift choice?

GWS was working on a tiny vedio transmiter & receiver with vision gagle. Laser gun, sensor taget on pilot seat, auto ejection pilot seat. So, what's going on is the "Dog Fighting" become enjoy by all RC pilots, wear pilot jacket, helmut,..... The show must be going!

When somebody was shot, no cheat! The little pilot on his aircraft will be sensing the laser short and eject the pilot with parachute!

Remote BB gun? GWS asked the famous Japanese BB gun maker to do some help. So shoting will be fun to see the target has how many holes? Can not tell the lie!

After WTC attacked. The airlines supplied knife and fork in plastics. So when we having this contest, we need keep far away from steakhouse. So, Zero's pilots will not cut themseves get hurt!
We has to ask resterant hidding their steak knives temperory!

How wounderful RC can be more fun! The winner can put sticker on the cokpet side, Germany winner get his "Blue Max" medal...., but we will not supply poison for Russion pilot, no more KGB!
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 09:17 PM
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Walled Lake, MI, USA
Joined Feb 2000
11,182 Posts
Mr. Lin, you have a wonderful sense of humor. We all need to try to enjoy a little humor even though we are all so very sad about what happened to so many innocent people on Sept. 11, and what may happen to many innocent people in the future. The only time that I can truly forget about these problems in the world is when I am flying R/C. Then I must be totally focused on flying or I will crash. GWS has many new aircraft that I must have, including the P-51. One aircraft that I would love to see GWS produce is the Fokker D-VIII. That is my favorite WWI fighter.

I had two flights today with my GWS Tiger Moth with 6-cell AAA NiMH pack. I left the throttle wide open on both flights. As I expected from yesterday's results, each flight lasted about 35 minutes before the aircraft would no longer maintain altitude. I am very happy to be able to fly for more than half an hour at full throttle with cells that can be bought at the local discount store.

Matt, I had never made my own battery pack until Hitec-Redneck convinced me that I really needed a 6-cell AAA NiMH pack that would fit the TM. I don't know if you can get one already built for this special application. The best fit for the TM battery opening is a pair of end-to-end, 3-cell "pyramids." I was not confident about directly soldering three pairs of cells end-to-end, so I connected them with short lengths of wire before folding them end-to-end and taping them. But Danal Estes has convinced me to try another pack soldering the cells end-to-end. I'm using Eveready 700mAh AAA NiMH cells because they are available locally at WalMart and because others have reported that their performance is virtually identical to the 720mAh Sanyo AAAs. So far, I couldn't ask for any better performance. I'm not sure how I would do a 7-cell pack to fit the TM battery opening. I am very happy with the 6-cell performance, and believe that by sticking with 7.2V that motor life will be extended.
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 10:00 PM
Heli Bouncer
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At the Discount Clambake
Joined Feb 2001
3,931 Posts
Matt

Dave has more experience with cell soldering packs for the Tigermoth, my plane is kinda like a Duskstik with a thinner wing and airfoil. The Energisers are pretty good according to post's I've read, I bought the R-O-V's 'cause they were the only AAA at the time at WalMart. The Radio Shack soldering iron is the same one I bought, It's not Weller quality but it has the capacity to solder AA and AE's. I'm not so sure about seven cells, part of the reason we can use six is the weight and wing loading are still favorable, ( Most of these planes are in the 5 to 3.something range of Oz. to Sq. foot.) and the GWS motors run these fine at 7 volts.
Today I climbed my BUD to almost-too-hard-to-see, altitude on the same R-O-V pack that flies my Damselfli.


Looee
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Old Sep 30, 2001, 10:48 PM
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Folsom,Ca,USA
Joined Apr 2001
992 Posts
Dear GWS4CEo


One of the other nice things about electric flying is that the people doing it are more intelligent!

I congratulate you on your great sense of humour also!

As far as one hour flight time No Problem for me
I can do every acrobatic I can do ( 4 times ) in 10 minutes!!!!!!

Regards

Dave Wick
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Old Oct 01, 2001, 04:04 AM
Here's My 2
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Kingsland Arkansas, USA
Joined Feb 2001
150 Posts
I've flown my Moth so much that I thought for sure the motor would give out but it's going strong as ever and I estimate the total time running is well over 10 hours. Great little plane that Moth and I understand it is the first of many to be made available. I hope they get an SE-5A in the works.
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Old Oct 01, 2001, 04:33 AM
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Muah's Avatar
Singapore
Joined Jan 2001
736 Posts
whoa....half an hour of flying!!! that s gonna give the 'gas' guys something to think about. gonna get mysef some 720 mAh packs...... =) only problem is can someone post a pic or describe how one attach the battery to the plane? flew my TM yesterday the first time but way too much wind and she was just thrown around, but she sure has potential compared to my Full-bodied J3!!
ah Mr. GWS......you are gonna get me in trouble!!! so much planes to buy so little time...and so little money!! =P

thanks in advance.....
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