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Old Nov 07, 2010, 09:47 AM
Crashing but learning...
Wildweasel09's Avatar
Brazil, São Paulo, Sao Paulo
Joined May 2009
463 Posts
This weather is really not nice to us!! I got a mask that covers my entire face (but the eyes and mouth), but I have the impression that if I have to wear it, it's because it's not a good day to fly!
Anyways, hot shower always help me when I have headaches, perhaps it helps you too.

Stay warm and take care,

Nelson
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Old Nov 07, 2010, 06:01 PM
Gary
gklein's Avatar
USA, CT, Sandy Hook
Joined Dec 2009
810 Posts
Completed my Zero. Or nearly, always a few details that I would like to attend to.

Setup:
ZX Technology receiver (72mhz)
Feigo 6 amp esc
Modified Rhino 360mah
Two 2.5 gram servos
Two HobbyKing Ultra Micro 1.7g Servos
HK 10gram motor with 5030prop

First I filled the two fuselage sides with bits of foam to provide a flat surface for a cf strip on each side. Positioned the firewall with the esc below and to one side. Carved out the foam a minor amount to fit the battery. The rhino battery was unwrapped to remove the balanced charging wires and plug. Two plugs seemed redundant and the very stiff wires and large plug are difficult to position. And in the vertical position it was a little too tall to get up to the firewall without taking away more foam than I wanted. So I unwrapped the Rhino, carefully cut away the red and black charging wires (positive and negative). Then I cut the blue wire short (center tap) and added a flexible wire with a 0.8mm in-line plug from HC. Saving the charging plug and using it to create a charging adapter harness by adding a female jst and the other half of the 0.8mm in-line. I also shortened the battery lead. The battery is now 3 grams lighter, and fits right up to the firewall.

I cut a top hatch and glued the wing in place after removing the snap-on plugs. The tail surfaces and the ailerons were hinged with floppy disc material (first time I tried that and it worked great!), I used my dremel cut-off wheel and modified a single blade razor to be ¼ inch wide and used it lying on the table with a 1/64 shim under it to slot the surfaces. Took minutes and worked flawlessly in the thin foam.

As you can see in the pictures, I put the two linear servos under the wing (put diodes in the power lines for 2-cell use). The linkage worked fine.
At this point I flew a test flight, went well, but I will come back to that in a moment.

I recently bought a micro T 28 and loved the removable landing gear. So I thought to emulate this on the Zero. You can see the results in the pictures. 1/64th ply top and bottom with a 1/32nd spacer to accept the landing wire. We will see how this works out, it is untested to-date. The tail wheel is not steerable (came out of my box), although I think it came from a Dubro steerable set.

Results:
I am waiting on the weather to try the landing gear. The test flight without the gear was flawless. No trim changes needed (rare for me), beautiful loops and spins, rolls needed rudder (I need to increase the aileron throw.) I flew for 15 minutes and brought it in before evidence of cut-off. A discharge cycle on the battery showed I still had 130mah left, although I think the esc would have cut-off before using all of it. I loved it!!!! Flew on rails. No tip stall evident. My flying buddy was flying his micro T28 at the same time and reported bumpy air. I never felt it with the Zero.

My AUW presently is 110 grams without the main gear and 114 grams with the main gear. It balanced right at 1 1/4 inches and required no ballast.

Left to do:
I ran out of magnets for the hatch and embarrassingly used a rubber band for the test flight (is this confession?). I will clean up the hatch line with touch up paint and install the magnets.
Cut plugs for the holes in the bottom of the wing and paint.
Increase the aileron throw. Play with programming. I didn't try the flapperon function yet, but I have set up in the transmitter and will check it out.
I don't like tape on surfaces. I will use a technique that I have used before and ca a cf rod to the leading edge. Probably .030. Unobtrusive, will add less than a gram.

Conclusion:

Buy more of them.
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Last edited by gklein; Nov 07, 2010 at 06:43 PM.
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 12:44 PM
Registered User
Little Norway
Joined Feb 2010
171 Posts
I am also pondering about applying these two small 2 gram servos to the ailerons on my P-47 COX, but i am also thinking about using one center 4 gram servo for "dual action" purpose ;-) But then again i would have to find something that makes a nice 90 degree bend without causing any friction issues inside the nylon cable lead...hmmm.
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 12:48 PM
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Rotatorus's Avatar
's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
1,419 Posts
Hi Gklein,

Nice job on the Zero! Please do me a favour and fill up those holes under the main wing. It will add to the already near to perfect finish of your plane.

How will you add throw to the ailerons? Do the servo's allow for 150% travel?

Robert
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:11 PM
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Joined May 2010
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I placed a single 5g servo right over the center of gravity and have plenty aileron deflection. Except for a very small piece of wire, there is nothing showing under the Zero.
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:21 PM
Gary
gklein's Avatar
USA, CT, Sandy Hook
Joined Dec 2009
810 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rotatorus View Post
Hi Gklein,

Nice job on the Zero! Please do me a favour and fill up those holes under the main wing. It will add to the already near to perfect finish of your plane.

How will you add throw to the ailerons? Do the servo's allow for 150% travel?

Robert
Thanks Robert. I will fill those nasty holes this week! Increasing the aileron throw will probably require that I make an even smaller horn at the aileron and get as close as possible to the hinge line. With a servo travel of + or - only 2.7mm, it can be tricky. I do not yet know the limits of overtravel and will try to find out. Meanwhile. I have increased the amount of coupling with rudder which should give me a better barrel roll.

I just ordered a spitfire, me 109 and another zero. Color me an addict!
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:24 PM
Gary
gklein's Avatar
USA, CT, Sandy Hook
Joined Dec 2009
810 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkydiverDriver View Post
I placed a single 5g servo right over the center of gravity and have plenty aileron deflection. Except for a very small piece of wire, there is nothing showing under the Zero.
I considered that, but I wanted a flapperon capability. After seeing the amount of room in the finished fuselage, next time I may place two of these on the wing inside.
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:35 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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F4U ready for paint

Hi guys,

I thought I'd show the progress on the F4U corsair. Ready for paint right now.

Robert
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:43 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gklein View Post
I just ordered a spitfire, me 109 and another zero. Color me an addict!
I feel your pain . Enjoy and keep us posted on your progress.

With your next build, try the painting of a plane and maybe a clear canopy with detailing. It takes more time and effort but for just a little more money you get a lot more building fun out of one plane. If you do a good job you will even get some Ooooohhsss and Aaaaaahss . Everybody likes some positive attention I think.

That other zero... Is it going to be a kitbash maybe? Any chance of seeing your plane in the air?


Robert
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 01:51 PM
Gary
gklein's Avatar
USA, CT, Sandy Hook
Joined Dec 2009
810 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rotatorus View Post
I feel your pain . Enjoy and keep us posted on your progress.

With your next build, try the painting of a plane and maybe a clear canopy with detailing. It takes more time and effort but for just a little more money you get a lot more building fun out of one plane. If you do a good job you will even get some Ooooohhsss and Aaaaaahss . Everybody likes some positive attention I think.

That other zero... Is it going to be a kitbash maybe? Any chance of seeing your plane in the air?


Robert
Your read my mind. I am going to play with forming a canopy and painting. I have a pilot in the current one, but you can't see him thru the smoky canopy. I was thinking of adding an LED inside the canopy. I like your buzz.
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 02:04 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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Buzz came free with my shoppings. I liked his head with the ear pieces and all. I did give him another color though. The purple has become beige and his "jacket" has become leather. I painted some red-brown belts over his torso. I think he looks more like a pilot now. I wonder what it looks like underneath the canopy. I can't see until I finish the paintjob on the plane.

With all the issues with the house and having to work each day, I don't know when I'll find the time to do that but it will happen. Probably it will take a few days though.

I think the clear canopy really adds to appearance of the plane. It is light, it allows detailing of the canopy and if there is something in there, you can actually see it.

Good luck and good night!

Robert
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Old Nov 08, 2010, 02:20 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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So you want to illuminate your plane...

Hi Gklein,

One other thing I want to share with you. If you're looking for a light and small illumination solution, look at these:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...idProduct=8944

These strips contain very bright led's. They are small and they can be used in parallel connection to the esc. You need to use three leds or a multiple of three. The strip contains all what is needed to let them shine on 6 to 12 Volts. This means you can use them with either a two or three cell lipo.

A strip might not be what you had in mind but know this, you can soldere the led's free from the strip, you just need to mark the + and the - for reconnecting them. You can use very light wire to connect them back to the strip and place the led practically anywhere on the plane.

I suggest you use this wire for connecting the LED's to the strip.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...dProduct=11850

It is light, thin, sturdy and will allow for easy camouflage.

I have tested this on a cox model which has been put on hold. It really works. I took several strips in different colors and combined those. You will have a green and red and white light for navigation or take two bright white ones shining forward from the leading edge of the plane and one on the tail... All combinations are possible as long as you use three at a time on a strip. Interior lighting will work as well but you might get a glowing plane .

Anyway, that's something I wanted to share, do with it what you want. It is a cheap, light and compact way to add something special to this small a plane.

Robert
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Old Nov 09, 2010, 02:44 AM
Scratch building addict
rotagen's Avatar
United States, CA, Felton
Joined Jan 2005
658 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rotatorus View Post
Hi Rotagen,

I tried those magnest once to hold on the wing on a spitfire. It did work but I used 12 to hold on the wing. If you are going to do this for the fuse as well, it might get pretty expensive and heavy. Those magnets need to be glued in place as well. With the costs of a kit and so on, You might just want to use some glue and maybe a bit of carbon. The fuse really gets its strength form the two halves glued together to form a tube shape. You're welkom to try but I think is will be a lot of effort for an uncertain goal.

Then again, I do put a lot of effort and cash into these planes as well. If you're doing this to satisfy an internal need to know, please do try and get it out of your system .

Good luck!

Robert
Hmm, 12 magnets for that little wing?!! I wonder what type of mags you were using. Mine are tiny and labelled somehing like "super strong" magnets. I thought they were rare earth but not sure, they're bright silver and appx 3mm in diameter. Like I said before, I have a 9 ounce biplane using these magnets to hold the wing struts to the wing, just 4 per wing, 2 top and 2 bottom. The magnets are actually too strong to be glued in, I learned this the hard way, the only way to do it is with Tyvek tape over each magnet, the strongest tape I have ever seen and super lightweight. Epoxy (and CA) is very poor at gluing metals to foam, hot-glue is better but still not strong enough for these tiny guys. ANyways I'm not kidding when I say this bipe can loop at high speed and never has a problem with the struts on this much heavier plane which surely is subject to much greater forces.

So theres just no way that the cox wing would require more than 2 pairs of these tiny mags IMO, and total weight of this would be 4 grams or less.

As for the fuse being weaker without being glued, that makes sense to me, but the only thing that matters is when you hit ground, whether or not you can dissipate the energy or not. If you can't, then the very fragile width cox fuse will crack, like it did on my brushed version after a quite UN-violent crash. I just can't believe that about 3 or 4 pairs of these to hold the fuse halves together would ever come apart during flight, and if they come apart during impact with the ground this is surely an advantage.

Not trying to get in a big argument here, I'm just giving my opinions which comes from LOTS of experience building scratch planes and learning how to make them relatively crash-proof. Not many people have made a scratch Fokker biplane like I did that has survived lots of pretty nasty crashes with very minor damage, and its all because Both wings are rubber-banded on and the wing struts are not glued or bolted to the wings.

I will try the wings with magnets for sure, and possibly the fuse as well, I'll let you know how it goes. Experiments like these certainly increase the "fun-factor".
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Old Nov 09, 2010, 12:19 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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For me it was an experiment as well. I never tried it before and decided to put three magnets on each side. They meet with the same amount of magnets in the wingsaddle. It was a pretty stiff bond but it still can slide sideways quite easily. Perhaps it was overkill but I thought it might be neccesairy. Mine were also rare earth magnets of about 3 to 4 mm in radius. Small and shiney and impossible to get in place.

My method to put them in place:
I used epoxy and I used painterstape to hold them in place. stick one magnet on the sticky side ogf the tape and then put the other at the opposite side and it will keep itself up due to magnetism. then I made holes in the wing to fit the magnet and put glue in. put the magnet in the hole and stick the tape over the wing so it will be flush with the surface of the wing. Do this for al magnets. Then fit the wing in place in the wingsaddle when the glue is dry. apply a little pressure to the underside of the wing. remove wing and you're left with small dents to indicate the place of the magnets. make holes and fill them with glue. put the wing in place and let the glue cure. Once dry the fit will be flush and the magnets will be placed in the correct manner (they attract each other instead of push each other away.

I thought this might give you an idea of how to approach this magnets thing. If you want to eliminate the lateral sliging movement of the wing, just add a small dowel in front to meet a small hole in the wingsaddle.

Good luck! Robert
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Old Nov 10, 2010, 03:06 PM
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's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands
Joined Apr 2006
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F4U corsair in british colors - paintjob done

Hi all,

This evening I found the time to paint the F4U. The result is pretty nice. I used three basic colors for the outside:

- US grey light (vallejo model air - 71045)
- Russian green (vallejo model air - 71017)
- Intermediate blue (vallejo model air - 005)

I used a cut down buzz lightyear figure as pilot, a home made clear canopy and a balsa wood dashboard to dress the plane.

Here are the pictures. Judge for yourself if it was a succes so far. Decals and markings still need to be be applied.


Robert
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