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Old Jan 02, 2013, 11:17 PM
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United States, MO, Fenton
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Originally Posted by Watdazit View Post
Just out of interest Multiplex do have a range of paints for Elapor which might also be the answer.

http://www.multiplex-rc.de/en/produc...wshopitems_pi1[action]=index&tx_lwshopitems_pi1[controller]=Product&cHash=bacee6a36fe3461784465e6168f68451
Thanks! I wonder if they are carried in the States?
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by David Hipperson View Post
Maynardr6,
Australia/US dollars is not enough of a difference to concern us.

Everything is, I suppose, in the eye (or mind) of the beholder. Why buy a Mercedes rather than a Hyundai? I realise that is a bit over simplistic but things can head in that direction. Over quite a few years in electric I have always chosen to try purchasing what I believe to be the best product I can. This is my hobby (obsession?) so why not?

Generally when quite a few motors and ESCs were actually designed and manufactured in Europe they really were consistent and totally reliable as far as I was concerned. Things changed as some manufacturers had to have their products produced in China to make them competitive. Certainly, numerous ESCs made in China nowadays are absolutely first rate but they also then make others that are built down to the very lowest price. I have seen some of those fail almost within the first time of use. So, you can only purchase what you believe is important to you whether the product is good, bad or indifferent.

As for the very high priced ESCs remember that some are aimed specifically for high power useage. Sometimes competition power set ups are drawing well in excess of 250 amps. That being the case if I were into competition I would not risk an unknown product. As I'm merely a fun flier and as this thread hinges around the Blaze or Dynamic which are only fun foamies I'm not faced with the question.
i guess i have a few questions for you here and its quite possible that we are on completely different wavelengths but anyway..

i understand that for higher specs you are obviously going to pay more money but what about when things are equal?

for example a reliable 50 amp esc made in one place costing 50 dollars vs a reliable esc from a different place costing 200 dollars. assuming both escs are rated honestly and of the same spec, what is the real, tangible benefit of the more costly esc? does it put out the same 50 amps better somehow or does it come down to a perceived price paid=quality issue?

im not being snarky i really want to know. ive always wondered about some of the huge price differences between some equally speced equipment and from what i can tell it comes down to branding.

for another example hyundai makes a very luxurious, rear wheel drive, full size sedan that is more powerful and some would say nicer than some mercedes selling for quite a bit more. to me that represents a lot of value for money but if you ask some people it will never be as good as a mercedes by simple virtue of not actually being one. so even though there is no real, tangible reason to pay more for a c-class mercedes which is arguably not as well equipped or as nice of a car as the hyundai, the person still feels like it is a better car because it is a mercedes.

is it something like that? perception of price or pedigree=value.

like you said at the end of the day its what the purchaser BELIEVES is the best product regardless of the actual product.

i hope that wasnt too meandering and you could understand what i was getting at
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 01:17 AM
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johnwohl - A Hyundai and a Mercedes will both get you from point A to point B. But the guy driving the Benz will get laid more while on the way!

Girls at the park give me way more attention when I'm flying with E-Flite or Castle than with any other brand. Hobbywing will get some Gangnam Style looks too though.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 03:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Left Coast DJ View Post

Girls at the park give me way more attention when I'm flying with E-Flite or Castle than with any other brand. Hobbywing will get some Gangnam Style looks too though.
what do.. i dont even..

slowclap.gif
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by johnwohl View Post
what do.. i dont even..

slowclap.gif
Just teasing.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 02:49 PM
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Australia, NSW, Braidwood
Joined Nov 2008
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Is it just me.....?

This plane does not like to fly slowly and I have a few problems landing. The only times I have crashed (since I learned to launch it properly) is on low level, slow turns trying to line up too land when it stalls. Both times I sustained very little damage, a few dents in the wing leading edge and a cracked wing tip.

I land on a 50m grass strip (extended it recently for the Blaze) that has long grass on the entry and exit. I generally have no choice when there is a cross wind. I find it difficult to slow this plane down even with spoilers without loosing control and having to fire up and go around again. By loosing control I mean if I am slow and too early for the landing strip, a small blip of the motor to reach the strip will just lift the nose and then to get back down the speed builds up as I lower the nose again.

Any tips?
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 04:13 PM
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You might try very minute throttle input to turn the brake off. The windmilling prop will help slow it down. I also make very flat(uncoordinated looking) turns when flying slow. If you let a wing dip when slow it will completely stop flying and cause you to spin.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 05:09 PM
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John,
In reply to your post regarding ESCs. You talk about things being equal but I have to ask how do you know that these ESCs are equal. Not just you but any of us.

Without abusing the Chinese we are perhaps talking about two differing things. Many of the European manufacturers started out as modellers (I know Astro in the US were the same)who had the interest and skills to develop products for their own use. Obviously, fellow modellers wanted to buy and so the businesses developed. Bear in mind that I've been in electrics since before ESCs even existed in model form. Those modeller/manufacturers hold on to their business and sales in part because of their reputation and the products they make have to be reliable or their customers cease buying.

The Chinese approach is somewhat different in that their principal interest is selling a saleable product. Some can be exceptionally good but some are merely built to the lowest price regardless! Equally obvious several of the Europeans have chosen to design their products but have them made in China for reasons of cost. Usually though they insist on maintaining their design specs. But we do see then what appears to be superficially identical products under different names and much cheaper prices. Do we assume these to really be identical or have components that are at lower standards been used to reduce the price?

So unless you the buyer wants to purchase one of each test them yourself and then dismantle to double check you'd never know.

I use numerous ESCs from all sorts of sources and I've been burnt and bought the junk just like everyone else. I don't buy from those manufacturers - my decision.

Just to let you know I drive a Hyundai at the moment and it is fine but I've got to be totally honest and say it isn't as good as our old BMW.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Fentonflyers View Post
You might try very minute throttle input to turn the brake off. The windmilling prop will help slow it down. I also make very flat(uncoordinated looking) turns when flying slow. If you let a wing dip when slow it will completely stop flying and cause you to spin.
At present I have a hard brake on the motor. Perhaps I should change to a soft brake.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by David Hipperson View Post
John,
In reply to your post regarding ESCs. You talk about things being equal but I have to ask how do you know that these ESCs are equal. Not just you but any of us.

Without abusing the Chinese we are perhaps talking about two differing things. Many of the European manufacturers started out as modellers (I know Astro in the US were the same)who had the interest and skills to develop products for their own use. Obviously, fellow modellers wanted to buy and so the businesses developed. Bear in mind that I've been in electrics since before ESCs even existed in model form. Those modeller/manufacturers hold on to their business and sales in part because of their reputation and the products they make have to be reliable or their customers cease buying.

The Chinese approach is somewhat different in that their principal interest is selling a saleable product. Some can be exceptionally good but some are merely built to the lowest price regardless! Equally obvious several of the Europeans have chosen to design their products but have them made in China for reasons of cost. Usually though they insist on maintaining their design specs. But we do see then what appears to be superficially identical products under different names and much cheaper prices. Do we assume these to really be identical or have components that are at lower standards been used to reduce the price?

So unless you the buyer wants to purchase one of each test them yourself and then dismantle to double check you'd never know.

I use numerous ESCs from all sorts of sources and I've been burnt and bought the junk just like everyone else. I don't buy from those manufacturers - my decision.

Just to let you know I drive a Hyundai at the moment and it is fine but I've got to be totally honest and say it isn't as good as our old BMW.
I tried a few times to write a response and since it is so hard to convey intent and tone over the internet, and everything I wrote sounded like I was being an argumentative ass without the aforementioned things being present, and I certainly don't want you to think that is the case, or that I'm trying to say you are wrong, so I won't. I think you are definitely right in the fact that a more expensive product probably has better components, but I'm not sure that that fact alone makes it more suitable for a given task than another product that that has only the quality of components needed to perform the task

I will simply say that I think there is enough information on the internet, especially in forums like these, to where it is fully possible to choose a less expensive product that will do a job just as well and as reliably as a much more expensive one, and that I don't personally use price as an accurate indicator of value in this sense.

If there is something I'm missing please let me know. At some point I may get a model where I might want more than something that "does the job", and I'm wondering why that would be or what factors go into that.

Simply, what am I getting for my $150 vs $50
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Watdazit View Post
Is it just me.....?

This plane does not like to fly slowly and I have a few problems landing. The only times I have crashed (since I learned to launch it properly) is on low level, slow turns trying to line up too land when it stalls. Both times I sustained very little damage, a few dents in the wing leading edge and a cracked wing tip.

I land on a 50m grass strip (extended it recently for the Blaze) that has long grass on the entry and exit. I generally have no choice when there is a cross wind. I find it difficult to slow this plane down even with spoilers without loosing control and having to fire up and go around again. By loosing control I mean if I am slow and too early for the landing strip, a small blip of the motor to reach the strip will just lift the nose and then to get back down the speed builds up as I lower the nose again.

Any tips?
I have the same problems with coming in hot. Some people swear that they find this bird very simple to land, I certainly don't. I guess my main tip is to practice landings. really practice setting it up and getting it low enough so that when you hit stall speed it settles to the ground instead of nosing in. the best tip I got was to practive landings as a goal for the flight instead of only the only practice being when I'm low on battery and forced to get her down. also, keep those wings level on final. holy crap is it ever easy to drop a wing or catch a tip on the ground (which will either stretch your wings apart or rip your fuse in the middle). practice practice, lots or go arounds, get more comfortable with it each attempt. you'll still misjudge a successful approach and crash but oh well. That tip about giving it just enough throttle to spin the prop but not enough to provide thrust is good, but I always forget to shut it back off lol.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by johnwohl View Post
..........Simply, what am I getting for my $150 vs $50
Unless your a gun pilot, nothing, so there is no problem in carrying on buying cheap equipment for planks. It means you can buy more planks...
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 10:03 PM
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John,
Nothing wrong with cheaper ESCs providing they are not just "cheap" if you get my drift.

Please don't laugh but I have ESCs over twenty different labelled source manufacturers. Out of those tried from Hobby City and kept, as opposed to being junked, are 30, 40 and 60 amps Turnigy Plush which have been very reliable over a three year period. My favourites are from Jeti but much more expensive and I like both the Advance and Spin but the Advance is ultra easy for programming. A Hacker X-Pro is in use on my Sebart Stev and previously used on my Shark this was super reliable. I quite like the Castle Creations Ice range but am currenly experimenting with Hifei which seem good and sophisticated at a reasonable cost.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 09:13 AM
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Quick tip: the D-S is back in stock in the HK USA warehouse.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 09:17 AM
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I have a NIB Blaze that I would sell for $115 shipped conus.
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