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Old Jan 13, 2011, 10:59 AM
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Kelowna, BC Canada
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Originally Posted by RedYank33 View Post
Trim knob is in the middle and yes I did put a little oil on the gears.
It sounds like you may have worn out the motors, these are tiny little brushed motors and it's not at all impossible that the brushes could get worn down or burnt off. I'd try swapping the motors if I was you.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 11:15 AM
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Kelowna, BC Canada
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Originally Posted by detchells View Post
I posted an earlier message about my new S107 (a "spare", after many crashes), bought recently from eBay seller tosell7. I suspect it's a counterfeit, not a real Syma. It's a rev 5 board (my original is a rev 3), so is very slow flying forward when compared to my original. More annoying, though, I'm finding that when I add forward throttle (eg, fly forward), the copter will frequently "twitch" right or left, suddenly changing orientation even though the right stick stays perfectly centered. This can make it awfully tricky to maneuver.

Question: Has anyone else seen this "twitching" behavior when you initially command the heli to start moving forward?

My question is, should I be asking the seller to take this unit back? I think it's probably a counterfeit because, as shown in the attached photos:

1) box has very cheap cellophane tacked *outside* the box, vs heavy plastic sheet inside the window cutout

2) The plastic underchassis molding is different than the original (has contours vs being flat).

3) Motor mounts have two frame tabs bend over to hold them in, vs one on the original

4) One of the plastic pieces (where the tail bar attaches to the frame) shows a mold parting line, and has a glossier finish than the origina.

5) The controller from the new one won't run the older unit, and vice versa.

- So what do you think I should do: Try to return it?
I would say yes, you likely have a counterfeit, all the features you've identified about yours-cellophane tacked on the outside of the box, under chassis molding contours, two motor mount tabs, different plastics molding (my canopy has an ugly molding line and seems to be higher gloss), controller incompatibility; all match up with mine that is an acknowledged copy. It's a very good copy, probably even made by the same factory but it is not a genuine Syma S107. Mine even has the same "Inspected by QC6" sticker in the same spot as yours, the only difference is that mine has an R3 board.

Mine had exactly the twitching problem you speak of. It's not a mechanical issue, it looks like a gyro problem, seems to be trying to correct the flight path but doing so wrong which results in just what you said, forward throttle turns into an almost uncontrollable spinning twitch that almost completely negates any forward momentum. Mine exhibited that behavior for one-two flights and has now stopped flying forward at all; sometimes the tail motor will spin but not fast enough to generate momentum but more often it doesn't spin at all. I'm not an electronic engineer but I'm pretty sure it's a problem on the pcb somewhere. This is the second heli that has done this to me now, the other was a genuine R5, so I don't think the issue can be blamed on whether it's clone or not.

I'd say try to return it (just because it doesn't work, not because it's a "clone") but don't expect much and be prepared to just make this one a parts chopper or order the pcb and try swapping it out your self. I'm deciding what do about right now. I have a message out to the ebay seller (demonerr) to see what they are willing do about it but I'm not anticipating they'll send me a new one. I expect I'll either have to replace the pcb or strip this machine down and order another one...
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 11:18 AM
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S107's or at least Syma's really need their own forum, this thread is out of control.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 12:09 PM
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Australia, VIC, St Kilda
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Originally Posted by Chris.S. View Post
I would say yes, you likely have a counterfeit, all the features you've identified about yours-cellophane tacked on the outside of the box, under chassis molding contours...

Just checked mine for 'genuineness', and all signs are that it is the real deal. I've never had any doubt, really.
BUT, I have the box with cheap cellophane on the outside, and the contoured tray. Only those two things on the list mentioned by detchells.


This thread is also worth a read...
Differences in Syma S107s
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...t=genuine+s107
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Captain Sensible View Post
Redyank I have found that the rotors can slip during takeoff even if they feel tight when you turn them manually. I have had the upper rotor mount slip on my S107 and S105. A dab of glue (tiny) on the tip of the rotor shaft after removing the top rotor head (side screws) has fixed it. The trim would go out each time the top rotor slipped.
I tried some glue but still nothing
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris.S. View Post
It sounds like you may have worn out the motors, these are tiny little brushed motors and it's not at all impossible that the brushes could get worn down or burnt off. I'd try swapping the motors if I was you.
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Originally Posted by RedYank33 View Post
I tried some glue but still nothing

Did you see my post?
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris.S. View Post
I would say yes, you likely have a counterfeit, all the features you've identified about yours-cellophane tacked on the outside of the box, under chassis molding contours, two motor mount tabs, different plastics molding (my canopy has an ugly molding line and seems to be higher gloss), controller incompatibility; all match up with mine that is an acknowledged copy. It's a very good copy, probably even made by the same factory but it is not a genuine Syma S107. Mine even has the same "Inspected by QC6" sticker in the same spot as yours, the only difference is that mine has an R3 board.

Mine had exactly the twitching problem you speak of. It's not a mechanical issue, it looks like a gyro problem, seems to be trying to correct the flight path but doing so wrong which results in just what you said, forward throttle turns into an almost uncontrollable spinning twitch that almost completely negates any forward momentum. Mine exhibited that behavior for one-two flights and has now stopped flying forward at all; sometimes the tail motor will spin but not fast enough to generate momentum but more often it doesn't spin at all. I'm not an electronic engineer but I'm pretty sure it's a problem on the pcb somewhere. This is the second heli that has done this to me now, the other was a genuine R5, so I don't think the issue can be blamed on whether it's clone or not.

I'd say try to return it (just because it doesn't work, not because it's a "clone") but don't expect much and be prepared to just make this one a parts chopper or order the pcb and try swapping it out your self. I'm deciding what do about right now. I have a message out to the ebay seller (demonerr) to see what they are willing do about it but I'm not anticipating they'll send me a new one. I expect I'll either have to replace the pcb or strip this machine down and order another one...
Thanks for the detailed reply! Yeah, it's not whether it's a counterfeit that bothers me, but just that the twitching makes it extremely difficult to fly.

I have an EE background; my theory to explain the behavior is that the tail motor (especially the initial current impulse when it starts up) is putting a glitch on the power rail, which turns into noise in the circuitry that amplifies the gyro signal. So the CPU thinks the chopper is turning when it isn't, and applies the appropriate "corrective" action - Which wasn't in fact needed, so the copter does an abrupt twitch to the right or left. (It's also possible that the controller is funky, but since it won't run on my original controller, I can't test that.)

Whatever the cause, the fact it might be a clone isn't the issue (although I'd like to see my money go to Syma, to encourage them to make more great copters) - It's that it just isn't really fly-able in its current state.

If they won't take it back, I'll try to get an R3 board on eBay and swap it in. Interesting though, that yours has an R3 board and has the same problems. If my theory is correct, it might just be a funky tail motor, and the "real" one doesn't throw glitches. I have a couple of replacement tailpieces with motors on order from an eBayer in China; if the seller won't take it back, it'll be interesting to see if changing the tail motor might fix it. I could also try adding a capacitor to the power rails, to see if I could filter-out the glitch.

Anyway, I have some ideas for radical weight reduction I'd like to try, maybe I can use this one to tinker with.

Thanks again for the detailed reply; it sounds like we have the same model.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris.S. View Post
Did you see my post?
I did and I am going to order some motors. I just wanted to let the Captain know I did try his suggestion. I think it could be the motors but I after tinkering with it and considering all of the things it could have been, I wonder if instead of the rotors coming loose on top if the gears could have come loose at the bottom? I am going to have to tear it down to get the motors out anyway so I might wait to order the motors until I have thoroughly looked at the gears.

Let me know if anyone has any other suggestions.

So far I have new blades, new battery, no landing skids and it just tries to lift off but won't.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 01:17 PM
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Has anyone please got a photo of a complete/correctly wired R5 PCB? I just purchased one but want to ensure I have the motors the correct way round before I dive in.

Also not sure where the LED nav lights wire in...


Thanks for your help
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by smokey325 View Post
As I understand from previous posts, it shouldn't really make a lot of difference
I like to have two flybar links because if one pops off for some reason there is still a backup to keep the flybar working correctly. Syma must be cutting corners now and only putting one flybar link on the S107s ... cheese time.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by skamanfrank View Post
Has anyone please got a photo of a complete/correctly wired R5 PCB? I just purchased one but want to ensure I have the motors the correct way round before I dive in.

Also not sure where the LED nav lights wire in...


Thanks for your help
This first one is where the LED is soldered on. Notice the white wire at the top left and the yellow at the bottom left.


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Old Jan 13, 2011, 03:31 PM
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"Humans. It's all we have to work with."
-I wrote that, 30 years ago. You may quote me if you wish.

I'm chuckling at how great the pick-and-place machine did ITS work. The Human's part(s), look like they were done during a gunfight.

Note the "orphan font" RoHS mark. It's interesting to see that there is no CE mark anywhere, which is replacing the RoHS marking, for which there is no official artwork.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Hayabusa Heli View Post
I like to have two flybar links because if one pops off for some reason there is still a backup to keep the flybar working correctly. Syma must be cutting corners now and only putting one flybar link on the S107s ... cheese time.

The one I bought yesterday from fresh stock into the UK came with 2 flybar links.
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by smokey325 View Post
The one I bought yesterday from fresh stock into the UK came with 2 flybar links.
Bought two for 99p and fitted one. Not much difference.
Then noticed one of the top blades was a bit too loose.
Tightened it half a turn and it seems better!
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Old Jan 13, 2011, 06:15 PM
Have Guitar Will Travel
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The Digital Domain
Joined Nov 2008
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Well, I just had my first "real" full fledged substantial crash with the S107 since I got it 2 months ago.........smacked it solidly into the reading lamp.
Happy to report that there's no damage. Like a good old Timex Watch... Takes a Lick'n ... Keeps On Tick'n.
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