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Old May 10, 2012, 09:38 AM
'tis nothing
shunyata's Avatar
United States, CA, Napa
Joined Dec 2011
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Originally Posted by mozzartusm View Post
I'm thinking its the tail feathers. I have thought since day one that they didn't look aligned. I got them back apart and will try to get a better fit with them. Could you tell me more about lateral balance?
Yeah, mine are not perfectly aligned as well. I trimmed the mount during assembly but still ended up off a bit. I did better with my son's Bixler.

As for lateral trim, I noticed that mine would always lean to one side when I set it on the floor. The initial cause was the washers in the nose were glued in off center. Fixed that by removing them.

Lateral balance: insert the battery and other gear in the plane as if ready to fly, then with the plane sitting on a level surface, raise the wings level and see if it tips freely to either side. If the balance is very close, you're good. If it always falls to one side, tape some weight to the lighter wing near the tip. A penny or a nickel, until you get it balanced. Mine didn't need any weight. My son's Bixler has a nickel taped near the tip of one wing.

Dat's about it!
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Old May 10, 2012, 10:15 AM
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United States, FL, Clearwater
Joined Aug 2011
1,595 Posts
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Originally Posted by Maddmax View Post
Looks like a really nice area to fly in Vince. Now go get some beach shots for us Northern boys!!!
Too windy and too many people on the beach down here. Something about being a tourist town. The laws won't even let you fly kites sometimes depending on how crowded it is let alone an RC plane.

Maybe I can go down where Rocky fly's his planes.
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Old May 10, 2012, 12:53 PM
Fixed and rotary wing flyer
United States, CA, Newark
Joined Sep 2011
161 Posts
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Originally Posted by fabric8 View Post
I received my Bixler and finished assembling the fuselage. One thing I noticed was that the stock prop adapter had marring on it, like someone had used a pair of pliers on it. I spun the motor and could see that the shaft has a slight bend I'm wondering if I got a return.

I tried to remove the motor, but the motor wires are stuck with the hotglue on the motor mount. So I gave up on that. I went ahead and cut off the stock prop adapter right where it ends on the shaft.

Now that I spin the motor with the rest of the shaft cut off, I can still see that the shaft is bent very slightly. I'm thinking about trying to straighten it with a pair of pliers by hand, but I'm worried I might break off the motor mount. Should I even bother?

Here's another problem I'm running into. I tried to mount a 2.3mm prop adapter onto the shaft, but it doesn't fit. I tried another one and same thing. I took the plane today to a hobby store to buy another 2.3mm prop adapter (thinking that the ones I had weren't machined properly. The guy measured the shaft and it turns out its 2.36mm. He couldn't get the prop adapters to fit onto the shaft even by trying to pry the prop adapter apart.

Should I drill out the hole on the prop adapter to fit the shaft?

This is really annoying. 1st, the shaft is slightly bent, 2nd, the shaft is larger than 2.3mm.

What are my options?
Anyone?
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:16 PM
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Prof100's Avatar
Canton, Michigan USA
Joined Jul 2007
16,250 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by fabric8 View Post
Anyone?
See my comments in your original poste below.
You said:
I received my Bixler and finished assembling the fuselage. One thing I noticed was that the stock prop adapter had marring on it, like someone had used a pair of pliers on it. I spun the motor and could see that the shaft has a slight bend I'm wondering if I got a return.
COMMENT: CAN'T TELL YOU IF THE PLANE WAS A RETURN OR NOT. THERE IS JUST EVIDENCE IT WAS TAMPERED WITH BEFORE YOU GOT IT. IF IT IS BENT YOU CAN EITHER REPLACE THE MOTOR OR STRAIGTHEN THE SHAFT. I WOULD REPLACE THE MOTOR BUT THAT'S ME. IF YOU CHOOSE TO TRY TO STRAIGHTEN THE SHAFT YOU SHOULD REMOVE THE MOTOR AND THEN PRESS OUT THE SHAFT, STRAIGHTEN, REASSEMBLE AND THEN REINSTALL IN THE PLANE.

REMOVING AND REPLACING THE MOTOR HAS BEEN COVERED NUMEROUS TIMES IN THIS THREAD. USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION BUT IN BRIEF YOU PART THE FUSELAGE HALVES USING KITCHEN KNIFE. WIGGLE THE MOTOR UNTIL THE GLUE THAT HOLDS IT IN BREAKS LOOSE. DISCONNECT THE MOTOR WIRES (MARK FIRST). REVERSE PROCEDURE TO REINSTALL. I USED PLUMBER GOOP TO GLUE IN THE MOTOR BUT TACK IT WITH QUICK DRYING HOT GLUE.

I tried to remove the motor, but the motor wires are stuck with the hotglue on the motor mount. So I gave up on that. I went ahead and cut off the stock prop adapter right where it ends on the shaft.

Now that I spin the motor with the rest of the shaft cut off, I can still see that the shaft is bent very slightly. I'm thinking about trying to straighten it with a pair of pliers by hand, but I'm worried I might break off the motor mount. Should I even bother?

Here's another problem I'm running into. I tried to mount a 2.3mm prop adapter onto the shaft, but it doesn't fit. I tried another one and same thing. I took the plane today to a hobby store to buy another 2.3mm prop adapter (thinking that the ones I had weren't machined properly. The guy measured the shaft and it turns out its 2.36mm. He couldn't get the prop adapters to fit onto the shaft even by trying to pry the prop adapter apart.

COMMENT: THE SHAFT IS A 2.3 MM. BUY A REAL 2.3 MM COLLET ADAPTER. HEADSUPRC.COM CARRIES THEM.

Should I drill out the hole on the prop adapter to fit the shaft?

COMMENT: NO, IT WILL PROBABLY END UP WITH A WOBBLE.

This is really annoying. 1st, the shaft is slightly bent, 2nd, the shaft is larger than 2.3mm.

What are my options?
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ajbaker View Post
First, in defense of Prof100, he is great at explaining things. Sometimes, I have to get him to explain things for me because I get too technical or I just get in too big a hurry. So, with all due respect to my friend Prof100, I will try to explain what he means (I hope). Maybe that will help even the score a bit for all the times he has helped me.
Ok. Here goes.
A typical prop has 2 sides (I know, obvious). The names are what is confusing. One side is where you put in the tiny round adapter ring (or insert). That is referred to as the "insert" side (I guess you could call it the "adapter ring" side, too) which he says is where you should be reaming after you choose an adapter ring.
The other side of the prop is called (get ready for this......) the "non-insert side". I knew you would get a chuckle out of that. Of course, it could be a tiny bit off center, too. What he is suggesting is that the reaming should be done on the insert side of the prop (you are really reaming the adapter ring). Another reference would be that the "non-insert" side of the prop almost always goes toward the front of the plane (yup, even on pushers). I am certain that if he was standing next to you, he could explain it all in less than a minute. I hope all this helps.
AJ
Thanks AJ! But if you look back starting here, you can see where the confusion came from:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...2#post21452023

I asked if it was OK to ream out the prop itself instead of using a ring, since all rings with the TGS prop are too small to use on the stock shaft (with no way to fix that). You said yes; you do that. But Prof100 said no; you need to use the insert.
"You want to use the insert because the insert side is a controlled dimension and it is the hole that is truest to center line. The other side is not. So if you ream the non-insert side it could be off center."

So he said you must use the insert, but then in the next sentence talks about reaming. You can't ream the adapter ring since the outside diameter of the rings is already smaller than the prop hole. And, then in post 14731 and 14780, he implies reaming the actual prop (not the adapter ring). So I think his confusion caused my confusion. Confused?
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ajbaker View Post
Good question. I do not know.
AJ
It seems maybe one company makes EMP, Turnigy, and many others. This one:
http://xingyaohua.en.gongchang.com/product
http://sxicl3082.en.china.cn/About-Us/

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=18
"It seems to me that certain companies [like Shenzhen Xingyaohua Industry] make a whole mass of generic motors, and simply label them with the name of whichever distributor buys 'em [HXT, XYH, EMP, Hextronic, Pelikan Ray, Turnigy, Dynam, Tacon, Exceed, Aeronuts...........]"
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:30 PM
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Canton, Michigan USA
Joined Jul 2007
16,250 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianL View Post
Thanks AJ! But if you look back starting here, you can see where the confusion came from:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...2#post21452023

I asked if it was OK to ream out the prop itself instead of using a ring, since all rings with the TGS prop are too small to use on the stock shaft (with no way to fix that). You said yes; you do that. But Prof100 said no; you need to use the insert.
"You want to use the insert because the insert side is a controlled dimension and it is the hole that is truest to center line. The other side is not. So if you ream the non-insert side it could be off center."

So he said you must use the insert, but then in the next sentence talks about reaming. You can't ream the adapter ring since the outside diameter of the rings is already smaller than the prop hole. And, then in post 14731 and 14780, he implies reaming the actual prop (not the adapter ring). So I think his confusion caused my confusion. Confused?
I am confused and I re-size the prop mounting hole to fit the collet shaft sizes all the time whether I am using APC or TGS props. In both cases I select the little round insert that has a inner diameter smaller than the collet shaft outer diameter. Next, I CA glue that insert into the prop. Let dry. Then I ream that little insert until it fits the shaft outer diameter. DONE.
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Last edited by Prof100; May 10, 2012 at 05:25 PM.
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:39 PM
Fixed and rotary wing flyer
United States, CA, Newark
Joined Sep 2011
161 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof100 View Post
[I]COMMENT: THE SHAFT IS A 2.3 MM. BUY A REAL 2.3 MM COLLET ADAPTER. HEADSUPRC.COM CARRIES THEM.

Should I drill out the hole on the prop adapter to fit the shaft?
[I]COMMENT: NO, IT WILL PROBABLY END UP WITH A WOBBLE.
Thanks Prof. The (2)2.3mm prop adapters I bought were in fact from HEADSUPRC.COM - and they don't fit. And the one I bought from the LHS that was also 2.3mm didn't fit either - just like the ones from HEADSUPRC.COM.

I suspect the shaft of this motor wasn't milled down to 2.3mm exactly. Bad calibration perhaps. Maybe that's why the prop adapter had the marring. Maybe they had trouble getting it onto the shaft themselves.

I've been very happy with the customer service, support, and shipping time/cost from HEADSUPRC.com. Do they sell a motor that would be a direct replacement (using the existing motor mount and mounting holes) that's also affordable, ie <$20?)
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Old May 10, 2012, 01:53 PM
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Canton, Michigan USA
Joined Jul 2007
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Originally Posted by fabric8 View Post
Thanks Prof. The (2)2.3mm prop adapters I bought were in fact from HEADSUPRC.COM - and they don't fit. And the one I bought from the LHS that was also 2.3mm didn't fit either - just like the ones from HEADSUPRC.COM.

I suspect the shaft of this motor wasn't milled down to 2.3mm exactly. Bad calibration perhaps. Maybe that's why the prop adapter had the marring. Maybe they had trouble getting it onto the shaft themselves.

I've been very happy with the customer service, support, and shipping time/cost from HEADSUPRC.com. Do they sell a motor that would be a direct replacement (using the existing motor mount and mounting holes) that's also affordable, ie <$20?)
The shaft was probably mushroomed in mfg. Anyway, moving on. HeadsupRC doesn't appear to have what you need. To clear the prop (6x4) you need a higher KV motor. Or you buy the adjustable mount from him and go with lower KV and swing a bigger prop.

That said, a 2212-06 motor with 2200 kv is the defacto standard outrunner. RCtimer has them.
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...wt&goodsid=116
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Last edited by Prof100; May 10, 2012 at 10:09 PM.
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:07 PM
Argue for your limitations
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Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabric8 View Post
Anyone?
Sure. Try drilling it (probably would be a tiny bit off center, though). Then, straighten the shaft. Finally, in all cases, carefully balance the prop. If it all fails, simply order another motor. If it was me, I would order a motor immediately if things went south. I hope this helps.
I apologize for missing your original post. We are not trying to avoid you in any way. This thread moves so fast, a post can fall through the cracks once in a while. You did the right thing, though, reposting your question.
AJ
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:16 PM
Argue for your limitations
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Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
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Canceled.
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:19 PM
Argue for your limitations
ajbaker's Avatar
Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
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Good stuff

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianL View Post
It seems maybe one company makes EMP, Turnigy, and many others. This one:
[url]http://xingyaohua.en.gongchang.com/product[/url]
http://sxicl3082.en.china.cn/About-Us/

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=18

"It seems to me that certain companies [like Shenzhen Xingyaohua Industry] make a whole mass of generic motors, and simply label them with the name of whichever distributor buys 'em [HXT, XYH, EMP, Hextronic, Pelikan Ray, Turnigy, Dynam, Tacon, Exceed, Aeronuts...........]"
Your research is well done. And, drkiwi is a highly respected source.
AJ
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:28 PM
Argue for your limitations
ajbaker's Avatar
Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
8,421 Posts
Sizing a prop

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianL View Post
Thanks AJ! But if you look back starting here, you can see where the confusion came from:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...2#post21452023

I asked if it was OK to ream out the prop itself instead of using a ring, since all rings with the TGS prop are too small to use on the stock shaft (with no way to fix that). You said yes; you do that. But Prof100 said no; you need to use the insert.
"You want to use the insert because the insert side is a controlled dimension and it is the hole that is truest to center line. The other side is not. So if you ream the non-insert side it could be off center."

So he said you must use the insert, but then in the next sentence talks about reaming. You can't ream the adapter ring since the outside diameter of the rings is already smaller than the prop hole. And, then in post 14731 and 14780, he implies reaming the actual prop (not the adapter ring). So I think his confusion caused my confusion. Confused?
No. But, I can understand your point of view. So, anytime you see a conflict in information between Prof100 and me, I suggest that you follow his advice. In this case, IMO, his explanation is much better than mine. Good luck and keep us both informed of what finally worked for you.
AJ
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:32 PM
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Canton, Michigan USA
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.........gone fishing
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Last edited by Prof100; May 10, 2012 at 02:48 PM.
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Old May 10, 2012, 02:39 PM
Argue for your limitations
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Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
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2500GENE ripped us off. He already got all the fish.
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