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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:02 PM
President, FMA, Inc.
Tim Marks's Avatar
Joined Mar 2008
1,051 Posts
New Product
Sneak Peek at the NEW Cellpro PowerLab 8 (v2)

UNLEASH THE POWER!

POWER you have been waiting for, SAFETY you have come to expect in a Cellpro!

INTRODUCTION:

Well we have been at it now for around 15 months all told. We’re getting anxious to let the world know what we’ve been focused on for all this time. It’s time to let the cat out of the bag and give you a sneak peek at what’s heading your way.

Welcome to the new thread dedicated entirely to an open discussion about the new FMA/REVOLECTRIX Cellpro PowerLab 8 Battery Workstation. Not only is this thread about an exciting new product, it represents a new concept for FMA Direct. Of course we have always been diligent about beta testing our new products carefully to ensure they work as advertised when they hit the streets, but this is the first time we have been inclined to open up our beta test program to our valued customer base in advance of the anticipated product release date. What’s even more unusual is that we are choosing to tell you all about this awesome new unit not through advertisements, but through the words of our dedicated and capable PowerLab 8 beta team members. Collectively, this group represents more than 100 years of modeling experience and work with electronic instruments and testing. This unique thread is being started by FMA Direct, but it will be monitored by the beta team. You are invited to ask technical questions or inquire about available features to your heart’s content. Answers will be supplied by team members who now have logged cumulatively, thousands of happy hours with the prototypes each has received. From time-to-time, we may step in to offer assistance in this regard; however, for the most part, this is their thread. ENJOY!

Meet the Beta Team:
Glen Crandall
Jack Doherty
Charles Langley
Heyward Macdonald
Steve Meliza

But before you start asking questions, take a quick look at the specifications and the feature set of this ground-breaking new battery management system:

PowerLab 8 Specifications:

For Battery types: Lithium Polymer (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), Lithium Ion (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), Lithium Manganese (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), A123 (LiFePO4) (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 9s unbalanced), NiCd (1s to 21s), NiMH (1s to 21s), 6v, 12v, 24v Lead Acid batteries (Flooded, Gel, AGM, SLA)

Pack capacity: 20 mAh to 360Ah

Input voltage: 10-32VDC, reverse polarity protected

Input current: 1A to 50A, software limited

Power conversion: Synchronous DC/DC converter, supports multiple switcher frequencies of 31.25 kHz, 62.5 kHz, 125 kHz; user selectable by preset, 85% to 93% efficiency depending on output current

Output battery charge current: Adjustable range 10mA to 40A, limited by 60A input current*

Output battery discharge current: Internal discharge 10mA to 10A, 100W max
Regenerative discharge 10mA to 40A, 1344W max**

Continuous max output power: 612W @ +12VDC input, 1344W @ +26.35VDC

Cell balancing: Resolution 78uV (16 bit) for 1s-8s Li or A123 (LiFePO4) balanced charging

Voltage calibration: Cell voltage measurements are factory calibrated to a standard traceable to NIST; calibration is to +/- 6 mV

Current calibration: Charge current is factory calibrated on a 4A standard; calibration is to +/- 1mA

Measurement accuracy:
Voltage resolution: 78uV (16 bit)
Voltage tolerance: +/- 6mV
Charge current: +/- 1%
Capacity added to pack: +/- 1%
Percent capacity (“Fuel”): +/- 5% (with accurate fuel table defined for battery being charged)

Serial data output: 19.2kbps, 8 bits, 1 start bit, 1 stop bit, no parity

Data integrity: Checksum, CRC checking

Cooling fans: Twin, 13 CFM, 50mm diameter

Heat sink: Internal 200W aluminum, thin finned

Output battery connector: “Cellpro” compatible, JST PA series, 9 position

LCD: 2 line, 16 character, light grey/blue backlit

Footnotes:
* Please note, for safety reasons, available charger current may be limited for certain battery types and/or charging modes, e.g., non-balanced charge of Li
** Please check bullet number 8 in the section titled “Major Features” below for a detailed description of Regenerative Discharge

PowerLab 8 (v2) Feature Set:

Major Features:
• Selectable charge rates range 10mA to 40A
• Continuous maximum output power rating, 1344W @ +26.35VDC input voltage, 612W @ +12VDC input voltage
• Using +24VDC to +32VDC input, 1344W output will deliver full current rating (40A) over the full range of output voltage up to 33.6V
• Smart power management allows customer to select between programmable input power sources. Using the Charge Control Software (CCS), choose from several templates to get you in the ballpark, then fine tune the settings. Available settings include power supply input current limit, input low voltage limit, regenerative discharge rate and voltage limit. PowerLab 8 stores 1 set-up for Power Supply and 1 set-up for Battery and asks for verification one time on start-up
• PowerLab 8 (v2) supports charging through node wires only (automatic current limiting to 3A maximum) or node wires in combination with discharge wires (charge rate support up to 40A max)
• Initiate charge, discharge, monitor, and multiple cycles at the PL8 or via remote control from the CCS. Graph all major operations when using CCS.
• Open Architecture presets allow for customization of any User Preset including show/hide presets on unit, preset name editing, up to 100 parameters control how presets are displayed and charging/discharge/cycling parameters associated with particular batteries and/or charging strategies. Unit includes 25 user preset banks pre-loaded for most major battery type/chemistries, plus 50 library presets.
• Environmentally friendly, industry first, regenerative discharge capability of up to 1344W. Unlike traditional methods of discharge, which deplete the output battery’s energy in the form of heat across a transistor, regenerative discharge takes most of that energy and puts it back into the input battery. In other words, when you discharge your LiPo for storage, you will be re-charging your Lead Acid input battery. The total amount of power that you can achieve is limited only by the amount of current that your input battery can accept, or 1344W, whichever is lower.
• PowerLab 8 (v2) is also equipped with a traditional, 100W internal discharge capability which is non-regenerative.
• Twin cooling fans
• Massive over-sized internal heat sink
• 10AWG silicon input power cable and heavy-duty, removable plier clips
• Massive sendust core toroid capable of 60A continuous input current requirement for maximum output specifications

Other Features:
• Supports native Cellpro batteries automatically
• Adapters available for all popular R/C battery brands
• 2 line, 16 character backlit LCD
• Available opto-isolated PC interface and free Charge Control Software (CCS)
• Intuitive 4 button user interface
• Sleek and attractive high-impact ABS enclosure for maximum airflow efficiency
• Sturdy Aluminum top panel with reliable, recessed tactile buttons
• Quick “preset over-ride access” to common charging parameters like setting charge and discharge current and operational modes of charge/discharge/monitor/cycle(s)
• Additional advanced options menu for adjusting in-depth charging parameters and global options at the unit
• GUI PC software (CCS) allows access to 25 User Presets and 50 Library Presets stored in the unit or available in unlimited number on the P.C.
• Free and reliable firmware updates for the life of the product using the CCS
• Automatic Low voltage restore for recovering damaged or over-discharged packs
• Programmable options allow speaker ON/OFF or volume, LCD contrast, customized welcome screen, and much more
• Cold weather mode reduces end-charge voltage; parameters adjustable by customer including ON/OFF, end-charge voltage offset reduction, and temperature
• Multiple product cases can be interlocked
• Expansion Channel mode whereby one PowerLab 8 (v2) primary (master) can control one or more expansion channels, send over preset information, control all aspects of charging and balancing. This feature is perfect for charging multiple packs of same chemistry and capacity using multiple devices such as split packs connected in series during operation all at unbelievable rates.
• Auto charge mode available utilizing advanced fuel gauging technology
• Customizable fuel table lookup values based on presets. Fuel tables can be created using a Fuel Table Wizard in the CCS and applied to individual battery brands by presets for improved accuracy
• Industry’s first Safe Parallel adapters available to maximize available power potential. Safely connect two (2s-8s Cellpro brand) packs or (2s-6s Other brand) packs of equal cell count/capacity together in parallel; charge, discharge, cycle, or monitor on a single PowerLab 8 (v2). These items are peripheral products, available separately, or included as a part of PL8 combos.

Please note: all specifications and features listed above subject to change prior to delivery.

Current retail price for the basic unit currently $239.95 on the REVO USA webstore:

http://www.usastore.revolectrix.com/...PowerLab-8_290

and $229.95 on the REVO International webstore:

http://www.store.revolectrix.com/Pro...PowerLab-8_283

If you are interested in joining Revolectrix email campaign, click the appropriate button near the middle of the home page:

http://www.revolectrix.com/index.htm

To get a better idea of the power levels attainable using the Cellpro PowerLab 8, try out the Online Power Calculators here:

http://www.revolectrix.com/Calculators_main.htm

For links to the product's user guide, Charge Control Software Install page or tour, and other related documents, please check the PowerLab 8 product Resources tab page:

http://www.revolectrix.com/pl8_links_tab.htm

July, 2012 Update: For recent information concerning the Turnigy FATBOY 8 and it's affiliation with FMA, please check the following post:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=4755
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Last edited by Tim Marks; Jul 31, 2012 at 12:08 PM. Reason: Updated for production release of "v2" version
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:07 PM
KK6MQJ
Bajora's Avatar
Joined Sep 2004
13,615 Posts
Always exciting to see FMA release new charger products Tim. I love my CellPro 10S and will anxiously watch this thread to learn all I can about this exciting new charger!
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:26 PM
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Joined Nov 2006
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Barnesjohr,

It is more exciting than you can imagine. I have beta tested a number of chargers, but even after about 250 hrs of work with it this one still has me shaking my head.

heyward
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:33 PM
KK6MQJ
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Joined Sep 2004
13,615 Posts
Quote:
still has me shaking my head.
Heyward, and I have a feeling you mean are shaking it in amazement, eh?!
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:41 PM
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True, I am amazed...
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:46 PM
ProgressiveRC
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Seattle, WA
Joined Dec 2006
1,997 Posts
Looks great - nice work FMA! I am eager to try one of these out for myself.

Cheers,
David
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 05:56 PM
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USA, GA, Marietta
Joined Aug 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by write2dgray View Post
Looks great - nice work FMA! I am eager to try one of these out for myself.

Cheers,
David
David,

You are going to love it.

Glen
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:26 PM
I will be an angry old man!
marc1's Avatar
Vancouver Isl
Joined Apr 2007
1,359 Posts
1) I want one!

2) When?

3) How much?

Hopefully for the price I think this is going to sell for, the PC interface and a good selection of balance board will be included. Hopefully we'll be seeing a USB port?
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:31 PM
KK4NZS
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Virginia
Joined Sep 2006
1,429 Posts
I have been very pleased with the CellPro 10S Can't wait to see this hit the market....
Row
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:32 PM
KK4NZS
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Virginia
Joined Sep 2006
1,429 Posts
It looks a little smaller than the 10s.. maybe....It doesn't really matter.. I wonder If it has the option to Hook it up to a power supply?
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:36 PM
Southern Pride
everydayflyer's Avatar
Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
34,631 Posts
Quote:
Hopefully we'll be seeing a USB port?
Quote:

Snip:

Initiate charge, discharge, monitor, and multiple cycles at the PL8 or via remote control from the CCS. Graph all major operations when using CCS.
Open Architecture presets allow for customization of any User Preset including show/hide presets on unit, preset name editing, up to 100 parameters control how presets are displayed and charging/discharge/cycling parameters associated with particular batteries and/or charging strategies. Unit includes 25 user preset banks pre-loaded for most major battery type/chemistries, plus 50 library presets.
Full charger control from any computer, you just have to figure out a way to swap the packs out.


Links:

FMA Power Calculators all 3-20-12

http://www.revolectrix.com/Calculators_main.htm

Addational specs.

http://www.fmadirect.com/new_applica..._features.html



Power supply thread in B & C

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1082910

Inexpensive DIY power supplies

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1170784

same in series

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...2&postcount=75

Reasonable cost commerical power supplies

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=156


Presets / Power Supply settings Note Screen shots and link to mre screen shots.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=354

Added 6-26 Two PL8s and some tips

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=916

Added 6-27-10 Two PL8s charging two Lipolys screen shots and graphs.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=928

Two PL8s and two occurrences of CCS on one computer

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1021

Post listing what adapters work with what

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1011

Added: 7-8-10 Link to CC / CV discharge to Storage

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=328

If Auto C charge rate seems slow and rate never exceeds 6Amps. see post here:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=928


How to copy / move a Preset and how to modify / save a Preset.


http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1439

CCS softwrae here;

http://www.revolectrix.com/new_appli..._software.html

Direct link to Manual

http://www.revolectrix.com/support_docs/item_1340.pdf

8-17-10 Power supply to POWERLAB 8 (s) here

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1474

a;so works well with other chargers which come with decent size gaiter. One could use bullet connectors or whatever on the input lines.


Fat Boy 7-30-12

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=4755
Charles
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:49 PM
Lipo abuser ... smoke on!
gp125racer's Avatar
Joined Feb 2005
1,909 Posts
Awesome!! I'll be purchasing another charger in the next few months, I'll be keeping my eye on this little fella.
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marc1 View Post
1) I want one!

2) When?

3) How much?

Hopefully for the price I think this is going to sell for, the PC interface and a good selection of balance board will be included. Hopefully we'll be seeing a USB port?
Mark1

I will have to leave it to FMA to answer the availability and price questions, but I think you will be enthusiastic about this product, what it will do, and its price might surprise you.
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 07:36 PM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
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Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,297 Posts
Wow! This is the first real serious contender in the high power chargers, nice job guys, it's about time! I've got some 7 chargers now but I've been using my pair of Cellpro 10s chargers exclusively for the past year, so easy to use and customizable via programming interface.

I do have 2 questions though. First, Charles is right, if you're planning on using a USB-to-serial dongle, please consider a mini USB port instead, USB is a standard on computers today and all the Serial dongles I have are piling up! Second, wouldn't you expect this much power to lend itself to a dual port charger? Why the single?

Lastly, I scanned the specs twice but didn't notice if this charger measures IR? For me, this will be a new requirement for all chargers I purchase, it's one of the few tools we have to measure battery performance compared to a point-in-time and frankly the only way to compare cells from vendor-to-vendor and generation-to-generation.

Nice job!

Jack
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 08:13 PM
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Hi Jack;

Heyward here, one of the beta testers.

You are right, the CP 10S is a fine charger. Now think of a 1000 watt charger that also discharges and has a really first class computer control program (CCS), and you have the basic, but only the basic, concept of the PL-8.

To answer your questions, it does have a dongle, but a very small one and it works very well. I use a laptop in my shop to control it all the time, although the two-line screen will control most everything if you are away from your computer. I just love to have my hands on all that information and all those adjustable presets in front of me on my computer screen.

Secondly, this is a hugely powerful single channel charger. To make it two channels would probably have put limitations on a single channel. On the other hand, it has so much power that it is easy to charge packs in parallel. There is a nifty piggy-back connector on the charging cables so it will easily accommodate two packs and splitting the balancing cable into two takes care of the balancing. This means the packs need to be the same cell count and stage of charge, but I do it all the time. Coming soon is to be a smart parallel gizmo that takes care of these issues and makes this power lab work just fine with parallel packs charging or discharging. I have a 10 ft Turbo-Beaver that uses two 5 cell 5400 mah packs. This charger makes quick work of charging them together.

Note also that this device will discharge into a huge heat sink inside the charger that is cooled by two fans, but also, the thing will dump the energy from your discharging pack(s) into Lead Acid Batterys. This is called regenerative discharging. One engineer at FMA has washed power back and forth 200 times without charging the lead acid battery.

And, yes, this unit measures IR, except it does it in a fraction of the time as does the S10.

I hope this helps. Don't hesitate to ask whatever comes to mind. With 5 of us looking out for our on-line buddies, someone should be able to get back to you fairly quickly.

heyward
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