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Old Jul 27, 2012, 10:59 PM
Epilepsy Awareness Month
Chap1012's Avatar
United States, MA, Malden
Joined Mar 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UNGN View Post
+1 on the Nanotech 160's for the Champ. It really doesn't need better batteries.

When i put tail surfaces on, I don't use CA, which dries hard & Brittle, but instead use a good foam glue like UHU por that remain flexible.

I also reinforce the areas where the tail wheel, control horns mount and the strip of foam that connects the elevator halves together with clear, Blisterpack plastic. This doesn't add much weight, but really ups the strength.

And I for the lower hinge on the rudder, I slot in a piece of Floppy disk, to replace the foam hinge.

Doing this makes the control surfaces much stronger than stock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidterrell80 View Post
A brilliant idea! Thanks for sharing.

I cut up the static-free bag that my last receiver arrived in... it's good material but yours is better, I think.
Hi Guys,,..newb here obviously. I was lost at "Floppy disk." Are these the same discs (the square discs) that went into the old PC's?

Mike.
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Old Jul 27, 2012, 11:36 PM
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DeBary, FL
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Originally Posted by Chap1012 View Post
Hi Guys,,..newb here obviously. I was lost at "Floppy disk." Are these the same discs (the square discs) that went into the old PC's? Mike.
Mylar. Extremely-extremely durable. They make drumheads outta that stuff.

Very clever 'recycling'.
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Old Jul 28, 2012, 12:21 AM
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Southlake, TX
Joined Jan 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chap1012 View Post
Hi Guys,,..newb here obviously. I was lost at "Floppy disk." Are these the same discs (the square discs) that went into the old PC's?

Mike.
Yep. Break open a 3.5" Floppy disk and there is enough hinge material for many planes. From 23 years of obsolete computers I have a lifetime supply of hinge material.

Infact, the AS3X on my SBACH tore up all of the foam/tape hinges on the OTHER aileron (I Flopply disked one wing a few weeks ago), so i have to redo it before I fly it again.

I've attached some pictures of Champ reinforcement to help make a Champ bomb proof.
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Old Jul 28, 2012, 12:44 AM
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Oregon
Joined Jan 2004
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I've done the floppy disk hinges for years on all my park flyers.

what I found that works best for me is to cut the hinge to the size I need, then fine sand all the black coating off of it, so it looks somewhat transparent, then I take the sharp tip of a new #11 xacto knife blade and prick a few holes on each side of the hinge that gets glued into the rudder/elevator/aileron surfaces.

I've always glued them in with medium CA, using my fingers to pinch/clamp the gluing surface together for 30 seconds or so, just enough for the glue to set up on it's own, I don't use accelerator, and never have had one come loose
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Old Jul 28, 2012, 11:38 AM
Epilepsy Awareness Month
Chap1012's Avatar
United States, MA, Malden
Joined Mar 2008
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Cool,,..Thanks so much Guys. It's great to learn something new everyday. A floppy disc...lol.

Mike.
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 09:02 PM
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Anyone else ever toss their Champ around like a glider without the battery in? We had nice steady wind today, and I could make her sail super slow and almost hover with a gentle toss. got me thinking about hooking up a super light, low power batter to run just the control surfaces and not the motor and try to soar it on windy days. Any ideas on such a battery? The stock batt is about 4.15g according to the HZ website. Might have to find something for another purpose and put a connector on it..... Maybe from a tiny camera or other device? How would i know if it would work?
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 09:40 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Canada, AB, Edmonton
Joined Dec 2011
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Maybe just disconnect the motor at the brick... or take it right out... and use the stock battery... or the 70mah lipos like my ScoutCX uses... I seem to remember they're not much more than 2 1/2 grams. You'll probably need that little bit of weight under there anyway for it to balance and fly properly.
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 09:49 PM
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http://www.microflight.com/Online-Catalog/Bare-Cells
Found this site... Do you think the 20c version at top of page would work with the right connector soldered on? Also, i'm wondering if the flight /soaring nature on the Champ minus battery is due more to the balance than the weight... Maybe if I mounted the battery just aft of the batt compartment to create the same balance point as sans battery...?
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 04:54 AM
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The one on the top has only 20mAh, I don't think that's enough, even for mostly soaring.

Also, as No49 mentioned, the COG may well be a problem with a very light battery, and will shift to the rear.
You'd need to mount the batt as far in front as possible to counter that, and probably still add ballast to the nose, negating your weight advantage.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
The one on the top has only 20mAh, I don't think that's enough, even for mostly soaring.

Also, as No49 mentioned, the COG may well be a problem with a very light battery, and will shift to the rear.
You'd need to mount the batt as far in front as possible to counter that, and probably still add ballast to the nose, negating your weight advantage.
Yeah, but what I'm saying is that with NO battery in the plane, it glides better than any strophoam toy glider you've ever seen. The battery in, it glides more nose down and requires more speed to stay up.... So the plane glides to the ground pretty quick. The goal is to get control of the surfaces while keeping the glide characteristics of the no-battery-in-it Champ. Would 20mah power the control surfaces servo for any length of time if you used no power?
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 11:08 AM
TjW
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Maybe you should measure where the CG is with and without the battery.

How a glider performs doesn't change with weight, except for Reynolds number effects, where slower generally makes things more draggy.

However, the speed at which it gets any particular performance point (best L/D, minimum sink and so forth) should scale with the square root of the change in weight.

So (rough figures) 50 gram airplane, 5 gram battery, is a weight change of about a tenth.
The square root of 1.1 is around 1.04, so it should glide about four percent faster with the battery in than out. (And sink four percent faster, as well) But the L/D should be the same.

If your CG is way forward with the battery in, then you'll need a lot of up elevator to keep the nose up, and that will add drag.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Mikeamondo View Post
Yeah, but what I'm saying is that with NO battery in the plane, it glides better than any strophoam toy glider you've ever seen. ((snipped)) Would 20mah power the control surfaces servo for any length of time if you used no power?
If you want to play motor glider go play motor glider. On the ground, find out what throttle setting just starts the motor turning. Launch, go up as high as you dare, go to that 'lowest running' setting, and see how long you can fly it. I did 18 mins with Champ that normally flies for 7 minutes, and 40 minutes with Slow Stick that normally runs for 10.

The potential hazard for either is that you don't really know when you'll hit LVC and lose all power and have -only- surface control to bring it back.

Here's the HH answer to the 'UM glider' market: http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...nf-EFLU1280#t1 It's meant to be towed by the Carbon Cub, much larger/stronger than Champ. (I think it's not actually available yet - HH is still dealing with the CC 'servo debacle.')

My point is that gliders look that way for a reason. Champ and CC are utility/pickups trucks compared to real gliders. You can do 'a bunch' with Champ to make it more glideable but without major rework only up to a point. Wing, tail, fuse shape, all wrong.

Champ might be fun to change wing, remove LG, change to SMALLER lighter motor, sand the fuse down till it's 'round,' and it'd make a pretty good motor glider.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 03:34 PM
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I think you may be overthinking it a bit. I just enjoyed the slow, stable, looooonnngg glide the battery-less Champ gave me.... thought it would be cool if I could raise the nose as the wind picked up to see if it would climb and glide.... and maybe S turn back and forth in the wind. For the few bucks a small battery might cost, it could be fun expirament. If I could use a battery under 1g, for example, I think it might be close enough to the Champs "empty" weight....

Anyone want to humor me and help me figure out the smallest battery that would run the control surfaces only, without powering up the motor at all, for at least 15 minutes or so? How do I figure out how long 20mah would last, for example?
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Old Aug 03, 2012, 04:00 AM
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Canada, MB, Winnipeg
Joined May 2010
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Well, I usually see around 40-60mA for just moving my servos/running the RX on idle (no motor), let's be conservative and say 50mA.

20mA would net you around 24-25 minutes, (closer to 20 actually, however, remember the 75% rule for cutoff/RX powering).

I'd go at least 30mA to be safe - you don't want to brown out the RX!

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Old Aug 06, 2012, 06:38 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
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LED mod progress

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...ostcount=16427


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