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Old Mar 11, 2010, 04:09 PM
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Birmingham/Tuscaloosa, AL
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SuperCub LP BNF vs. Apprentice 15e RTF...opinions wanted

Hey guys, looking for some insight on these two models compared against each other. Which ever one I choose will be my first plane, and just to throw it out there I do feel like I could fly a 4ch trainer. But to get to the point:

SuperCub LP BNF can be bought for $170, then a DX5e TX for about $60, a backup Zippy li-po from hobbyking for around $30 and a better charging/discharging system for around $60...so all together that's around $320.

Apprentice 15e RTF is $299, then add in $60 for charging/discharging system and around $35 for a backup battery...so that comes to about $394.

Which ever plane I get will eventually be used for an AP platform. So here's my question and if anyone can answer one or all it would be greatly appreciated.

1. Which one would you say is the best value and would you recommend for my application.

2. With the SuperCub LP BNF and the 2.4 GHz RX that comes with it, can I use one of the extra channels on the RX to operate an extra servo for pic taking with the DX5e instead of the X-Port?
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 05:01 PM
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Xpress..'s Avatar
Joined Oct 2007
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1. Super Cub LP BNF.

2. Don't be putting expensive camera gear onto it untill you know how the plane will fly. You don't want to pile drive an expensive camera in on your first few flights

Fly the plane untill you're COMPLETELY comfortable flying it, which can take anywhere from a handful of flights, to months even.

Once you feel you're confident, I'd add in ailerons, and learn how to fly it with those, THEN you can probably start to modify the plane to hold a camera (I'd probably put a Nikon Coolpix S203 on it- small camera and light too with good resolution). And I don't think you can use the X-Port to take pictures, unless you can wire up a servo to operate off of the X-Port jack
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 05:20 PM
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United States, VA, Purcellville
Joined Aug 2009
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Just a couple comments:

1) Whichever you go with, I'd recommend getting a DX6i over the 5e. The 6i is such a superior controller, you just don't even know until you've tried using both. Expandability, user friendliness, and even resale value. You can't go wrong with a DX6i. -That might mean getting the PNP Apprentice and building it up a little, or the BNF SC.

2) You really can't go wrong with either of these planes as a trainer, but IMO, the Apprentice is the superior airplane. -But it's also more expensive, but you get what you pay for.

3) Learn to fly first. Once you get that down, play with the cameras. You'll have your hands plenty full with flying for the first few months anyways.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 05:55 PM
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USA, FL, St Petersburg
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The SuperCub because its cooler and is my superior plane =)
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 05:59 PM
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I am about as new as they get but kind of wish I had bought the apprentice right off the bat like you are thinking. I may be wrong but if you pick a wind free day in a wide open field I think you will do fine especially if you have a flight plan in mind and take it to altitude first.

These things are really not that hard to fly if you use some common sense and you already did that by asking questions here first and flying second.

Good luck.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 06:58 PM
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Thank you guys for the responses. I wouldn't be putting a good camera on it for quite some time, but I might put the keychain cam I have on it just for fun when I start out. And I've got another question now that comes from my experience on the sim lately:

When flying on my G5 sim, I love how the 4ch planes fly, turn, bank, etc. and how you can really fly without using the rudder. But with the 3ch SuperCub and 3ch models on the sim you only have rudder and elevators and the turning, banking, etc. is quite different. How much of a difference is the 3ch versus the 4ch in the real world when it comes to turns, banking, etc.? What I mean is does it turn easily or does a 3ch SuperCub take a lot more airspace to perform turns that a 4ch can do?

This is what I think is keeping me from buying one over the other right away because I want to know about these flight characteristics.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 07:06 PM
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Portland, OR
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I have both and do AP with a gumstick cam.

Start with the SC and learn to fly it. It can do AP fine and also can accomodate smaller fields and parks. Once you can handle this without blinking, move onto the Apprentice.

The Apprentice is larger but with experience, can be flown in smaller fields. The reason I do not recommend it for a first plane is that it is much larger, heavier and considerably faster than the SC and it can get away from you very, very quickly. You will be much sadder if you crash this than an SC.

I now teach my family on the SC; fly the Apprentice a lot with a heavier camera; and use my souped up Easystar to fly fast and sail on the same battery..so many great choices.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 07:11 PM
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Canada, BC, Williams Lake
Joined Jan 2010
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A couple things . if your looking for a good little charger . this one works breat when its back in stock at HK


http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...idproduct=7028

If you've enough G5 experience i dont see a prob flying the 4 channel . a friend has the apprentice and it flys great . Go DX6i as stated above if you can then you dont run into problems with new planes and flaps and retracts exc.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 07:22 PM
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Go buy the apprentice and fly it.

In a real high wing trainer(Cessna skylane) I was taught to turn the plane with ailerons and apply opposite rudder to keep the tail from sliding. Of course there were instruments for me to glance down at which help a lot. Rc planes don't have that.

Go buy an older version of MS flight sim which will run on most any PC. Switch to airport view and fly the skylane. Beats any of these goofy Rc sims hands down.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 07:23 PM
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United States, VA, Purcellville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdwood View Post
Thank you guys for the responses. I wouldn't be putting a good camera on it for quite some time, but I might put the keychain cam I have on it just for fun when I start out. And I've got another question now that comes from my experience on the sim lately:

When flying on my G5 sim, I love how the 4ch planes fly, turn, bank, etc. and how you can really fly without using the rudder. But with the 3ch SuperCub and 3ch models on the sim you only have rudder and elevators and the turning, banking, etc. is quite different. How much of a difference is the 3ch versus the 4ch in the real world when it comes to turns, banking, etc.? What I mean is does it turn easily or does a 3ch SuperCub take a lot more airspace to perform turns that a 4ch can do?

This is what I think is keeping me from buying one over the other right away because I want to know about these flight characteristics.
If you are spending lots of time on a simulator, as well as doing lots of reading on here, chances are you can go straight into a 4-channel if you wanted too.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 08:00 PM
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United States, CA, Sacramento
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There is quite a bit of difference turning with rudder vs aileron. When you turn with rudder, you hold the stick through the course of the turn. With aileron, you roll the plane, and pull the elevator, then roll back. Much more involved. It seems easy on a sim, but in real life, its a bit of a learning curve. I would say get the BNF Super cub, and later, you can add ailerons. (The BNF Rx has the port to do this). There is a series of vids to show you how to correctly make ailerons (and covering with monocote, if desired). Start here:

5-Cutting out Ailerons Part 1 - Building HZ Super Cub from Scratch (9 min 23 sec)


Wait until you fly the plane a few times before making the mod. But this will be better choice since the plane is much more prone to abuse, is lighter, and is smaller than the apprentice. If you decide to get the Apprentice, you will not go wrong, but you will most likely want to have a buddy box with an experienced pilot attached since the plane is much faster, bigger and a lot prettier (won't want to beat it up.)

Or you could start out with a $99 mini super cub, and then buy the Apprentice, but that may be a little risky too.

And another beginner option is the GWS E-starter ARF. This (assembly) kit is under $40, but you will need Rx, ESC, battery and servos. This plane can be flown with rudder or aileron steering (or both). The down side is most LHS's don't stock replacement parts.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 08:06 PM
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Birmingham/Tuscaloosa, AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by restlessswind View Post
There is quite a bit of difference turning with rudder vs aileron. When you turn with rudder, you hold the stick through the course of the turn. With aileron, you roll the plane, and pull the elevator, then roll back. Much more involved. It seems easy on a sim, but in real life, its a bit of a learning curve. I would say get the BNF Super cub, and later, you can add ailerons. (The BNF Rx has the port to do this). There is a series of vids to show you how to correctly make ailerons (and covering with monocote, if desired). Start here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRYb6Ta8zhE

Wait until you fly the plane a few times before making the mod. But this will be better choice since the plane is much more prone to abuse, is lighter, and is smaller than the apprentice. If you decide to get the Apprentice, you will not go wrong, but you will most likely want to have a buddy box with an experienced pilot attached since the plane is much faster, bigger and a lot prettier (won't want to beat it up.)

Or you could start out with a $99 mini super cub, and then buy the Apprentice, but that may be a little risky too.

And another beginner option is the GWS E-starter ARF. This (assembly) kit is under $40, but you will need Rx, ESC, battery and servos. This plane can be flown with rudder or aileron steering (or both). The down side is most LHS's don't stock replacement parts.

Thank you for the video. So how about this question:

With the BNF in stock 3ch form, the left stick up & down is the throttle, right stick up and down is the elevator, and what stick is the rudder??? Just wondering since on the sim a 4ch rudder is on the left and 3ch rudder is on the right, and how would this "swap" if I added ailerons??? PLease let me know, as this is another puzzling thing to me.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 08:34 PM
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You will be fine. Try not to over think it. Go down to the LHS grab yourself a trainer; put it in the i air and hope for the best.
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 09:26 PM
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Canada, BC, Williams Lake
Joined Jan 2010
4,130 Posts
mdwood


Ive went like this

Bought cheap flight sim in january , got probably 5-6 hours flight time on it . Flew the PZ corsair model for it mostly ( which in my opinion isnt like the real thing ) . Got my used PZ corsair ready for it maiden . I had a plan and a pre check list . my first flight went horribly wrong . I made 4 major mistakes .
1: when doing my range check i went hit the hi low switch 5 times which left it on high rate and i never noticed uggg to touchy for a newb .
2: I didnt go 3 mistakes high only about 2 i'm pretty sure if i was 3 i would have been scared but not crashed .
3: I adjusted down elevator into it fine but when it came to the ailerons i looked down at my controller for the adjuster (aaahhh oopps ) . When i looked back it was in a downward spiral .
4: I went hard right and up (shoulda went left ) . by the time i figured it out to late inot the ground . broken motor mount , broken cowl & the wing was in 3 pieces


Glued it all back together that day . Spent sometime that night on some more aggressive planes on the sim. The next day i flew again twice both flights went well as i actually followed my checklist .
Flown 3 more times since then lost a motor and am grounded till it gets here .

i have 2 friends with G4 and about a year into it they both maidened an Apprentice and made it look easy (neither has their own plane it was 1 they bought for there dad) Both are looking for something more aggressive planes for first planes after the experience .

All this being said if you can fly and land multiple planes in G5 can make controller adjustments without looking down and can keep your nerves in check then go for the apprentice you wont be sorry


Chris
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Old Mar 11, 2010, 10:06 PM
Fly it like you stole it!
ODUsurfer's Avatar
United States, VA, Purcellville
Joined Aug 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdwood View Post
Thank you for the video. So how about this question:

With the BNF in stock 3ch form, the left stick up & down is the throttle, right stick up and down is the elevator, and what stick is the rudder??? Just wondering since on the sim a 4ch rudder is on the left and 3ch rudder is on the right, and how would this "swap" if I added ailerons??? PLease let me know, as this is another puzzling thing to me.
Stock 3-channel, the rudder will indeed be on the right stick. This is actually achieved simply by the rudder servo being plugged into the slot marked "Ailerons" on the receiver, instead of the slot typically used for rudder on a 4-channel plane, which feeds from the left stick's left-right control. (Typically marked "Rudder" on most receivers. Most receivers are by default marked for 4-channel operation.)

In order to take a 3-channel plane and make it 4-channel, you first mechanically install the ailerons and the aileron servo. Then to coordinate the electronics, the rudder servo is unplugged from the aileron slot and plugged into the rudder slot on the receiver. The aileron servo is then plugged into the aileron slot.

Hope it helps.
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