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Old Nov 14, 2012, 09:31 PM
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Canada, BC, Lake Cowichan
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Hi Jim,

If you can remove the shaft from the rudder, you should be able to get a new shaft; 4mm is almost same as 5/332nd of an inch. There should be a hobby shop in San Diego that carries various sizes of stainless.

John
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 01:37 AM
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I am sorry if this question has been asked before.
I have a Pikanto and with it got some measurments to set the boat up too. I can not work out where they measure the rake. Its is about 900 something for 3 rig. 1200 something for 2 rig and 1600 for 1 rig. Don't quote me on the numbers as there are at home but I hope they may help answer the question.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiljoball View Post
Hi Jim,

If you can remove the shaft from the rudder, you should be able to get a new shaft; 4mm is almost same as 5/332nd of an inch. There should be a hobby shop in San Diego that carries various sizes of stainless.

John
Tug/ John,
OK I understand all now.. I'll look for some new shaft rod material and remount it in the same hole but re-drilled at the right angle, ( which in this boat the post is at a right angle to the hull contour.. not vertical to the waterline) and use the film to protect the hull as i fill in any gaps ( or re-sand it) along the hull contour later..
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 07:34 AM
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If you want to do it in a 2 step process that's fine glue in the shaft first and then use the cling film and some filler to get the contour of the rudder to the boat correct, you can even make the filler deep to regain the blade depth that you have cut off,epoxy filler is best as it's not soft west system 406 colodial silica downside it's not black we call it snot.
Ps another smart move would to wipe some vasiline into the shaft tube using a Qtip so nothing sticks there by accident.Not shure if you understand the sanding process of the blade when dry remove the rudder first and sand the sides only, the top would have conformed to the shape on the cling film it might just need a slight clean up but would be very close to a perfect fit.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strobe2 View Post
I am sorry if this question has been asked before.
I have a Pikanto and with it got some measurments to set the boat up too. I can not work out where they measure the rake. Its is about 900 something for 3 rig. 1200 something for 2 rig and 1600 for 1 rig. Don't quote me on the numbers as there are at home but I hope they may help answer the question.
The person that took the measurements would have to tell you where he took them.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by The Tug View Post
If you want to do it in a 2 step process that's fine glue in the shaft first and then use the cling film and some filler to get the contour of the rudder to the boat correct, you can even make the filler deep to regain the blade depth that you have cut off,epoxy filler is best as it's not soft west system 406 colodial silica downside it's not black we call it snot.
Ps another smart move would to wipe some vasiline into the shaft tube using a Qtip so nothing sticks there by accident.Not shure if you understand the sanding process of the blade when dry remove the rudder first and sand the sides only, the top would have conformed to the shape on the cling film it might just need a slight clean up but would be very close to a perfect fit.
Tug,
Jotcha.. I'm not sure i understand all this 100% either, but am hoping I can avoid the mould process with the snot to get a near perfect fit by simply sanding the top surface of the fin a bit to match the hull contour after re-fitting and gluing the shaft at approx 90 degrees to that new cut line.. the problem is most rudders (like this one) seem to have been made with an assumption the shaft post will be vertical to the waterline, not at 90 degrees to the hull as is this Widget. As to sanding the flat surfaces of the fin fore or aft.. not planning to sand there at all.. only along the top.. We have a lot of little thin spindly weeds that get into, and float on the pond surface at some times of year and they like to wind up looped on a rudder shaft so i am hoping to pinch them out with the fit forward at least... and get rid of the servo bind too..
the other worry i have tho is: I may need to taper the aft top surface a bit now too since the bottom tip of the fin may be slightly ( 1/8th"?) past the rear edge of the hull.. Tug if i set the boat down on it's keel and drop a fishing weight lead line off the transom.. is that line going to show me the point i must clear on the fin's lower rear edge?

Thanks Again.. JimS
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 12:36 PM
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I would just get a straight ruler and run it off the stern and see where the aft edge of the rudder lies.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 12:38 PM
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Jim,

How the boat sits on the keel has nothing to do with the location of the rudder. Normally the bulb is not square, often it is one to two degrees of angle relative to the waterline.

The only real way to check the rudder location relative to the transom is in a float tank. Or just put it in the water and back it up (carefully) to a true vertical surface and see if the rudder hits first.

Ted
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by TedFlack View Post
Jim,

How the boat sits on the keel has nothing to do with the location of the rudder. Normally the bulb is not square, often it is one to two degrees of angle relative to the waterline.

The only real way to check the rudder location relative to the transom is in a float tank. Or just put it in the water and back it up (carefully) to a true vertical surface and see if the rudder hits first.

Ted
T & T
I was afraid you guys would say that..I'll try to measure it this way and see what i get since there is apparently no "waterline" on the hull to square off against..and if the nose is too high it'll impact the boat length measurement if that fin is sticking out past the stern when the boat's level.. i need to account for it before fitting to the hull contour alone.. Perhaps there will be a Float tank here at the SD Regatta Sunday I can drop it in too.

Ted, if a boat fails to measure in spec.. what's the procedure to correct it and get re-measured..I want to do it to find out what all I may need to fix..but these measurement opportunities seem really rare here.. JimS
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 06:18 PM
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Hi Jim,

I'll run through this with you on the weekend. I will cover what initial measurement covers and what is checked at a formal event. If you look at the measurement form and the class rules, part C (length, weights etc), is only checked at a regatta. If you are off, then you can fix it at the regatta to become within specs.

John
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 06:41 PM
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An interesting picture of the lines on the Crotian boat 'Kantun' very Topico at the bow yet Britpop at the stern it will be interesting to see how these boats perform at the IOM Europeans next week.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by The Tug View Post
I would just get a straight ruler and run it off the stern and see where the aft edge of the rudder lies.
I couldn't get the shaft out of the fin, even when heated up till it was very very hot..but I lucked out in a way since I decided to go ahead and reshape and bend it to avoid the transom overhang and try to match the hull contour at the same time. I should have taken some BEFORE shots.. these are all the AFTER shots../ Lot less friction now in the base of the shaft, and I wound up changing the servo out again with a better/ more precise digital one John suggested.. and Wa La..! no more buzz.No more centering problem at all.. . it's not the closest fit to the hull contour possible, but the fin is strong and straight and servo is working Great.. Thanks all for the tips and help along the way.! Happy camper JimS
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Old Nov 16, 2012, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToniGe23 View Post
An interesting picture of the lines on the Crotian boat 'Kantun' very Topico at the bow yet Britpop at the stern it will be interesting to see how these boats perform at the IOM Europeans next week.
Have to say I get a little tired with the constant references to one design over another which almost suggests a breech & infringement of Intellectual Copyright.. It's been suggested before..

In the old days we always had chined boats.. Easier to build...

For Me this IOM looks to be an evolution in Design (Good or Bad??) and it is Distinctly

"KANTUN" like...
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Old Nov 16, 2012, 09:43 AM
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Based on what i can see it looks fine,Yes a tank test is really the only way but run the ruler it will give you an idea of what's going on as the transom has to hit the back of the tank.All you need now is some of the wifes cling film wrap and clean up the fit here's how you do this.
(1)put boat upsidedown on table vasiline the shaft hole.
(2)get wifes cling film wrap and stretch it on there so theres no wrinkles in the rudder area.
(3)apply filler to top of rudder
(4)insert shaft into hole
(5)send it down until filler makes contact with cling film wrap.
(6)let it dry for 2-3 hours and remove it
(7)sand it,therefore you use only a small amount of filler.dead easy
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Old Nov 16, 2012, 09:59 AM
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QUOTE=waboats;23282333]Have to say I get a little tired with the constant references to one design over another which almost suggests a breech & infringement of Intellectual Copyright.. It's been suggested before..

In the old days we always had chined boats.. Easier to build...

For Me this IOM looks to be an evolution in Design (Good or Bad??) and it is Distinctly

"KANTUN" like... [/QUOTE]
I totally agree we have a Chienz and a BP here that sit side by side in the club and i can't say they look alike.We've got a new Lintel arriving for next weekend's regatta to spice up everything.At least the fleet is getting hotter for shure with another 4 boats on order,i'll see if i can get some pics of these 2 side by side this weekend.
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