HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old May 31, 2010, 05:03 PM
Firepower
Firepower's Avatar
North Brisbane, Australia
Joined Mar 2010
2,847 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieHoppy View Post
i started to post this with the intention of a head's up for mongrel, but in discussion with this guy, i am personally becoming curious.

10km+ LOS @ 300m altitude using 500mw, then there is 1000mw...

check this:

he is offering a FREE unit for someone in Australia to test fly this thing here, only stipulation is that the tester has 5km+ experience... and i'd suggest having a healthy RTH feature...

http://www.bevrc.com/24g-long-range-...tios-p-85.html

this is the latest correspondence:

JR module: fit for 347,388,783,U8,PCM10,PCM10S,PCM10SX,PCM10IIs,8103, 9303

FUTABA: 3PM,3PK, 7U, 8U, 8J, 9C , 9Z, and FN series.
HITEC: Optic 6, Eclipse 7.
WFLY: WFT09

The module fit for this ratios, just plug and play.
It's new products, no one in Australia try it.
The price will be 129.99USD, including one Tx, and 2 8-chan Rxs, with antenna and some accessories.


personally i find this very difficult to believe, having read nothing but pitfalls for 2.4 other than fasst

but mongrel, he has mentioned elsewhere, they are about to release a uhf version as well

surely it has to be a look for a free unit!

any takers?

i'd love one of these, for... ummmm.... boosting my wifi...
Just be careful - I can not prove it but the web site may be FAKE FAKE FAKE FAKE FAKE FAKE

This web site is selling fake GHD hair straiteners and there are a lot of sites that do and they are all fake. I spent 2 hours trying to check if one was fake as it was so good with holograms etc but a phone call to GHD says all. FAKE.

http://www.ghdoutlet-au.com/ghd-purp...tener-p-9.html

FAKE FAKE FAKE FAKE You actually do get product from these web sites but they are not GHD ones.

http://www.fabulousghd.com/index.php...piur9ccqpctq67

This mob may be just taking postage fees and getting in a lot of suckers. I hope I am wrong because the TV goggle cost is great if they are any good.
Firepower is online now Find More Posts by Firepower
Last edited by Firepower; May 31, 2010 at 07:56 PM.
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old May 31, 2010, 05:30 PM
Firepower
Firepower's Avatar
North Brisbane, Australia
Joined Mar 2010
2,847 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by biloxthecat View Post
I agree.
I might be mistaken but never wrong - There is a chance that MAAA has stricter rules for their members than the CASA requirements to meet insurance requirements. But as some are saying be careful approaching CASA or we will probably end up worse off.

Probably because the police in Brisbane have set a unit up to do FPV and the problem some one may have a better system than theirs. (Just joking)

For those who do not know the MAAA system, he is how I see it.

If you join a club there are CLUB FEES and then you pay for Queensland MAAQ fees $42 and then MAAA fees $60. With all this you get the insurance etc. The club fees would be the highest.

The local clubs have meetings and have to abide by the MAAQ and MAAA rules and there would be a process to have rules changed. Bit hard to change FPV stuff. I suspect most club members do not know what FPV and goggles are. I mentioned that recently to members at a big local club and they thought I was stupid. (not really - just putting the point over)

Check out the World Records here - flying for 15 hours etc.

http://www.fai.org/aeromodelling/documents

Just another 2 cents worth.
Firepower is online now Find More Posts by Firepower
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 07:53 PM
Firepower
Firepower's Avatar
North Brisbane, Australia
Joined Mar 2010
2,847 Posts
Tell me to shut up but the government basically closed down my business (if you could call it that) Laser printers cartridges can be filled up the same as inkjet cartridges so I was buying bulk toner from USA. I was just going to potter around with it until I retired and then decide if I wanted to go bigger. (Lucky the government steped in as I do not want to work when I stop my current job this year).

Guess what happened without any discussion with the toner industry only the chemical industry. They brought in that you had to register with them to import toner and pay an almost $500 fee. Seeing I only had 15 customers it was not worth paying the fee so I could not import anymore. Guess what and I have it in writing that the public can not import ONE toner without paying the fee. They have to catch you first but it is not hard when the package says toner.

So if someone is selling FPV stuff and says to CASA I am selling it in Australia there is always a chance they might say - no you are not.

I hope I am wrong again for everyone's sake.

There's 3 cents worth now.
Firepower is online now Find More Posts by Firepower
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 08:07 PM
Aint nothing like a Mongrel!!
The_Mongrel's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
7,504 Posts
FIRE - The problem is not selling it - The goggles can be used to watch TV or Movies, the cameras can be used for, well, a camera... and the TX and RX that we sell are all ACMA approved and C-Ticked. So I have no concerns with that.

I just get the Shites when some fat bureaucrat in his comfy chair puts on his Fun Police badge and decides he wants to phuck it up for the rest of us. We are so over governed now, it is almost to the point of ridiculous.
The_Mongrel is offline Find More Posts by The_Mongrel
RCG Plus Member
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 09:41 PM
Firepower
Firepower's Avatar
North Brisbane, Australia
Joined Mar 2010
2,847 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Mongrel View Post
FIRE - The problem is not selling it - The goggles can be used to watch TV or Movies, the cameras can be used for, well, a camera... and the TX and RX that we sell are all ACMA approved and C-Ticked. So I have no concerns with that.

I just get the Shites when some fat bureaucrat in his comfy chair puts on his Fun Police badge and decides he wants to phuck it up for the rest of us. We are so over governed now, it is almost to the point of ridiculous.
Good answer about selling the equipment and the bureaucrats give us all the shirts.

I will not keep commenting on this but if there is no one to sell it to there is a problem. If it gets around that the rules get changed so that FPV is banned then the number of FPV people will drop drastically.

Most people like flying in parks and not going a long distance (non FPV). You will find just flying RC in parks is already illegal.

I will not comment further as I am only adding to the info that is out there that bureaucrats can see.

Keep the good FPV stuff coming.
Firepower is online now Find More Posts by Firepower
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 10:28 PM
Aint nothing like a Mongrel!!
The_Mongrel's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
7,504 Posts
And yet another response for you from CASA..

Thanks again for your continuing pursuit of clarity. I hope the following starts to make more sense.

The authority for model aircraft flight stems from the CASR 101 sub part G, amplified by AC 101-3 (0) and further developed by the MAAA in its policies and operations procedures. So CASA has the head of power. CASA has delegated the responsibilities to the MAAA for self-administration of model aircraft for sport and recreation.

"Visual Line of Sight" (VLOS) is the basic requirement for the control of model aircraft under CASR 101 and the ACs - that is the pilot must be in direct continuous visual contact with the aircraft through normal eyesight, aided only by glasses/spectacles or contact lenses. This is to ensure flight control, traffic separation orientation, navigation, etc are maintained by the pilot in command. No direct vision is considered to be "Beyond Visual Line of Sight" (BVLOS) and FPV is considered to be a component of this operation. As a result, FPV is not permitted under visual line of sight under CASR 101 and the ACs, as it does not currently meet the standards required or satisfy "visual line of sight" (VLOS) requirements. Any proposed reliance on FPV would have to be assessed and to our knowledge it has not been tested in the environment. A concept of BVLOS operations is being developed for industry guidance; FPV will be a component of this concept. A safety case and procedures for FPV use have not been developed, hence the reluctance at this time to approve such operations in the commercial sphere.

My statement "As FPV is via a video link, it is currently not permitted" applies to UAS operations, not model aircraft...again as it applies to BVLOS operations. Further, model aircraft are not permitted to by flown outside of visual line of sight - CASR 101, paras 101.385 and 101.400 refer

Under the MAAA rules, FPV can be used for model aircraft, providing the pilot in command is not on FPV. Please refer to MAAA MOPS066 paras 5 (Safety Concerns) and 6 (Policy) as they are specific in the requirements.
The_Mongrel is offline Find More Posts by The_Mongrel
RCG Plus Member
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:20 PM
Registered User
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Mar 2006
366 Posts
Seems I was right for once.

Now as for, quote

"Under the MAAA rules, FPV can be used for model aircraft, providing the pilot in command is not on FPV"

This means that your 'spotter' is actually in command of the aircraft with VLOS and can take over the controls at any time if required. ie. trainer buddy box would be a great example of how to do this properly.

So thats how it works technically Mongrel and why it can be legal, so please stop stirring sh$t up with CASA ok. The MAAA deals with them on our behalf.
gt35r is offline Find More Posts by gt35r
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:33 PM
Aint nothing like a Mongrel!!
The_Mongrel's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
7,504 Posts
hehe Not stirring shite mate.... Our group of flyers wanted some clarity, and I was the noob that put my hand up to communicate with CASA etc. hmm... I have had fun!! NOT!!

Cheers
-J
The_Mongrel is offline Find More Posts by The_Mongrel
RCG Plus Member
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:40 PM
Registered User
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Mar 2006
366 Posts
And not that I want to play devil's advocate, but why would they want to endorse any f'wit
being able to buy a model plane with some video gear and go cruising around at any altitude and distance far beyond what normal LOS permits?

If I can't fly anywhere but one location in the inner metro area, and thats with insurance and signs, then I'm sure its not going to be easy to convince anyone that being able to cruise over suburbs and cities is a good idea.

I personally fly over the sea so its my bad luck if anything goes wrong. But how many members of the general public would give the same concern??
The small minded bureaucrats are covering their arses but as we all know its less likely
that the average joe really thinks about all the consequences.

The bigger that FPV gets the worse it will get.
Just seeing some of the videos posted publicly makes me very nervous, I really don't understand
why anyone would want to publish their exploits for anyone to see.
Just like the guy in Perth who thought it would be a good idea to show his 'close encounter' with an airliner near the airport.
gt35r is offline Find More Posts by gt35r
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:43 PM
Registered User
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Mar 2006
366 Posts
Anyway Mongrel, I think your 'copter is great because it gives a great FPV perspective without needing to be flown miles away.
Not having a go at you personally.
gt35r is offline Find More Posts by gt35r
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:46 PM
Post # 20 million
Kev.au's Avatar
Joined Aug 2009
2,636 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by gt35r View Post
Anyway Mongrel, I think your 'copter is great because it gives a great FPV perspective without needing to be flown miles away.
Not having a go at you personally.
I agree, plus mine got shipped today !!!! WOO HOO!!!! Thanks Mongrel .




Cheers, Kev.
Kev.au is offline Find More Posts by Kev.au
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:47 PM
Aint nothing like a Mongrel!!
The_Mongrel's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Yass
Joined Dec 2007
7,504 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by gt35r View Post
Anyway Mongrel, I think your 'copter is great because it gives a great FPV perspective without needing to be flown miles away.
Not having a go at you personally.
All good mate!! No offence taken dude - it is all good discussion.

I do like our Tris!! Man they are so much fun to fly.

Personally, I got really bored of the long distance flight thing!! After the first few, you start looking for "things to do" whilst up there.

With the Tri, its much more fun trying t o fly under trees, over trees, through the carport etc. All within 30 meters!!
The_Mongrel is offline Find More Posts by The_Mongrel
RCG Plus Member
Reply With Quote
Old May 31, 2010, 11:52 PM
Registered User
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Mar 2006
366 Posts
Absolutely, go too far and high and its like looking at a still photo (i imagine).

For the same reason I'm sure airliner pilots fall asleep until its time to land.
gt35r is offline Find More Posts by gt35r
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 01, 2010, 12:38 AM
AlouetteIII's Avatar
near the Beach
Joined Sep 2007
649 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Mongrel View Post
And yet another response for you from CASA..

Thanks again for your continuing pursuit of clarity. I hope the following starts to make more sense.

The authority for model aircraft flight stems from the CASR 101 sub part G, amplified by AC 101-3 (0) and further developed by the MAAA in its policies and operations procedures. So CASA has the head of power. CASA has delegated the responsibilities to the MAAA for self-administration of model aircraft for sport and recreation.

"Visual Line of Sight" (VLOS) is the basic requirement for the control of model aircraft under CASR 101 and the ACs - that is the pilot must be in direct continuous visual contact with the aircraft through normal eyesight, aided only by glasses/spectacles or contact lenses. This is to ensure flight control, traffic separation orientation, navigation, etc are maintained by the pilot in command. No direct vision is considered to be "Beyond Visual Line of Sight" (BVLOS) and FPV is considered to be a component of this operation. As a result, FPV is not permitted under visual line of sight under CASR 101 and the ACs, as it does not currently meet the standards required or satisfy "visual line of sight" (VLOS) requirements. Any proposed reliance on FPV would have to be assessed and to our knowledge it has not been tested in the environment. A concept of BVLOS operations is being developed for industry guidance; FPV will be a component of this concept. A safety case and procedures for FPV use have not been developed, hence the reluctance at this time to approve such operations in the commercial sphere.

My statement "As FPV is via a video link, it is currently not permitted" applies to UAS operations, not model aircraft...again as it applies to BVLOS operations. Further, model aircraft are not permitted to by flown outside of visual line of sight - CASR 101, paras 101.385 and 101.400 refer

Under the MAAA rules, FPV can be used for model aircraft, providing the pilot in command is not on FPV. Please refer to MAAA MOPS066 paras 5 (Safety Concerns) and 6 (Policy) as they are specific in the requirements.
Good on You Mongrel - Some back peddling from him now combined with more wild statements drawn from his own imagination. For RC Models He likes to fall back on 101.385 - This part carries the specific heading Visibility for Operation of Model A/C and states that the 'visibility' must be good enough for the PIC to be able to to see it. It's all about visibility - nowhere in the AU Regs does it mention Spectacles or Glasses? The Regs are saying no flying in visibilty no suitable, ie consider fog,rain or smoke which would effect visibility. 101.400 does not apply below 400ft - he must stop quoting that para out of context. If you go above 400ft then I agree with Mick - Use the MAAA system and have a PIC on a buddy box. His whole rant relating to VLOS being the basis of RC Model flying is cute but again does not reference any particular sub-Regulation - sounds like a personal narrative.

'FPV is a component of BVLOS?' (no reference from him) - So Now he changes his reply, about time - UAV Comm Ops - You must argue FPV is actually a control Station as per AC 101-1(0) 8.5.9 when it includes OSDPro with fail-safe nav.

For me reading his reply he is trying to fluff you off. You are going to have to be specific and require answer based on fact - For RC Models
FPV is permitted indoors - if not which Reg?
FPV is permitted below 400ft providing the visibility allows the model to be seen at all times - if not which Reg?
FPV is permitted above 400ft with the PIC buddy box and the co-pilot flying on FPV - If not which Reg?

For UAV Comm Ops

FPV is the UAV Control Station when combined with OSDPRo and Failsafe and simply requires CASA to inspect and approve the vehicle. If not which sub Reg?

Mongrel for your overall understanding in the early 1990's things changed in AU - Regs are Laws - Right - and they are used under the criminal code to prosecute cases. Advisory circulars are in place for civil damages - If you hurt somebody - they/their family can seek compensation based on the fact that did not follow these bit of 'Advisor Guidance' ACs. I have been in court with CASA and seen defence lawyers and judges wrangling with the Regs - CASA lost that case - This man's opinion is not even admissible in an AU court room. He needs to come clean and answer your questions based on actual Regs or you must ask to take the matter to his Senior FOI or the RD.

You may have to be the one who puts together an FPV system/craft with OSD Failsafe and pushes it all the way to be an approved UAV. Otherwise all Aussie FPV pilots will ultimately get fluffed away and forgotten while other countries develop their pilots/these skills and technical know-how.
AlouetteIII is offline Find More Posts by AlouetteIII
Site Sponsor
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 01, 2010, 08:45 AM
The Flying Circus
ommadawn's Avatar
Adelaide South Australia
Joined Sep 2007
3,531 Posts
Slightly off track here, but how does visual line of sight and pilot in control work for our free flight buddies? As they have no control at all where does that leave them with CASA?
ommadawn is online now Find More Posts by ommadawn
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion FPV Car and Other Fun FPV Projects Thread: Crash9 FPV Talk 6015 Today 02:34 AM
Build Log Easy Fly Glider ST330 (Easy Glider Clone) FPV Build Thread SoMoney FPV Talk 493 Nov 12, 2012 03:08 PM
Discussion FPV Beginners Reference Mega Thread... rc_ron FPV Talk 167 Mar 24, 2012 07:31 AM
Cool Aussie XBOX Live thread ozzi supercub Australia 7 Oct 22, 2009 01:42 PM
Discussion FPV WARS (Thread for FPV "B" Movies) ch1 FPV Talk 8 Sep 16, 2009 05:37 PM