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Old Apr 22, 2011, 07:39 PM
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Joined Sep 2009
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Victor boats

I would like to add my two cents, I don't know anything about sailboats our sailing but would like to learn.I built my first VICTOR MODEL sailboat and was hooked, the kit was grate for a newbe like me I've sence built 3 VIC. boats, to me its werth it the money. You can mod the boats your self and they don't look bad with spray paint. They sure sail well in high winds, bottom lime cheap, fun to build and sail. What more could you ask for. Thanks have fun sailing.
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Old Apr 24, 2011, 06:19 PM
Registered User
Bolingbrook, IL 60490
Joined Mar 2008
106 Posts
I received my Hobby King HB-F-06 RC Sailboat Phantom-1.89m (USA Warehouse) $97.29 + $18 shipping on Thursday like the USPS said (I missed the free shipping from the US warehouse cause I blinked earlier instead of biting).

https://picasaweb.google.com/mikejbb...MikesSailboat#

I maidened yesterday morning in 15-20mph + 30gusts. Not recommended for the feint of heart. But she sailed excellently. Was able to control tilting/heeling with sail looseness. Only took on 2 tablespoons of water in about an hour of sailing. I put 3lbs 11oz (about 1.7kg) of #5 lead shot to totally fill the ballast, then just electrical taped the opening. Others epoxy the opening and I think I will too since it's super full. Could use another pound for the heavy winds. Also sealed the hatch with electrical tape but had 72mhz antennae and battery sw coming out so not totally sealed. Now I drilled a hole for those wires and will add closed cell weather striping to the hatch so no water gets in. I used packing tape over the servo cover so no leaks there. Now I drilled a 3/8" hole in the stern behind the mast connector so I can pour out any water. I filled the hole with a cork I had. I put in a bunch of those packing air filled bags and some styrofoam so she shouldn't sink. No other changes and she sails very well, even in a good wind. Oh, the lead is very expensive unless you have a better source than I did. I had to buy 25lbs of shotgun lead shot for $50 cause fishing weights were going to be $40 and if the ballast bulb breaks and the lead gets out then I would be out $40, this way I have extra in case I or my son needs it.

Now this is my first RC sailboat, but not my first real sailboat. I have a Hobie Cat's, 13feet, so very small, but has given me the needed "simulation" for the RC sailboat. So I kinda know what I'm doing in the water. I even have a Hobie 2 person kayak with a sail that I use, it's a blast, but not in high wind. So take what I say with that grain of salt. There are many bad reviews from many people who don't like the Phantom or maybe any Chinese boats. But I do, at least after this morning.

The manual is not included, but is pictured. A very similar (the same) model can be found here: http://mms.tiger.tw/upload/upload_fi...6062%20V.3.pdf

I went out to sail again today, but the lake was placid so I flew my PkZn extra 300. But in the middle of the 2nd batt, the wind started up. So then I sailed my Phantom for about an hour in 8-12mph winds. Again, it's awesome! The mod I did to take the switch and batt charge wires out a drilled hole, then seal the hole worked perfectly, no water at all.

Oh, there's one thing you should do before putting your boat in the water, and that's to turn on the Rx. She just sailed across the lake to the other side. So I walked over there and turned on the Rx and sailed her back to my chair..

What fun!!!

Mike
Hobby King HB-F-06 RC Sailboat Phantom-1.89m
ParkZone Extra 300, ParkZone Wildcat, 3' Pitts
ParkZone Sukhoi BL upgraded 2 cells, 6' EZGlider with BL launch motor and FPV camera and Tx
Super Cub BL wt moded ailerons wt Turnigy lights for night flying, Tx DX7
Function over ALL else
my photography: http://BesPhoto.com
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Old Apr 24, 2011, 07:20 PM
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Bolingbrook, IL 60490
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106 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodbark View Post
For anyone interested: My method is solid lead fill, instead of lead shot. I cut the plastic bulb open and used the inside of the halves to cast 2 male plugs then used these to make the female molds (Plaster of paris works great).

I had to wait a week for the molds to dry out before doing the lead casting which by the way was the easiest part of the process. My guess is 2.5 to 2.7 Kg. if I had filled the molds completely.
Awesome!, I may just do this as I only got 1.7kg using #5 lead shot, I should have bought the #9 that was there. I think I could have used another pound yesterday in the 15-20mph + 30gusts. Today though, the 1.7kg was perfect in the lighter winds.

Mike
Hobby King HB-F-06 RC Sailboat Phantom-1.89m
ParkZone Extra 300, ParkZone Wildcat, 3' Pitts
ParkZone Sukhoi BL upgraded 2 cells, 6' EZGlider with BL launch motor and FPV camera and Tx
Super Cub BL wt moded ailerons wt Turnigy lights for night flying, Tx DX7
Function over ALL else
my photography: http://BesPhoto.com
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Old Apr 24, 2011, 10:30 PM
Boomer1
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United States, CA, Temecula
Joined Sep 2009
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[QUOTE=mikejbb;18059428]Awesome!, I may just do this as I only got 1.7kg using #5 lead shot, I should have bought the #9 that was there. I think I could have used another pound yesterday in the 15-20mph + 30gusts. Today though, the 1.7kg was perfect in the lighter winds.
Mike


Mike
I have found a lot of folks tend to over estimate the speed of the winds they are sailing in. When I first started RC sailing, I purchased an anemometer so I could accurately determine the wind conditions I was was sailing in. I kept a log for each boat, and sail settings used in the different conditions, so that at some point, I would be able to use the information when I raced.

I found what I thought were very heavy wind condtions, were actually much lower than my estimated wind speeds. My feelings are that these boats are
best operated in winds less than 15 mph and even better less than 10 mph. That is not to say that RC boats can't successfully sail in higher winds, they can with care and skill levels to handle those conditions.

It is very difficult to get an RC sailboat safely in the water in 15 -20 mph and with gusts of 30 mph forget it. That is a lot of wind for a full size sailboat!

My point is simply this, if the winds you were sailing in that day were blowing at the speeds you estimated, you were fortunate your boat was not damaged.

I intend no disrespect, only to point out that boats of this size are not designed to be operated in those conditions.

I am sure most of the seasoned sailors on the forum would agree with this line of thinking.

Enjoy
Boomer

Here is a link to the Beaufort Scale - hope it is of interest and helpful
http://www.stormfax.com/beaufort.htm

Beaufort Wind Scale
Developed in 1805 by Sir Francis Beaufort of England
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Force Wind
(Knots) WMO
Classification Appearance of Wind Effects
On the Water On Land

0 Less than 1 = Calm Sea surface smooth and mirror-like Calm, smoke rises vertically

1 1-3 = Light Air Scaly ripples, no foam crests Smoke drift indicates wind direction, still wind vanes

2 4-6 = Light Breeze Small wavelets, crests glassy, no breaking Wind felt on face, leaves rustle, vanes begin to move

3 7-10 = Gentle Breeze Large wavelets, crests begin to break, scattered whitecaps Leaves and small twigs constantly moving, light flags extended

4 11-16 = Moderate Breeze Small waves 1-4 ft. becoming longer, numerous whitecaps Dust, leaves, and loose paper lifted, small tree branches move

5 17-21 = Fresh Breeze Moderate waves 4-8 ft taking longer form, many whitecaps, some spray Small trees in leaf begin to sway

6 22-27 = Strong Breeze Larger waves 8-13 ft, whitecaps common, more spray Larger tree branches moving, whistling in wires

7 28-33 = Near Gale Sea heaps up, waves 13-20 ft, white foam streaks off breakers Whole trees moving, resistance felt walking against wind

8 34-40 = Gale Moderately high (13-20 ft) waves of greater length, edges of crests begin to break into spindrift, foam blown in streaks Whole trees in motion, resistance felt walking against wind

9 41-47 = Strong Gale High waves (20 ft), sea begins to roll, dense streaks of foam, spray may reduce visibility Slight structural damage occurs, slate blows off roofs

10 48-55 = Storm Very high waves (20-30 ft) with overhanging crests, sea white with densely blown foam, heavy rolling, lowered visibility Seldom experienced on land, trees broken or uprooted, "considerable structural damage"

11 56-63 = Violent Storm Exceptionally high (30-45 ft) waves, foam patches cover sea, visibility more reduced

12 64+ = Hurricane Air filled with foam, waves over 45 ft, sea completely white with driving spray, visibility greatly reduced
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 10:35 AM
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Bolingbrook, IL 60490
Joined Mar 2008
106 Posts
Thanks Boomer and I accept that we don't know the wind speed by feel. And that's why I bought an anemometer a few years ago when I was flying my 1oz Heli (Blade mCX) outside in some wind where it was not supposed to be able to fly. So yes I was surprised at what wind really feels like. And I was continuously challenged about my wind speed even when I read it off the anemometer. So who knows.

But I do sail in an open area with little to stop the wind that does exist. And that day the wind was coming across the entire park before hitting the water. I fly there most every day and have taken many wind speed readings and have come to the conclusion that a few of the local weather stations I monitor are accurate. I did not bring my anemometer with me, but those local weather stations are where I came up with the wind speeds.

I forgot to mention in my previous post that she turtled all the way back to the hatch a few times. I thought I would have a submarine soon. But since the hull was sealed pretty well, only 2 tablespoons of water got in. I've changed that and now no water gets in.

And I do sail regularly my Hobie Wave 13' (a cat) with jib. I call that my "simulator" for RC sailboats. I even have flown her a few times but then I dumped over, but that takes a very constant 25 mph.

I do accept that I shouldn't have maidened that day, but I also have flown my PkZn Extra 300 in the same wind successfully many times. I did put 2 heli gyros on the Extra, and that helps in the wind a lot.

Just got a wild thought, anybody ever put a HH gyro in a sailboat to hold course. It really should work very well. But only rudder control. Well maybe a gyro could be put to keep a particular heel, not sure how. But rudder control would be easy I think.

Mike
Hobby King HB-F-06 RC Sailboat Phantom-1.89m
ParkZone Extra 300, ParkZone Wildcat, 3' Pitts
ParkZone Sukhoi BL upgraded 2 cells, 6' EZGlider with BL launch motor and FPV camera and Tx
Super Cub BL wt moded ailerons wt Turnigy lights for night flying, Tx DX7
Function over ALL else
my photography: http://BesPhoto.com
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 11:06 AM
Boomer1
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United States, CA, Temecula
Joined Sep 2009
3,441 Posts
Hey Mike
I didn't know if you were familar with the "Beaufort Wind Scale" but hoped you'd find it interesting. I remember when I first heard a guy use the Beaufort Wind Scale in discribing the conditions of the day, I really thought he was putting me on! I mean, "Beaufort Scale" sounds like something Bubba would say, or name his kid.

Anyway, it is fun to quote it from time to time to see the reaction you get from guys like me that were not aware of the Beaufort Wind Scale. Mostly you get a "huh" or "say what"? when you tell some one the wind was about a 2 on the "ol Beaufort Scale".

Anyway, I am glad your boat was not damaged. Have you done anything to secure the keel in the hull? Both of my friends Phantom's keels were very poorly fit from the factory, to the point of being ridiculous. One the guys used epoxy to bond it in place because it was so bad. Works well now. He actually bonded the mast in place too, he didn't like the fit on that either.

I don't think I would have done that, but as I mentioned below, he thinks of it as a "through away" boat.

I know we have fellow forum members that don't think much of the Phantom or the Monsoon, but in reality, the hulls are actually made quite well, so if
the owner corrects the rigging short comings, they can become a decent value. My compliant is that they use a cheap sail winch set up instead of using a
sail servo and arm. A properly designed winch system is a wonderful thing, but the HK set up is not properly designed.

I am just getting into RC flying. At some point I want to learn to fly helis. I play around with them on my GP simulator, but so far any measureable success has eluded me. Planes I can do.

I just sold my Super Cub and ordered a Flyzone Switch. My first plane was a Sky Surfer with a brushless upgraded motor. Terrific starter plane and fun for even the more experienced pilots. If you are not familar with it check out this link: http://www.bananahobby.com/1937.html

I have my eyes on a few other planes, but I need to master the ones I have before I spend any more $$ on planes.

I have a new Traxxas Summit I am not using, so I think I will put it up for sale to raise some capital for more airplanes. I love the Summit and think it is an amazing piece of engineering, but the flying bug has got me.

Hope you enjoy your boat.
Boomer
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 03:20 PM
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Bolingbrook, IL 60490
Joined Mar 2008
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Hey I have a BlitzRCWorks 2.4GHz Pitts Special from Banana Hobby. A friend bought it and smashed it up pretty good so I rebuilt it for him, but he didn't want it back. Flys OK.

No I didn't secure the keel to the hull. It seems to fit perfectly without any play. Do you think epoxy is in order just for the added strength?

Oh yes, I remember those days before any siming my airplanes. Take off (maybe) then fly around and when it's time to land, crash instead. Then I got one of those $25 usb controllers and FMS. After that winter I was an "expert" except in wind. Now I fly in any wind with my PkZn Extra 300 +2gyros. I also got realflight 5.5 for Christmas this year and boy that's really helped in the wind. And also a whole lot with my heli's. I have a HobbyKing HK500gt, very big and can fly right side up just fine. Never have tried 3d except in the sims.

But this sailboat is soooooo cool. I just don't have enough time to do it all.

I just started night flying my super cub, another blast.

I've seen the switch ads, it looks good. Like the super cub, then low wing for areobatics, very cool design.

I already have enjoyed my Phantom and hope to continue...

Mike
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 04:19 PM
Boomer1
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United States, CA, Temecula
Joined Sep 2009
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Mike
I'd say "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I suspected that some boats might not have that issue.
Hey if it fits tightly - you are good to go!

I am fortunate in that we have a 2nd residence/retreat on a golf course that has a lot of lakes, so pretty much I can sail any time the weather permits.

The guys I sail with are avid RC flyers, and started a flying club. They pooled the resources of our maintainance department, and member's skills and craved out what has become an AMA certified flying field. Posted a few pictures for you.

Anyway, we like to fly in the morning and sail in the afternoon, so overall
I am able to get the most out of my boats and aircraft.

Boomer
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 05:44 PM
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Boomer1 said "Anyway, we like to fly in the morning and sail in the afternoon"
Now that's the way it should be. I have to use grass, boy it would be nice to have a real runway.

Can the Sky Surfer take off from the lake? It doesn't look like the motor has enough power, but that would be cool too. I never quite put the pontoons on the super cub. I've had enough troubles with water and my planes since I mostly fly next to my sailing lake (retention pond). This is the 500' lake I've been in so far http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sour...=UTF8&t=h&z=16

At least some of this is on topic...

Mike
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 05:45 PM
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Bolingbrook, IL 60490
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Oh I forgot, I love the reflection pix of your Monsoon. I'm a professional photographer and you captured it perfectly.

Mike
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Old Apr 25, 2011, 06:05 PM
Boomer1
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Mike
Thank you for the kind words on the Monsoon image. Regarding the SS taking off on water; It would be interesting and at a minimum require a pair of out rigger type pontoons to keep it level during take off from the water. It would take some water proofing work to make sure no water could get in the plane.

It has the power to power to take off on grass, so I would image it would have enough power for a water take off. Some guys put landing gear on them, but it takes a toll on the planes excellent aerobatic abilities.

I am not sure if the CG of the plane would make it a good candidate for a water take off.

Boomer
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Old Apr 26, 2011, 12:29 PM
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Sorry for my ignorance, what does SS mean?
My native language is not English. I am sometimes having difficulty in finding out the meanings of abbreviations.
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Old Apr 26, 2011, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alibodrum View Post
Sorry for my ignorance, what does SS mean?
My native language is not English. I am sometimes having difficulty in finding out the meanings of abbreviations.
SS means Stainless Steel, inoxidable steel in English, acier inoxydable in French, etc.
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Old Apr 26, 2011, 01:01 PM
Boomer1
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JP is correct but in this case the "SS" was for Sky Surfer

Sorry for the confusion.
Boomer
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Old Apr 27, 2011, 08:28 PM
Boomer1
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United States, CA, Temecula
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikejbb View Post
Boomer1 said "Anyway, we like to fly in the morning and sail in the afternoon"
Now that's the way it should be. I have to use grass, boy it would be nice to have a real runway.

Can the Sky Surfer take off from the lake? It doesn't look like the motor has enough power, but that would be cool too. I never quite put the pontoons on the super cub. I've had enough troubles with water and my planes since I mostly fly next to my sailing lake (retention pond). This is the 500' lake I've been in so far http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sour...=UTF8&t=h&z=16

At least some of this is on topic...

Mike
Mike
I was shopping around and found this plane and thought you might be interested in checking it out. It is a foamie! Very cool.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=14864
The Flying Fish - Hobbyking $89 + $30 shipping to US
Spec.
Wing Span : 1070mm
Length : 883mm
Flying Weight: 750g
Servo: 4 x 9g
Motor: 1200kv Brushless Bell-Type Outrunner
ESC: 20A w/BEC
4 Channel (throttle, elevator, rudder, aileron)

Includes:
Photo Instruction Booklet
All Hardware
Tools
Glue

Required:
Your own 4 Channel TX & RX
1300mAh 3s ~ 1800mAh 3s Lipoly Battery
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Last edited by Boomer1; Apr 27, 2011 at 08:49 PM.
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