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Old May 10, 2010, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by merlin703 View Post
Sorry Joe, I left the office right before you posted this. I see you got everything working and Jim has further elaborated on my suggestions about swaping wires from the ESC to the motor to reverse the rotation of the motor.

My goodness, so many mods to get this thing up in the air.... by the time it's up in the air, it might look like a completely new plane... it would be funny if it ends up looking like a Seawind
I think we'll all more likely become Olympic swimmers while retrieving it 1st..
JimS
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Old May 11, 2010, 06:07 PM
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Hey Jim, Yes I still have two A5's. I have to admit this is crazy what you have to go through with these planes. One of them I named the Wart Hog which is my first plane, I'm gonna kinda play with power and see if I can find the right motor that jumps it right out of the water. I believe that the planes are pretty tuff, plus I beefed up a few places that I felt were weak, I have it dialed in so perfect with the rudder, ailerons and elevator. I have motors on order. What kind of thrust are we looking at? And do you feel the clay is necessary? I shaved the bottom and removed half of the wooden platform and used the roof with Velcro to place my receiver and keep things somewhat organized. They do have a lot of space. Now my second one I'm gonna try to keep stock, I did all the shaving the bottom and sealed it cabin is in order, if not I'm gonna super charge this one too. I'm not in to the speed thing but I do like power just to over power the water and not go boating for 100 feet just to get a lift off, our necks should be hurting by now from looking up at our A5's, all we have is repair pictures. I hope that we can change that soon, and I don't see a whole lot of A5's video's but everyone wants one, I guess we will be doing a lot of counseling, I hope you get yours up with film and a lot of it. Take care ole buddy......Joe Connick
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Old May 11, 2010, 06:11 PM
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Yea Merlin I appreciate all the help, I was just telling Jim to look what we had to go through just to get to where we are at, still dry docked, Oh yea I'm a good swimer too. Hey Thanks a bunch and lets get these birds in the air....Joe Connick
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Old May 11, 2010, 08:44 PM
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.. What kind of thrust are we looking at? And do you feel the clay is necessary? I shaved the bottom and removed half of the wooden platform and used the roof with Velcro to place my receiver and keep things somewhat organized...
Joe

As Chevron suggested above, i think around 225 to 275 watts of power should be pleanty especially if you have shaved the bottom step and keep it lighter with the same Lipo.. Yes I hope to get mine wet soon and will take some video.. i just want it to be really calm and it hasn't been over the weekends when i could fly last.. Take Care..
jimS
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Old May 13, 2010, 08:15 PM
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Air Boat not SEA Plane

Ok ICON A5 looks great. Had neuro surgery twice, bed time, live on canal. Was going to be some therapy. Its turned into a nightmare.

Quality poor... missing parts. Can fix that. Battery box does not fit the 1500 Mah now availiable. ESC not fixed to anything. Not water Tight. 72MHZ TR/RC 100 foot range, so they could not use it in their own test flight. Needs drain plug. Directions poor , missing parts... again can fix that... not 2 hours but 20 hours and more money (which I wish was just in the price to start with and they used the same electronics thay had to test with.) INSTRUCTIONS ARE TERRIBLE... YOU COULD SAY WHICH WAY THE size info on the prop faces so you would know which way the prop goes on. But again you can ask a question here and get the answer from some one else who screwd up once or twice first.

But the bottom has to be restepped for more lift for water take offs, same with floats. The battery compartment is not water tight enough, so you will need new electronics quickly anyway as it skips across the water never taking off. needs 50% more power. tHE SERVOVS to ruffer and rear stabilzer are to long, tangled up in wires... s/b relocated to rear areas for smoother handling.

After you do all that and reseal it... it still will not take off... you will need more horsepower, you will have to cut the engine out and remount new engine with electronics, certainily invest in glue guns (ok and did)). Then make room for bigger batteries to compensate for a larger engine, at least 50% more power to take off in a reasonable distance on water. It was never tested in China!

Its May, the pond is thawed.. where is the pond take off of a non modified ICON 5? Where are the comments that say it will not take off. Yes its pretty and I would have gladly paid more for some quality , more horsepower that works?

We all know it does not work. I would have bought a kit ifIi had the skill it takes to fix this so it takes off. 2 hourd to 8 hours...OK.. 8 hours to 40.....ok... bt 4000 hours, another coule of hundred and it may not fly or my skills conturing the foram wo ill just create a newset of problems.

Still rated by Nitro 5 stars in May. No negative remarks show up... some would call that fraud. Just give me something that works. I will forgive you. I will pay more. I dont want something for free on the other I did not order a leaking air boat. Send it with the wings off in the same box this time... It will fit, already tested. I have spent enough time trying to assemble... and add the servos needed closer to tail.

Regards
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Old May 14, 2010, 02:50 PM
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..
..
Still rated by Nitro 5 stars in May. No negative remarks show up... some would call that fraud. Just give me something that works. I will forgive you. ...
Hey Viper,
sounds like you're getting tons of therapy jumping through similar hoops with your A5 .. yes I'd be ticked too.. i don't particularly like swimming for planes.. and it's actually pretty warm here in San Diego.. <g>

Tell me did you also leave a negative feedback on their NitroPlanes main site that was rejected too ? I think perhaps we all need to gang up on them in the NitroPlanes forum on their help site cause there's no telling if they have anyone actually monitoring RC Groups here in this thread .. I think we, and our issues may simply not be getting to any one that would care.. I love NightFlyer and his videos but am really curious if his opinion of the plane is still the same now that things have warmed up and he and Jeff aren't flying on icy friction free snow.. I can't really complain they offered me an RMA ,, and I chose to keep it and dink around with it to make it work .. and I'm pretty sure it will with the new motor.. Hope to try it tomorrow. and post some video too.
Enjoy our Adventure . thanks for the feedback tho it really pains me to see it.. its very clear and very helpful to others that may follow..
Regards.. JimS
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Old May 14, 2010, 04:58 PM
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Hey fella's, I was thinking of making a video Nitro Planes can't take that off the air. When I confront it's professional and upfront but I don't just leave them hanging I try to make it look like team work but they still reject it. I called on the phone waited for an hour are so and went through four techs, I asked to be compensated in some type of way for all of the hours,"I'm glad I'm on medical leave now" and parts I had to buy. I told them I would fax them the receipts but they refused. I was missing on my second plane a clevis and push rod that goes under the aileron and I finally got him to send me one. Then he asked why did I buy two a5's within a week march 31st-April 3rd and I told him what i had to do and what we been through. I even told him about these 5 pages that he is more than welcome to read, Y'all are the one that got me through this mess. Anyway I told the guy that I spent $340.00 and it didn't seem to convict him at all. so I left it at that. I hear of NightFlyer missing a wheel are something and he laughs and says that Nitro sent him a whole plane. And you don't hear hide or hair from Jeff and Dave the NightFlyer. The Ponds are melted. I can't even get a response from them either. I also look though other discussion board and find that everyone has the same issue. When I talked with Nitro it seems that he should of been concerned so that these issues can be resolved and have some happy campers. If you look at the advertisement it does everything from hand launched to tricks, high wind water landings, thats what took me in to buy one. But I did not know that all that advertisment is false. And what gets me is their attitude, they plum just don't care. I wish I knew who the owner was. Seriously I would like some type of compensation as in a bigger motor with esc and battery to make it right. But plan on seeing a smart ass video soon......Thanks Fella's Hollar if Y'all need something....Your Bro....Joe Connick
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Old May 14, 2010, 05:31 PM
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Youtube videos with reviews from actual users will help others. I was VERY close to ordering myself one but I was one of the lucky ones that found this page and run away screaming like a little girl, lol. Anyway, I feel grateful for the comments you guys posted earlier on the thread. I went the Seawind route. By the way, I saw so many cool planes on the nitroplanes.com site and I was tempted to order another type for FPV but after seeing what type of customer service NitroPlanes provide, I will NOT be buying anything from them. Just plane too risky
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Old May 15, 2010, 05:10 AM
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Every one plse be very speicifc on your prop changes and engine/esc upgrades/makes and model and where purchased from. For all practical purposes , this s/b sold bare. And yes with rear servos. Pls note the stock size 1500 MAHs dont exist anymore, so the battery box has to be redone anyway if you stay with 1500MAH and try to get a new battery.

Does the EFLITE 480 Chevron mounted fit into same engine pay after you do his 40MM cut across the top. for example. Great pictures. If you could find a 4810 size with enough power, then it s/b an easier upgrade that fits into the old bay. It appears no such thing exist however. Then what size and make oof 3 bladed propr or 2 blade. For after take off speed the 2 prop would be better. The guy in China went to 4.... but no specs. I'll seacrh the 480s specs. But generally I have found the prop shafts are different between the makes.

And no , Nitro is not putting up negative comments. Censorship is in at Nitro! LOL.

I have left messages at the plant also... delivering a plane never tested is a consumer dept issue, I guesss China gets a free pass and we all try to get build one offs, that then they will not take back....

It seems to me NITRO could be releasing the work thats being done to fix the problem if any, such as a power upgrade and etc. The 480 whats its KV and max rpm?


Regards
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Old May 15, 2010, 02:57 PM
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Try 3

In all fairness the MicroDan 2505 motor I substituted was under rated and it burned up with a 50amp ESC behind it before it really had a chance.. I'm still not sure where all the water is coming from in the short flight you see here it picked up almost a cup of water in the fuse.... nor why there is so much drag.. i will try cutting in the step and adding an even beefier motor next.. this one was used had crashed hard a few times, but was already setup for a stick Mount.. that's why I tried it.. The NitroPlanes Catalina by comparison is a lot of fun and lifts off easily.. I got it as an ARF kit and added my own motor ESC combo's .. it also took on a little water but has no take off issues at all.. we just ran the Lipo completely dead in flight at the end..that's why it landed out in the water and we couldn't motor back in. Bret was flying it half the time on a Trainer cable thru a second transmitter you see in the video.

http://www.nitroplanes.com/4chcawdubrpo.html

Thanks again Bret for retrieving the plane..!
Icon A5 RC Plane Try 3.mp4 (9 min 27 sec)



All part of the Adventure
JimS
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Old May 15, 2010, 03:22 PM
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Well to help reduce drag i never installed the wing sponson floats. plane doesnt need them anyway, and plus the full size icon a5 doesnt have wing floats...

i float checked it without them on the wings and taxied around at high speeds, never once did the plane get out of control or try to tip over so leave them off, less drag on the water and in flight
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Old May 15, 2010, 03:33 PM
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Well sponson floats... leave them off, less drag on the water and in flight
Sure..
Every little bit helps I bet.. will do .. did you get your E Flight 480? mtd and if so, how does yours fly now with that big motor and battery in it?

JimS
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Old May 15, 2010, 03:39 PM
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Chevron on your battery rebuild bay... tail servo push rods seem to be inside something so they dont get tangled up with wires? Maybe their grahite straws? If so how would you get them over the end hooks?, Straighten and then been back. Would certainily add stiffining and easy sliding. I plan to attacked everything such as esc ad receiver with velcro, entro high power magnet on lid with a silcon edge to make /keep water type. Would like the keep foam "ne" engine compartment so it can take on or off in future. Hinged , velgros or old fashion hinges and clamp down s i as old hit rods.
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Old May 15, 2010, 04:39 PM
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I had a thought.... that could be dangerous given the pain killers I'm on. But the surface area thats causing water adhesion is the wide part where the sponsonces are added to the hull on each side, Its solid foam I think. If you cut the step there down to almost the seam (almost to rear attachment point) with hot wire cutter (another 29 bucks plus shipping) you break up that area and add most of the lift of a very, very big step. This would be your first step enhancement. Its safer because its solid foam (or appears to be). The front remains the same, no sponson mod there, so just as stable as far as tipping. You can be gentle with the fuselage step, just sand it into transations with side sponsons after mod, or perhaps not do it at all since its of unknown thickness and deep cuts are taking a lot of an already leaking bottom area foam and likely weaking the hull. And if you screw up you just need a new sponson from Nitor ( where are my arelon servo covers for wings), not a whole new fuselage and complete re assemply, since it has no parts, or structurael significance. Flying air flow.. welll we are addding steps one way or another. And if you cant get into air, flying charateristics dont mater and with double the power, it s/b a rocket with wings any way and any lost body lift .. well it will be like a 727.

Given a step of twice the depth and almost the same area of the fuselage it should be adequate and less risky for those of us who are all thumbs and are not crafters. I cant tell you how I would get a model as a kid and try to glue and paint it all in 2 hours, even major models like aircraft carriers. Needless to say they were not works of art. LOL

RTF - Ready To Fix. Is this a Chinese conspiracy to drive us nuts or willl the wing fall off their real airplanes on take off... If I ever go to China... no sea plane rides for me. Willl they build 200 and then test them? Well I guess we did that with the F22 and B1 as it turned out..... when I worked for Rockwell.

In Cape Coral for 6 years they sent over Dry wall with sulfer in it. With mositure and salt in the air, it turns into sulfuric acid, eats up all the wiring, a/c coils and etc, H2S smell... houses have to be stripped down to framing and re-built. Of course the BUSH EPA announced that the houses were not harmful to people....LOL..just to the filings in your teeth.

Then there is all the stainless barbeques at Lowes/Charbroil from there. In 3 weeks mine began to rust. Screws would rust thru and come flying back at you as it heated up... should be called stainMORE (not stainLESS) based on the staining of what ever it is they were calling stainless. Had to get a very expensive U.S. made Weber from Lowes to replace it in 90 days. 2 years later the Weber is still perfect unlike the the $900 China product , and Lowes stood by me.... besides it happened to all they sold including store manager. In reality the 2.3 times more expensive Weber, per hour of use was 100th the price of the made in China product. This has been the case of weed eaters from there, lights for the barbq, Outdoor alum lights from Lowes from there,,,, In one year a nice rusting color on just one of the two. Alum that magnets like and no consistency in metal make up in 2 matching outdoor lights bought at same time with 5 feet between them.

The barbq and this plane thing seem to be pretty much the same. First they sent repair parts as if it was my job to rebuild it... then I SENT THEM THE WHOLE THING BACK AND LEFT IT IN FRONT OF THE STORE. Nitroplane IS LUCKY they can hide on the internet. Its not like we are not willing to work with them.. we know the problem is in China except for their testing and phoney ratings of the good news fairy only and frozen pond video! Maybe the missing part is a roll of duck tape!. The way Lowes handled the problem was also of course different.

We are going from $9 engines to $69 engines. Big difference when you replace a 9 buck engine that gets wet with a $69 one a couple of times. This could quickly be a $1000 plane in my case andstill not fly but a few times.


A boat with no drain plugs.... LOL. Mine needs a scuttle plug, or a siphone drain.

Anyone want to take a bet on how long they are out of stock on the A5... or soon how funny some of these videos are going to be of the Duck taped wraped A5 on youtube.

I will bet those trying to sell the real ICON A5 will not be happy that a model can't get its a$$ off the water. Can't be good for sales. My internet slogan is the model flies just like the real thing!

Regards
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Old May 15, 2010, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by jims123 View Post
In all fairness the MicroDan 2505 motor I substituted was under rated and it burned up with a 50amp ESC behind it before it really had a chance.. I'm still not sure where all the water is coming from in the short flight you see here it picked up almost a cup of water in the fuse.... nor why there is so much drag.. i will try cutting in the step and adding an even beefier motor next.. this one was used had crashed hard a few times, but was already setup for a stick Mount.. that's why I tried it.. The NitroPlanes Catalina by comparison is a lot of fun and lifts off easily.. I got it as an ARF kit and added my own motor ESC combo's .. it also took on a little water but has no take off issues at all.. we just ran the Lipo completely dead in flight at the end..that's why it landed out in the water and we couldn't motor back in. Bret was flying it half the time on a Trainer cable thru a second transmitter you see in the video.

http://www.nitroplanes.com/4chcawdubrpo.html

Thanks again Bret for retrieving the plane..!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQxn1mQ9ar8


All part of the Adventure
JimS
Pls note that the upgraded catalina has twice the power to weight ratio basically as the ICON5 which says it all since they had power problems with the catalina before brushlesss/lopo batteries upgrads.

Rgerds
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