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Old Sep 15, 2010, 11:04 AM
Aerial Images of Texas
tashley's Avatar
The Texas Gulf Coast where hurricanes come to play
Joined Aug 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyhyam View Post
Paul,

There are many people that have tried to do what you say you have
succeeded at with no success. The only thing you have brought forward to
explain your success is the low vibration level. There are many tris out there
with low or no vibration including mine, that is not the key.

I do feel heading hold is a better system and would like to evaluate the
differences myself to confirm.

Since you are the only one to succeed at this it would be great if you could
share with everyone how to do it. Once there are others with it working it
will be much easier to accept.
Plus 1
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 11:53 AM
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Joined Nov 2007
547 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by tashley View Post
Actually it's more like around 20% back from the front. The front motors in a straight line perpendicular to the rear arm mean that the cg position needs to be much closer to the front of the machine for each motor to balance the same.
Hey Tashley
Maybe I'm half asleep and missing something in my equation but for the sake of some guy not crashing his T-Tri. Maybe someone who has experience with this can let us or him know I still believe the CG should be 33% back from an imaginary line that joins the 2 front motor centers to the rear motor regardless what the rear boom length is and regardless of how far the 2 motors are apart. Of course I wouldnt go shorter than a conventional tri anyway as the pitch stability will be compromised.
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 11:57 AM
X-Ikarus
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United Kingdom, North York
Joined Feb 2003
1,709 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyhyam View Post
Paul,

There are many people that have tried to do what you say you have
succeeded at
with no success. The only thing you have brought forward to
explain your success is the low vibration level. There are many tris out there
with low or no vibration including mine, that is not the key.

I do feel heading hold is a better system and would like to evaluate the
differences myself to confirm.

Since you are the only one to succeed at this it would be great if you could
share with everyone how to do it. Once there are others with it working it
will be much easier to accept.

You still doubt ............. ?

Statement. My Tri is in HH on ALL FOUR Gyros
The last video link I posted shows this

I disagree with you totally on Vibration it IS the Root cause of problems on HH

Reread this post so I don't have to repeat myself
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=9213

I have No special mixes,No Tricks and its not Magic
I also resent your posts implying I don't know what I'm talking about.

The people that know me, know better
I have No need to prove anything to anyone

Paul
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 12:36 PM
Aerial Images of Texas
tashley's Avatar
The Texas Gulf Coast where hurricanes come to play
Joined Aug 2003
1,960 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by talkthetorque View Post
Hey Tashley
Maybe I'm half asleep and missing something in my equation but for the sake of some guy not crashing his T-Tri. Maybe someone who has experience with this can let us or him know I still believe the CG should be 33% back from an imaginary line that joins the 2 front motor centers to the rear motor regardless what the rear boom length is and regardless of how far the 2 motors are apart. Of course I wouldnt go shorter than a conventional tri anyway as the pitch stability will be compromised.
If you use that formula for locating the cg the machine will be way nose heavy. On a fixed wing aircraft the cg is about 30% of the mean cord from the leading edge but on a tri motored craft all three arms should be equally balanced just as a heli should balance directly on the main shaft. As an experiment cut two sticks one half as long as the other. Now glue the short stick to the center of the long stick and placing your finger tip on the bottom side of the short stick move it fore and aft till you get balance. Now see where your fingertip ends up. When your finger is placed so that the sticks balance fore and aft, you have found your proper cg, static model or flying model, it dosen't matter.
I don't have experience in building and flying a "Tee" Tri but I do know a thing or three about balancing aircraft.
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 12:51 PM
Multi Rotors Rule ! ;-)
SkyEyes's Avatar
United Kingdom
Joined Jul 2010
879 Posts
Eeek - My passing question on where the CofG would be (or how to calculate it) on a " T " shaped Tricopter has really created a storm.
I apologise guys! Perhaps I will go back to my wife (who teaches Sciences/Mathematics) and ask her, from a Trigonometry standpoint. lol

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Old Sep 15, 2010, 01:17 PM
Aerial Images of Texas
tashley's Avatar
The Texas Gulf Coast where hurricanes come to play
Joined Aug 2003
1,960 Posts
You haven't created a storm, just a healthy debate.
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 01:24 PM
An ordinary sort of incredible
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United States, TN, Knoxville
Joined Dec 2004
931 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by n3m1s1s View Post
nice idea but if you look for a "franklin" street hockey stick the cheapy ones are made from plastic that has been pre squared so to speak

might save you alot of time i picked up 2 sticks net and frame for a few quid at carboot sale

heres my hockey stick so far



and abit of the goal



also turns out that old heli blades make good frames too if you add abit of foam



and yes it does fly even though its just held together with 2 zipties on each leg and medium CA glue

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXdNe5QOqxc
I like the Heli blade idea...

How heavy are the h-e-double hockey sticks? Are they hollow?
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 01:42 PM
Aerial Images of Texas
tashley's Avatar
The Texas Gulf Coast where hurricanes come to play
Joined Aug 2003
1,960 Posts
17.6 percent back of the center of convergence of the three arms. Give or take a blonde one.
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 02:03 PM
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UK, Redcar and Cleveland, Redcar
Joined Feb 2010
297 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reflex1 View Post
Thanks for the kind words Keith (Kf52t)

2 motor shafts ,2 x motor bearings and a little balancing
has put the Tri back to normal with very low vibration levels.

I made a short Video with only One arm powered (safest way to Demo imo)
to show the HH action

Note rpms are low (its only sat on a stool and unrestrained ! )
Motor loading is low in the Vid. but I can confirm the Gyro works the same
through out the Full throttle range.

Video here
http://uk.video.yahoo.com/watch/8240546/21902038
Your welcome Paul
Now having watched the video I'm now wondering how to get my tri over to you
Good job Paul I for one have watched the video and you can plainly see the HH mode in operation on the tri
Good on you buddy, remember people once thought the earth was flat...
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 02:16 PM
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Ilford,Essex, UK
Joined May 2006
1,959 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reflex1 View Post
You still doubt ............. ?

Statement. My Tri is in HH on ALL FOUR Gyros
The last video link I posted shows this

I disagree with you totally on Vibration it IS the Root cause of problems on HH

Reread this post so I don't have to repeat myself
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=9213

I have No special mixes,No Tricks and its not Magic
I also resent your posts implying I don't know what I'm talking about.

The people that know me, know better
I have No need to prove anything to anyone

Paul
Paul

I BELIEVE it is realy great!

How do your settings convert to a DX6i how do I set my throttle curve???
I have been reading and rereading your posts and am having a problem understanding as the only experience with "Wingless aircraft" is with Sign Guys tri mine flys"OK" ish but to get it stable as in your videos would be great.

Dont let people put you off they all mean well, but you seem to have made a bit of a breakthrough so I need to be led by the hand.

So how would your settings convert to a dx6i???

Well done and thanks for sharing

Regards Jeff
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Last edited by Upup; Sep 15, 2010 at 02:58 PM.
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 02:48 PM
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UK, Redcar and Cleveland, Redcar
Joined Feb 2010
297 Posts
I'm running the same setup as you Jeff so I'll be watching with Interest
Hmmmm hang on, it was posted that they need more than one tri running in HH mode to convince others
I'm a stones throw from Paul
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 02:53 PM
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Ilford,Essex, UK
Joined May 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kf52t View Post
I'm running the same setup as you Jeff so I'll be watching with Interest
Hmmmm hang on, it was posted that they need more than one tri running in HH mode to convince others
I'm a stones throw from Paul
Why arnt you there already I may have a problem thought I am using DT700's and Paul said it may need higher KV motors

Jeff
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 03:03 PM
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Swansea, Massachusetts
Joined Dec 2004
2,088 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyEyes View Post
Eeek - My passing question on where the CofG would be (or how to calculate it) on a " T " shaped Tricopter has really created a storm.
I apologise guys! Perhaps I will go back to my wife (who teaches Sciences/Mathematics) and ask her, from a Trigonometry standpoint. lol

Get out the paper, and a place to draw. Draw your motors spaced the way you like. next draw a standard 120 degree frame to connect the motors. Then, draw a T to connect the motors, or any style frame, swept, less than 120 degree......

The CG falls at the intersection of the 120 degree arms. Thats it, no trig needed...

BobD
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 03:06 PM
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UK, Redcar and Cleveland, Redcar
Joined Feb 2010
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I just have to hope that 860kv might just get me there, failing that i have a few 1500kvs kicking around somewhere, having recently moved house they are probably still packed till the new shop is finished.

Much more space for bigger and better flying machines...

C'mon Paul Where Are You
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Old Sep 15, 2010, 03:13 PM
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Highland, CA, USA
Joined Jan 2001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reflex1 View Post
You still doubt ............. ?

I also resent your posts implying I don't know what I'm talking about.

The people that know me, know better
I have No need to prove anything to anyone

Paul
CALM DOWN !

I did not say I doubted you. I asked you to share with us your setup so the rest of us can enjoy
what you have discovered.

I am not asking you to prove anything….share your knowledge.

I never said that you did not accomplish this, or you were not in HH, (I am sorry if you feel this way).
I simply explained how they react on tris that I have setup and the limits of the HH gyro.

I'm sorry for all the text effects, you're rubbing off on me.

Walt
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