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Old Nov 25, 2012, 11:24 PM
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Australia, VIC, Glen Waverley
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np eagle

It sounds like common sense... then again, what IS common sense.

When applying the tape make sure both the starting end end of the tape finish up in the opposite direction to the way the blade hits the air. This would stop the tape from trying to lift up while the blades are spinning.

If applying a lot of tape I tend to also cut them up into small sections and applying them in the opposite direction with the last layer as mention above. To get this right I may have 2-3 attempts to get both balance & layer correct.... call me anal, but its has always worked.
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Old Nov 25, 2012, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by mhills51 View Post
They just started their Cyber Monday sale, it's working now.
Must be down to us OZ people or limited speed due to the US fire sale
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Old Nov 25, 2012, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by evltoy View Post
np eagle

It sounds like common sense... then again, what IS common sense.

When applying the tape make sure both the starting end end of the tape finish up in the opposite direction to the way the blade hits the air. This would stop the tape from trying to lift up while the blades are spinning.

If applying a lot of tape I tend to also cut them up into small sections and applying them in the opposite direction with the last layer as mention above. To get this right I may have 2-3 attempts to get both balance & layer correct.... call me anal, but its has always worked.
Hey evltoy. I apply tape to the bottom of the blade only to make it look better. However, I was wondering if there was another aspect. I mean I have the sweet balancers, what else should I do? I guess I need to read HF a lot more.

Also, converting the last FB to FBL
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Old Nov 25, 2012, 11:53 PM
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Awww. your balancers are very niiice. I just have the simple Align one that’s i sit on 2 match box's.

ok. what are you balancing for? CG or weight? To do CG your tape would be in the tip of a blade. For the weight you add tape to the area of the marked CG.

Finless has a video on blade balancing that has never failed me.

With applying very small amounts of tape, just make sure you have the ends facing away from the incoming direction of the wind. Centre the middle of the tape length on the leading edge of the blade to start.

Hope that help

Oh.. and if you have white blades white electrical tape will not show up
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Old Nov 25, 2012, 11:55 PM
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I just put them both on a scale for weight. Most of the time they are within a gram or two. Next do the cg and that is were to put the extra weight.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 12:06 AM
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Yeah, that can work most of the time if the baldes are not too out
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
It can't be. The way Bob describes the effect is that it makes the links squarer to the servo arms at more than 50% collective. Therefore at less than 50% collective, the links will be at a more acute angle.

It's surprising that helis fly as well as they do, bearing in mind the amount of interaction you get with cyclic input at high or low collective.
It's not about making the links squarer at high and low collective, it's about making the swash end of the link travel more evenly throughout the servo's movement range.

Raise and lower the swash and watch the links, it works the same in negative collective as it does in positive. As long as all the links are the same length there will be no or at least very little interaction. My swash is level throughout the travel range with no need for endpoint adjustments.



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Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
You must be running the servos pretty close to their mechanical limits at full combined collective and cyclic though, so that emphasises the importance of minimising the use of sub-trim either in the TX or the FBL controller.
+/- 12 degrees is right at the default of 100% on the collective range slider adjust in the Robird setup, you have to go up to 119% before it complains that you your servo arms are too short. At 75% it will complain that the servo arms are too long, so it's actually right about in the middle of the range.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 12:36 AM
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Originally Posted by evltoy View Post

I just got a package today... RJX FBL head for the 500.. very nice quality and the t600-1100kv motor for the 550.
Tip to make removing and installing the head easier. The bolts that hold on the swashdriver arms also serve to pinch the bottom of the headblock together to grip the shaft. What I did was to tighten them till the headblock was a tight fit on the shaft so when I need to take the head off I don't have to untighten the arms to remove it.

Also I put a nylon washer on each side of the jesus bolt to protect the anodizing around the hole.

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Originally Posted by eagle777 View Post
I bought some blemderm tape off Ebay. But it's not a phone or tv

How do you guys balance your blades? Without having tape showing? I use blenderm on the bottom of the blade. I guess near the center of the blade length now. No idea about lateral balancing. Is that even a thing for 500?
I just use reflector tape on the ends of the blades. Makes a nice tron-like glowing circle at the edge of the rotor disk.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 07:33 AM
just gotta mess with it!
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Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
It's not about making the links squarer at high and low collective, it's about making the swash end of the link travel more evenly throughout the servo's movement range.
We'll just have to agree to differ on that one. I've actually started to analyse the geometry of my 450 Pro when using the Tarot head, with 18mm grip arms and 12.7mm servo arms, and the RJX head with 15mm servo arms. It's hard to illustrate the results, but I might be able to put them into a table. At the same time I realise that slop in the linkages and anti-rotation bracket will have some effect, so there's only so far you can go.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 07:55 AM
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First flight in some cold weather today A little snow on the ground but that wasnt stopping me. I forgot how much the cold weather effects these lipo packs! Anyone flying with any type of skis or anything in the winter?
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 01:51 PM
just gotta mess with it!
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Originally Posted by 3d astronaut View Post
First flight in some cold weather today A little snow on the ground but that wasnt stopping me. I forgot how much the cold weather effects these lipo packs! Anyone flying with any type of skis or anything in the winter?
I guess you could make up some skis, but the trouble would be any slight and uneven sinking into the snow would result in a tail strike. I've never done that with my helis, and maybe you could get away with it, but I reckon most people would fly off and land on a hard surface or use a suitable mat.

My thumbs seem to noitice the cold more than my lipos - you must be using a TX mitt!
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
We'll just have to agree to differ on that one. I've actually started to analyse the geometry of my 450 Pro when using the Tarot head, with 18mm grip arms and 12.7mm servo arms, and the RJX head with 15mm servo arms. It's hard to illustrate the results, but I might be able to put them into a table. At the same time I realise that slop in the linkages and anti-rotation bracket will have some effect, so there's only so far you can go.
On my 450 Sport the balls are 12mm out on the horns, on my 500 they are about 17mm (closest hole to 16.5 on the horn) On the 500's +/- 12 degrees collective is right at 100% in the FBL setup where it's supposed to be and I have it set for 15 degrees maximum cyclic with no problems. I could take it all the way up to 16.3 degrees if I wanted but the radius arms get too close to the arms on the lower swash for my comfort so I backed it off a bit.

There are no interactions in the swash, the leveler shows that it stays perfectly leveled throughout the entire collective range.

I think you may have missed the point of having the links angled inward at zero degrees. If the link is perfectly vertical at zero degrees then as the servo arm turns further away from center the link end at the swash moves up or down less and less for every degree that the servo turns. by angling it inward the relationship between the swash movement and the rotation on the servo's output shaft is spread more evenly across the collective travel range.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 02:00 PM
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Anyone know anything about these servos?

http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/D...odID=SPMSA5040



Same size as the HS-225. Has the same torque as a Futaba 9650 but is faster. Has coreless motor. Comes with a 1 year warranty from HH.

The metal gear version is $27.99 and the plastic gear is $19.99. I'm thinking about giving these a try in my 500 and moving the MI servos over to the beater I'm building.
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 04:00 PM
just gotta mess with it!
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It's only theory

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
There are no interactions in the swash, the leveler shows that it stays perfectly leveled throughout the entire collective range.
With decent symmetry in your servo to swash links, you shouldn't get any cyclic changes with any collective input. You might check your blade pitch at 100% and compare it with what you get at 0% though. You might see up to 0.5 degree or so of difference ( eg +12.0 at 100%, -11.5 at 0% if your servo arms are dead level at 50%.

The thing is, even if your elevator link was at some crazy angle giving you measurable elevator input with changing collective, the FBL controller will simply correct for elevator, since no elevator input has been commanded from the TX.

The interactions that the FBL controller won't correct for, however, and that will therefore have an effect on flight are added or reduced collective resulting from cyclic input. Those interactions are almost impossible to measure with a pitch gauge. At best you'd have to use one pitch gauge on each blade. My CAD analysis is restricted to collective only, and then combined collective and aileron or elevator inputs, otherwise it becomes way too tedious to work it out if you add aileron and elevator together.

The interactions are fairly small - amounting to a fraction of a degree - so you have to bear in mind that linkage slop may exceed the amount of interaction. I also know that my thumbs are not that accurate in moving the collective stick, say when I'm doing a roll - so this is purely an academic, theoretical exercise, to satisfy my own curiosity.

It may be that the optimum setup on my 450 pro with the long-armed RJX head is with the servo arms not level at 50%....
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Old Nov 26, 2012, 04:13 PM
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I'm thinking the computer radios and fbl gyros have taken a lot out of what Bob teaches. Still It's nice to learn the right way of setting things up and not rely completely on the radio or gyro to do it for us.
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