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Old Jun 21, 2010, 08:36 AM
Certified RPAS Instructor
The_Mongrel's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
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Originally Posted by AussieHoppy View Post

Mongrel, looking briefly at your site, can you get gear above and beyond what you list there?
Just that i'd rather buy from a local-ish onshore bloke than go off shore if the prices are comparable
~i'm eyeing yer eyes stuff- EE/ET/antenna tracking
~can you tell me the significant differences between the FS-HD1 and the GoPro cams? is the FS-HD1 only for FS gear? i wont be using FS downlink Tx/Rx, so the cam has to work with other downink equipment.
this'll be for my project plane, and will be both for onboard recording and downlink fpv goggs. i am looking at the DX201 cam otherwise, if i cant record onboard
~can you get the SN555 camera? that'll be good for my learner plane
~the fma co-pilot- this works well/ compliments the EE/ET stuff?
Goggles- i'm waiting to hear about a pair of goggs private deal [hi cralis!] but i'll be chasing another pair for those who dare to be in one of my virtual plane crashes... do you sell anything other than FS goggs?
my apologies in advance for yet more noob q's...

I can get pretty much anything you guys like. Sometimes I can compete, and sometimes the shipping and the oz dollar kills me.

What do you have in mind?

With regards to the goggles, I am sticking with the Fat Sharks. I have tried the RVision (I had 2 of them) and frankly, they sh%t me. The silicone rubber boot that is used to block out the light is a pain in the arse!! So unless you mod the goggles, you will have issues.

The HD1 is designed for FPV, whereas the Go Pro is designed for anything sports. So when you have finished FPVing, take the Go Pro to the beach and and get some bodysurfing action. You will pay more for the Go Pro, but it has more uses.

I have heard mixed reviews about the SN555. I would use the Fat Shark RCV922 camera - I have them in PAL right now, and they are bloody good.

Questions are good mate! We all have to learn!!

Cheers
-J
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Old Jun 21, 2010, 06:25 PM
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g'day, I'll ask here because it says 'Aussie' and "FPV" in the title and I qualify on both counts.

I'm steadily accumulating equipment for my first FPV plane. So far, I've got the Thomas LRS system (with booster if necessary), and I really like the picture on the gopro HD, despite the wide angle, and it also solves the in-flight recording aspect - minus OSD. I think the OSD stuff will be eagletree as I already have it, and sensors, and GPS, and the OSD module.

My hope is from a high point with good LOS to really see how far I can push the range, using RSSI to tell me when things are getting iffy.

But I'm stumped as to video. What should I be looking at so the video doesn't fuzz out way before the capabilities of the plane or the LRS control !?

This must be a simple answer: "x should work given the right antenna", and the other known quantities? but I can't seem to grasp the info, it is all so scattered.

thanks.
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Old Jun 21, 2010, 08:16 PM
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Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc863 View Post
g'day, I'll ask here because it says 'Aussie' and "FPV" in the title and I qualify on both counts.

I'm steadily accumulating equipment for my first FPV plane. So far, I've got the Thomas LRS system (with booster if necessary), and I really like the picture on the gopro HD, despite the wide angle, and it also solves the in-flight recording aspect - minus OSD. I think the OSD stuff will be eagletree as I already have it, and sensors, and GPS, and the OSD module.

My hope is from a high point with good LOS to really see how far I can push the range, using RSSI to tell me when things are getting iffy.

But I'm stumped as to video. What should I be looking at so the video doesn't fuzz out way before the capabilities of the plane or the LRS control !?

This must be a simple answer: "x should work given the right antenna", and the other known quantities? but I can't seem to grasp the info, it is all so scattered.

thanks.


Gday NYC,

I wish there was a simple answer like "X will do" but there just aint.

It will depend on a whole bunch of defining factors.

Eg: - If you are going to run 2.4Ghz video, stay away from urban areas, as every wireless router within cooee will cause you grief, not to mention anyone else using 2.4G wireless phones, and other 2.4G devices including RC radios. The max power allowed in Aus is 10mW, which is not far enough to clear a football field, so you would have to operate illegally.

If you are thinking on using 900mhz, well they work great - but there are also things to consider here in Australia. One is the GSM telephone network. They will interfere with your 900mhz gear, so be careful where you fly and where the Mobile Phone towers are operating. Keep in mind that they will know you are there when you start scrambling their systems.

The other thing to consider with 900Mhz is that its not a legal frequency in Australia (neither is the Thomas LRS for that matter) and so you will need to make sure you are covert in your operations. Don't let people know what frequencies you are using etc. There has been some talk in the forums that the LRS frequency is used (and monitored) by the Australian Armed Forces, but I am yet to confirm this, and I think it may be a bit of scare mongering.

5.8Ghz is an option, but will probably not give you the distance.

So much to consider i'm afraid. Research Research Research.
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Old Jun 21, 2010, 08:27 PM
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thanks,
I was reading the whole time and the picture is gradually getting clearer.

bevrc recommended by email a 800mw or 1.5w 1.3ghz system with appropriate antenna on the receiver to come close to the supposed LRS capability. Like you said, that will avoid 2.4ghz pollution, and not be as unwieldy as the 900mhz band. However it seems like the ground station antenna is not really an off the shelf item.

A patch antenna doesn't need to be aimed as much as a grid or yagi, is that correct? at the expense of loss of db of course.

I wish someone would design something that hooked into your downlink GPS and then aimed a highly directional antenna at the plane all the time!

Anyway, I'm not fooling myself that any of this would be legal, and prepared for some authority or other to drive by (I wonder if they would consider waiting till I fly backa and land before asking me to remove my heads up display so they can cuff me).

edit: according to the Australian Band Plans PDF dated this year, 435-438 is "amateur satellites" and the "note" says "The satellite segment should be kept clear of all terrestrial operation."
Not really sure what that means, but it doesn't sound very military to me.
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Old Jun 21, 2010, 08:41 PM
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Australia, NSW, Yass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc863 View Post
thanks,
I was reading the whole time and the picture is gradually getting clearer.

bevrc recommended by email a 800mw or 1.5w 1.3ghz system with appropriate antenna on the receiver to come close to the supposed LRS capability. Like you said, that will avoid 2.4ghz pollution, and not be as unwieldy as the 900mhz band. However it seems like the ground station antenna is not really an off the shelf item.

A patch antenna doesn't need to be aimed as much as a grid or yagi, is that correct? at the expense of loss of db of course.

I wish someone would design something that hooked into your downlink GPS and then aimed a highly directional antenna at the plane all the time!

Anyway, I'm not fooling myself that any of this would be legal, and prepared for some authority or other to drive by (I wonder if they would consider waiting till I fly backa and land before asking me to remove my heads up display so they can cuff me).

edit: according to the Australian Band Plans PDF dated this year, 435-438 is "amateur satellites" and the "note" says "The satellite segment should be kept clear of all terrestrial operation."
Not really sure what that means, but it doesn't sound very military to me.
Your best approach to keeping a good video link is an Antenna Tracker!!
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 12:07 AM
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Australia, WA, Carlisle North
Joined Jul 2008
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Hi all,

Just curious where you Perth guys are fpving. I have a ship set up but go out of town to fly.

cheers
Doug
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 12:52 AM
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Ian Williams's Avatar
Port Elliot, South Australia
Joined Nov 2009
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nyc863, the EE Eagle Eyes coupled with an antenna tracker will point the vid antenna at the plane and give excellent results even on 2.4Ghz. The issue is more around what other flyers at your field use for RC control. If its 2.4Ghz then you will get some banding in the vid image. Simple solution is to wait for them to land! If you are flying in out of the way places then you don't have to worry about it.

If you use a yagi antenna you need a tracker that can handle the weight. I use the Readymade RC tracker (from Mongrel Gear) but I modified the pan shaft arrangement by adding two bearing blocks and small bearings so that it pans smoothly and can take the weight. I run a 14dbi patch on it and the only other mod was to counter balance the patch so that the tilt servo didn't have to hold the weight of the antenna. I used a couple of rubber bands to do this. Both pan and tilt servos are the ones that came with the tracker kit.

Cheers

Ian
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 02:17 AM
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 02:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Ian Williams View Post
I use the Readymade RC tracker (from Mongrel Gear)
thanks,
sadly having already bought the eagletree stuff, this requires a different telemetry system
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 03:57 AM
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Adelaide South Australia
Joined Sep 2007
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Is there a tracker that will follow the RVOSD downlink? I have 2 of them(Mk1,Mk4) and wouldnt mind messing with tracking. Life just aint complicated enough yet.
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 04:00 AM
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 05:45 AM
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Australia, NSW, Sydney
Joined Nov 2009
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Just poking in again but I would recomend starting with low power systems first. I would say that if you start with the 10mw versions of the 2.4G Transmitter with a simple 36mhz reciever is better so you can get a grip on the whole plane layout and stuff.

Then go to the 600/800mw systems as these need more support systems in the plane. (this also depends on your skills with soldering and wiring) The wiring from all of the plug and pray systems work fine but you end up adding more weight to the planes which you don't really need. This makes the difference between a 15 min flight and a 40min flight with the exact same gear sometimes. NB. sometimes !! not always but SOMETIMES !!!!

I have recordings from my very first flights and I tell you I have come a long way since then. I'm only starting to get some real performance from my gear now and I really wonder what the heck I was doing and thinking back then. I think that possibly making notes on the setup and performance helps too even when you don't think you make much of a change to your system.

25mw gear is basically the LOS stuff and you go up from there as when you can go beyond LOS with these systems then you know you are getting on the right track and up the power to be able to fly further.

I started with 25mw 2.4G then went 200mw 2.4G then 600mw 1.2G to stay with 2.4G recievers in the plane. The made incremental steps up in video transmitters to 5W and had different hurdles with speedies and plane recievers and onboard components all the way back to the Controler transmitter which by the way I still use a DX7 all be it it's modified now.

As for distances this varies dramatically with the weather so this is a biggie in any case with any longer distances. The site can have varying effects too.

I think it's great to see all the new people getting into this and the videos they produce and enjoy this as much as the stuff I do but you need to keep it responsible and safe and have gear that you use to do the task safe. Having a model plane come screaming down at me on fire is not my idea of fun although great to watch but I think you get the idea as at a distance you could hit more than just the ground and have a larger problem on your hands that even the RFS won't be able to control !!!

Have fun learning and make sure you share the results with us all.

We all love the Aussie landscape and love the views but I don't think I can stress the safety aspect enough when learning.

SO MORE VIDS EVERYONE !!!
POPcorn's here waiting !and yes I working on more of my vids too

Mr_B
8)
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 05:54 AM
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I dunno. After flying helis, from small to huge, any plane, even FPV a mile away, feels extremely safe. I think the pilot stands more chance of getting chased by bees, or run over by a car while wearing their googles, than anyone else does of getting hit and also injured by a foamie full of FPV gear. Even the props are usually pushers not right on the nose.

If a 700 class heli throws a blade, it is potentially deadly yet heli fun fly incidents are all but nil. They have batteries containing much more watt hour as well and push them so much harder. FPV doesnt mean you can be a cowboy but with some common sense precautions the only likely injury is to ones wallet.
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 06:22 AM
Flying Monkey
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Australia, NSW, Sydney
Joined Nov 2009
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Originally Posted by nyc863 View Post
I dunno. After flying helis, from small to huge, any plane, even FPV a mile away, feels extremely safe. I think the pilot stands more chance of getting chased by bees, or run over by a car while wearing their googles, than anyone else does of getting hit and also injured by a foamie full of FPV gear. Even the props are usually pushers not right on the nose.

If a 700 class heli throws a blade, it is potentially deadly yet heli fun fly incidents are all but nil. They have batteries containing much more watt hour as well and push them so much harder. FPV doesnt mean you can be a cowboy but with some common sense precautions the only likely injury is to ones wallet.

hehe. I agree with you on all the above. There are no butts from me with anything you say there.
A plane to go 5 or more clicks has to be safe to do it reliably but there is always murph who will pop on your shoulder or jump in the plane or helli or whatever when your not looking so that's always a problem even with the best of anything.
I think you have to agree, that little bugger Murph, can do anything.
(hope he's not offended too much) (he might be a member here)

Mr_B
8)
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Old Jun 22, 2010, 06:51 AM
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Australia, NSW, Yass
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Originally Posted by AussieHoppy View Post
speaking of trackers, i need some prices for gear Mongrel, better to pm here or contact off yer website?
You can PM... or if you jump on our site, you can use the Contact Form.

OR

Email the_mongrel@mongrelgear.com.au
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