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Old Nov 26, 2009, 07:03 PM
Physics hate's my ideas
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A dream/idea... what's its purpose? (Geese formation flying drone)

So I was looking at the sky, thinking and imagining as usual and a question came to me... "What if I was able to build a long range drone that would get into a formation of geese?" Could that be useful in any way? To me it just seems cool, to interact with geese, perhaps the drone would take lead and take some of the hard flying off of them.

So while in dreamland I was thinking the craft could use fuel cells as well as solar energy, kind of like a multi-energy source aircraft. Do geese land at all for breaks? Or no breaks?

I don't know I was thinking something along the lines of an electric glider, probably a span around their size, carrying a payload of a live transmitting camera, as well as sensors...

Btw has this been done before?
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Old Nov 26, 2009, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenAce92 View Post
So I was looking at the sky, thinking and imagining as usual and a question came to me... "What if I was able to build a long range drone that would get into a formation of geese?" Could that be useful in any way? To me it just seems cool, to interact with geese, perhaps the drone would take lead and take some of the hard flying off of them.

So while in dreamland I was thinking the craft could use fuel cells as well as solar energy, kind of like a multi-energy source aircraft. Do geese land at all for breaks? Or no breaks?

I don't know I was thinking something along the lines of an electric glider, probably a span around their size, carrying a payload of a live transmitting camera, as well as sensors...

Btw has this been done before?
The flying V actually has an aerodynamic purpose. It's like drafting in NASCAR. They are flying in eachothers wake. They actually take turns flying in the front because the front bird doesn't have the mechanical advantage and gets tired faster. I forgot where I heard it though, so don't make me source that :P

OK I made myself curious: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_formation

Maybe you could do it with a twin motor airplanes with counter-rotating props, and program an autopilot to interface with a variometer like L1D and have the plane adjust itself to stay in the updraft... but that would be like programming a glider to thermal... sounds impossible to me
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Old Nov 26, 2009, 11:22 PM
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Geese land every so often, but it would depend on which species and time of year as to when and where. Just look around you to see if you have geese hunting camps/lodges/fields that is a pretty good sign that a large number will come your way and land nearby.

I believe I have seen geese flying off of a large glider before and I know I have seen them flying off of smaller private aircraft, ultralights, and hang gliders, at least in pictures.
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 04:49 AM
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Maybe one of these might help.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...2&postcount=18
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by GreenAce92 View Post
So I was looking at the sky, thinking and imagining as usual and a question came to me... "What if I was able to build a long range drone that would get into a formation of geese?" Could that be useful in any way?
Like some form of camera image recognition, or at least colour/mass - so it can navigate into a flock of geese in the picture of the camera. Then depending on their position in the camera screen, adjust rudder and pitch to compensate, adjusting its course to stay behind them...

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenAce92 View Post
To me it just seems cool, to interact with geese, perhaps the drone would take lead and take some of the hard flying off of them.
Interact with geese / take the lead and some of the hard flying off them?
You mean like a flying UAV SHUTTLE - the geese could then hop onto your UAV, then hop off again, as they approach their migrating sites?

Nice ideas. Look forward to the video, once this becomes reality.
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 09:55 AM
Physics hate's my ideas
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Well it'll be a long time from reality. Programming a UAV to thermal is not impossible, in fact it has been done several times before, using a variometer, I imagine they program the UAV to turn into this "bump" and see if it will rise. Like this model by NASA

http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/Scienc...sp?NewsNum=471
And I do know what the purpose of the V is, I was asking if someone was to do this "dream" what would its value be, would they learn anything? Perhaps how the birds communicate within each other to tell like for example "I'm tired" in geese haha.

Dude that would be awesome lol a UAV shuttle haha

This project does not seem impossible to do but you would need tons of money. I mean talk about a composite ship, the on board system, a camera that detects familiar images, plus what about when they do land? How would the UAV itself land and take off. Unless... we switch to an ornithopter, that would seem much more energy consuming, but if we designed it to be efficient then maybe? Like a goose look-a-like haha
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by AgentCow007 View Post
... but that would be like programming a glider to thermal... sounds impossible to me
Check out Dan Edwards’s ALOFT project... very much possible

http://goosetech.homelinux.com/soaring/index.php
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 11:44 AM
prefer lift over drag anyday
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There is also a "thermi centering device" that is relatively simple, plus a guy on DIY drones that did an autonomous soaring plane using only GPS altitude to indicate thermals!
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 12:07 PM
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You are delving into the world of artificial intelligence.

There are robotic projects that I've seen (YouTube), where 5.. or 6 small "robotic "modules" all move around independently within an arena.

They communicate with each other wirelessly, so know each others position within the "space". And are able to self navigate to each other, and interact.

One such project has a handlful of robotic "blocks" that roll around and again, communicate with other within an area, and join, to become one complete robot, that appears to develop legs and arms.

Then the guys walks over, throws it on the floor, they all break apart spreading out across the floor, into 5 or 6 seperate pieces. They then communicate with each other again... joining together.

It probably sounds rediculous, but you have to watch the video, clever stuff!
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Old Nov 27, 2009, 01:25 PM
Physics hate's my ideas
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I think I know what you are referring to but the part where he drops them on the floor that sounds crazy haha
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Old Nov 30, 2009, 10:22 PM
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need a funnel on the front to catch some of the goose poop and convert it to biofuel.
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Old Nov 30, 2009, 11:17 PM
Physics hate's my ideas
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Excellent idea! Goose poop=ethanol? Didn't know I still like the landing/resting bay idea lmao' like imagine a boxing movie they sit on a stool they get water and get fixed up haha
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Old Dec 03, 2009, 07:50 AM
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Grab one of these geese and strap a beacon to it's paw.
Plane will follow the flock of geese and keep a certain (programmed) minimum distance.

Just a raw idea.
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Old Dec 03, 2009, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Connexxion View Post
Grab one of these geese and strap a beacon to it's paw.
Plane will follow the flock of geese and keep a certain (programmed) minimum distance.

Just a raw idea.
What then happens if that one geese (with the beacon) flies to the front of the flock?....

Your plane will try to maintain a few feet or more behind, however then stuck right in the centre of the following flock = CARNAGE as Propellor meets multiple feathers / legs / head / bodies!
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Old Dec 03, 2009, 11:04 AM
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So ... have you ever watched geese flying in formation, and wondered why one arm of the V is longer than the other?

Well, there is a very simple answer ....

.

.

.

.


.

.

.

.

... More geese on that side.





(Betcha never heard that before! If not, well, where exactly do you live?)


Perhaps the above-mentioned UAV project could obtain some Government grant to confirm this hypothesis?
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