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Old Aug 31, 2010, 09:54 PM
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Hi guys, how are you mounting the board? Any isolation? How bad affect vibrations?
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 09:55 PM
SSM
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Originally Posted by skye View Post
I have question related to CG on quads. Does it need to be exactly at the center or it can be off some centimetres?
IMHO it's best for the CG to be centred. If the CG is not centred, then the power required of all motors will not be identical. You can trim for this, but then the trim required will likely not be the same for all throttle settings - the result is that the copter may tilt when you throttle up, or throttle down. Now the gyros should catch this, but it's just one more thing for them to be doing. So best to go for a centre CG. Simon
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 09:58 PM
"Let's put a camera on that.."
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You raise an interesting point here... when I did the board I used the solder you describe below, but the stuff I've been struggling with here is 60/40. Similar, but not the same. Maybe that's part of my trouble. I did buy smaller gauge wire today, though. I plan to make a replica of Don's harness for love of its simplicity. Next time I'm at the shack I'll pick up some of the good stuff in the thicker diameter (the stuff I used for the board is like robot hair).

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Originally Posted by 321 View Post
What solder are you using? While you do not want overkill on wire size weighing down your aircraft and making it more difficult to do the solder job, the type of solder used also makes a significant difference as to how easy it is to work with. Some solders require an extra 50-70+ degrees of heat to melt.

If you aren't already, you might want to try 62/36/2 (tin/lead/silver), with its low melting temperature, rapid transformation from liquid to solid, and strength. The stuff is a dream to work with. I used it, along with flux, for the reflow soldering of the SMD controller board and it worked pretty darned good there too. With it, I can solder PC boards with a 15W iron and 10awg to Deans connections with a clean 40W iron. You can get it at your local Radio Shack in rosin-core or solid. Solid will require you to use flux.
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 10:23 PM
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Originally Posted by spagoziak View Post
You raise an interesting point here... when I did the board I used the solder you describe below, but the stuff I've been struggling with here is 60/40. Similar, but not the same. Maybe that's part of my trouble. I did buy smaller gauge wire today, though. I plan to make a replica of Don's harness for love of its simplicity. Next time I'm at the shack I'll pick up some of the good stuff in the thicker diameter (the stuff I used for the board is like robot hair).
Spagoziak,
Fulg also made a good point in his post (3 posts back) regarding the soldering Iron you choose. The other point is keeping the tip clean and well tinned.
I will post the how-to video on Sat.
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 10:47 PM
"Let's put a camera on that.."
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Twin Cities, MN
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Wow this is really neat! Can mini deans really handle the juice a 1050kv motor on a 25 amp ESC, backed by an 11.1v battery? Doesn't seem like it, but looks are always deceiving in RC

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Originally Posted by Flyboy_001 View Post
Hi Guys;

I just found this thread (so Jim, Grease, others - you're going to have to do a better job at hiding ). For those of you who don't know me, I've crashed Spectrolutions, MK, and QuadPowered boards for about 3 years, and now looking forward to crashing my very first KKcopter.

@Spag, I worked up with this design and have been testing is since June. So far, so good with no problems. Not recommended for any "Heavy Lift" quads but I don't see much of that in this thread, what a relief!

I see that it's very similar to cyhyam's post, so I think it's fantastic that great minds think alike . Anyway, it works well, and it's another option for you to consider.

Greg
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 10:52 PM
"Let's put a camera on that.."
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Thank you Don, I look forward to seeing it! I'll dive in and try to make my own based on your description--mostly because I'll be trapped at work overnight tomorrow with NOTHING to do, so if my motors come in tomorrow afternoon (fingers crossed), then I can finish the KK and maybe even fly it in the parking lot!! So if my first attempt at the harness is only half ok, I'll just make another one this weekend after reviewing your tutorial. The wire for this stuff is pretty cheap, as far as this sort of thing goes.

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Originally Posted by don_cocinero View Post
Spagoziak,
Fulg also made a good point in his post (3 posts back) regarding the soldering Iron you choose. The other point is keeping the tip clean and well tinned.
I will post the how-to video on Sat.
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 11:09 PM
That tree again!!!!
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Originally Posted by Fulg View Post
...

Eventually I bought a Weller soldering station, which is one of the best things I ever bought. I'm amazed that I'm still using the original tip, after building two complete KK boards and plenty of ESC/motor/battery connectors. Finally, the days of struggling with soldering are over!
2 boards will not even cause any dent to the tip .

I bought the earlier version of that soldering station (WES50), and it's been with me for 9 years for many many works done out of it (I build a lot of lights for helis/planes/car). It's still working now. I think I've only replaced tips 3 times so far. The trick to get a the tips last is using right temperature (not too hot), turn it off when you're done, and don't scrape the tips on anything abrasive. I use wet sponge to clean the tip. Work best I believe. It can handle small things like 0603 components (I don't have the skill for smaller stuff) and big thing like A123 battery case (which drains a lot of heat). For anything bigger, I use it in conjunction with a heat gun to preheat the area first.

-Thanh
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 11:18 PM
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Originally Posted by thanhTran View Post
2 boards will not even cause any dent to the tip .

I bought the earlier version of that soldering station (WES50), and it's been with me for 9 years for many many works done out of it (I build a lot of lights for helis/planes/car). It's still working now. I think I've only replaced tips 3 times so far. The trick to get a the tips last is using right temperature (not too hot), turn it off when you're done, and don't scrape the tips on anything abrasive. I use wet sponge to clean the tip. Work best I believe. It can handle small things like 0603 components (I don't have the skill for smaller stuff) and big thing like A123 battery case (which drains a lot of heat). For anything bigger, I use it in conjunction with a heat gun to preheat the area first.

-Thanh
yeah my weller is going strong now after almost 20 years! I actually wish it would break so i could justify a a new one.
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 11:27 PM
That tree again!!!!
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Originally Posted by Xnaron View Post
yeah my weller is going strong now after almost 20 years! I actually wish it would break so i could justify a a new one.
Great to know. I've been wondering when it's time I have to replace the pencil
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by SSM View Post
IMHO it's best for the CG to be centred. If the CG is not centred, then the power required of all motors will not be identical. You can trim for this, but then the trim required will likely not be the same for all throttle settings - the result is that the copter may tilt when you throttle up, or throttle down. Now the gyros should catch this, but it's just one more thing for them to be doing. So best to go for a centre CG. Simon
Hi Simon, thanks for the advise.
The reason I was asking is because I am thinking of placing the controller off centre so in the future I can place additional accessories to move the CG exactly at the centre. How do those guys with camera or vidcam place their equipment? Do they rearrange?
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Old Aug 31, 2010, 11:52 PM
That tree again!!!!
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Germantown, MD, US
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Originally Posted by skye View Post
...How do those guys with camera or vidcam place their equipment? Do they rearrange?
Gyro should always be at the center of the quad / tri since the tilting axis of the quad/tri will be closest to the axis of the gyro.
On my tricopter, I have the board in the middle, the camera in front, and the battery on the back. On another ship, the camera is hanging beneath the tri frame.
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Old Sep 01, 2010, 12:01 AM
That tree again!!!!
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Originally Posted by rcjuampa View Post
Hi guys, how are you mounting the board? Any isolation? How bad affect vibrations?
Several layers of foam tape between the board and the frame. All gyros are affected by vibration. Some works better under vibration than some other.
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Old Sep 01, 2010, 12:29 AM
321
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Originally Posted by spagoziak View Post
... Next time I'm at the shack I'll pick up some of the good stuff in the thicker diameter (the stuff I used for the board is like robot hair).
The stuff at the shack is also like robot hair ...just so you know!
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Old Sep 01, 2010, 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by thanhTran View Post
Gyro should always be at the center of the quad / tri since the tilting axis of the quad/tri will be closest to the axis of the gyro.
There seem to be two different schools of thought on this point:

1. It doesn't matter at all where on the frame the gyros are located. Gyros only detect angular changes and the angular changes are identical everywhere on the frame. See FlipFlop's tri-copter for an example of a tricopter with its gyros placed far off centre but which flies beautifully.

2. As thanhTran says - gyros should be central, so the axis of the gyros are on (or close to) the roll/pitch/yaw axes of the copter.

I'm a type 1 kind of person myself.

Simon
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Old Sep 01, 2010, 01:52 AM
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I try to get the gyros close to the center of my quad's axis' but feel it's not ultra critical. The greatest amount of rotational motion occur's at the center of an axis, so a gyro will pickup less motion as it gets further away from it. If you have issues where you need to turn the roll & pitch gain down too far, it may actually be better to move the KK board away from the center axis.
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