SMALL - espritmodel.com SMALL - Telemetry SMALL - Radio
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Apr 22, 2012, 08:14 PM
Registered User
United States, TX, Grand Prairie
Joined Nov 2005
5,692 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham d View Post
erH,

Never good when this happens. I do not have a lot of faith in the full moving stab at high speed. Initially my Hawk had the full moving stab but converted it to fixed and cut out the elavator at the end. I mounted the servos in the elavator the same way as the stock F86. I know it is not as impressive as the full moving stab, but when in the air you cannot see any difference and gives peace of mind.
This is a good point too, the reason full size jets have full moving elevators is because at supper sonic speeds the air flow is split at the leading edge of the stab and reduces are flow over the control that is usually rearward...move the hole elevator and that doesn't become a problem

I will do this with my FF T-45 and thinking hard about doing it with this jet.

Today I saw A Habu 32 do around 200 shallow dive with fixed stabs, I'm starting to think fix stabs are safest

I was only push around 3000 watts with mine and I know it can do more and fly great.
erh7771 is offline Find More Posts by erh7771
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Apr 23, 2012, 07:32 AM
Registered User
Dionysus's Avatar
McQueeney TX
Joined Oct 2005
570 Posts
Full flying stabs give your model better control at low speeds. This is especially true with jets, no prop blast at low speed.

It all comes down to how you want your model to look, your skill level and what kind of project it is. I personally think they are worth the extra effort even if scale fidelity is not your priority.

Quote:
I'm starting to think fix stabs are safest
The safest way of doing anything is to do it right, anyone can make something work in a non-scale manner, but that is what makes my plane so special, I did it right.
Dionysus is offline Find More Posts by Dionysus
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 07:36 AM
Registered User
South Africa, GP, Pretoria
Joined Mar 2011
423 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dionysus View Post
Full flying stabs give your model better control at low speeds. This is especially true with jets, no prop blast at low speed.

It all comes down to how you want your model to look, your skill level and what kind of project it is. I personally think they are worth the extra effort even if scale fidelity is not your priority.



The safest way of doing anything is to do it right, anyone can make something work in a non-scale manner, but that is what makes my plane so special, I did it right.
I agree on the look, but even if it is built correctly, there is a speed limit to what the full moving stab will endure.
Graham d is offline Find More Posts by Graham d
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 09:44 AM
Registered User
techspy's Avatar
USA, NC, Matthews
Joined Aug 2008
3,212 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lithonion View Post
Abit off topic but here is my Flyfly F-86 with 4 coats of liquid sheeting. I only filled in a few panel lines and imperfections with Durhams/spackle mix. But the wing was completely covered in the Durhams/Spackle to add more strength aside from the carbon fiber that was added. WIth that, the carbon and the liquid sheeting my wing will only flex if you jump on it.

Pic of wing before paint, and pic of it finished. Peeps on RCGroups make fun of me and kick sand in my face cause I sorta like those panel lines.

On topic I like this plane so much I ordered a F-100 last night.
How do you like the liquid sheeting? I have tried it once (although it was a long time ago and I understand they changed the formula since then) and did not like ti at all. It ran a good bit and stayed tacky a loooong time. I even bought some from the distributor and tried it but it seemed that it really like a warm temperature to cure correctly. How much weight did it add to your wing?

Thanks
techspy is offline Find More Posts by techspy
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: My Esprit Saga
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 10:41 AM
Registered User
United States, TX, Grand Prairie
Joined Nov 2005
5,692 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by techspy View Post
How do you like the liquid sheeting? I have tried it once (although it was a long time ago and I understand they changed the formula since then) and did not like ti at all. It ran a good bit and stayed tacky a loooong time. I even bought some from the distributor and tried it but it seemed that it really like a warm temperature to cure correctly. How much weight did it add to your wing?

Thanks
You cure it with moisture and it sets up fast
erh7771 is offline Find More Posts by erh7771
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 10:49 AM
Registered User
United States, TX, Grand Prairie
Joined Nov 2005
5,692 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dionysus View Post
...The safest way of doing anything is to do it right, anyone can make something work in a non-scale manner, but that is what makes my plane so special, I did it right.
I'm no doubt going to do the stab setup similar to what you have for the next build...I think that should be the standard of doing it correct for full stabs
erh7771 is offline Find More Posts by erh7771
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 01:34 PM
Have you seen my nut?
Lithonion's Avatar
Omaha, Nebraska
Joined Mar 2006
2,417 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by techspy View Post
How do you like the liquid sheeting? I have tried it once (although it was a long time ago and I understand they changed the formula since then) and did not like ti at all. It ran a good bit and stayed tacky a loooong time. I even bought some from the distributor and tried it but it seemed that it really like a warm temperature to cure correctly. How much weight did it add to your wing?

Thanks
I really like it. I have only used the old stuff one time. My F-86 is my 4th airframe using the LSII. Mine was dry to the touch in around 30 minutes. All the times I have used this stuff I just let it air dry and I have had no problems at all. The LSII adds 0.1 oz/sq. ft. My F-86 is 6.5lbs.
Lithonion is offline Find More Posts by Lithonion
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 01:50 PM
Official Boat Bum
Eddie P's Avatar
United States, NV, Reno
Joined Mar 2000
7,180 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by erh7771 View Post
Today I saw A Habu 32 do around 200 shallow dive with fixed stabs, I'm starting to think fix stabs are safest
I don't discount your observation or thinking at all, but turbine scale jets are flying all the time at massive G loadings at above 200 mph with full flying stabs. What is important with any airplane no matter what is to ensure the servos are mounted firmly, the flying surfaces/controls are mounted firmly and the linkage is sound for the design - then the only thing left to consider is the servo torque and the aerodynamic balance of the stabilizer. If you have an overly strong servo the stabilizer can be left "unbalanced" with no problems up to a point (and this F-100 will be just fine below 150 without balanced controls IMHO). But with this design the weak points are as I mentioned earlier and that has to be accounted for if going any faster or heavier than stock. Full flying stabs are not unsafe at all, they just need to be mounted strongly as the whole stab along with it's control depends on the single point mount.
Eddie P is offline Find More Posts by Eddie P
RCG Plus Member
Old Apr 23, 2012, 06:14 PM
Registered User
Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Nov 2006
10,734 Posts
This elevator mount system is terrible really. Weak as water.
For 10 cents more they could have made something decent! Much larger surface area (larger mount block), better pivot shaft etc.

Anyone that has seen the Freewing Su-35 will know what a 'great' flying stab mounting system should be like. That is the best designed and implemented system I have seen. Too bad that was after finishing the F-100 tail end.....
Huge mounting blocks, in the fuselage and in the elevator, and a 6mm CF rod for the shaft - strong and a huge surface area for the pivot surface.
This would be in the order of 5 times stronger and more stable/accurate, solid, than the F-100's. For a slightly smaller aircraft.

Every time I see, and think, about the F-100 one I cringe.....
PeterVRC is online now Find More Posts by PeterVRC
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: SBEC's connected in parallel
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 06:36 PM
Registered User
4stripes's Avatar
Canada, ON, Burlington
Joined Jan 2009
2,930 Posts
There are limits to any design. The plane is an older design and if flown with a 5 or 6S setup it works fine. If it was built to withstand 8-10 or 12S it would weigh more and cost more. It is far from perfect but with minimal upgrades it is a lot of plane for the money.
I'm quite happy with its performance on 6S. For all out speed a smaller, composite plane might be a better choice..
4stripes is offline Find More Posts by 4stripes
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Some photos of the EDF fleet!
Reply With Quote
Old Apr 23, 2012, 07:28 PM
Official Boat Bum
Eddie P's Avatar
United States, NV, Reno
Joined Mar 2000
7,180 Posts
The bad news is that this F-100 was not designed to be a hot rod. It's designed "OK", but only for 6s and 1200 watts and as 4striped correctly said it is an older design where going this big was unheard of for inexpensive foam scale-like models - it wasn't made for big power systems. The good news is that it's very straight forward to upgrade this F-100 tail for more power common today, especially since it has to be assembled no matter what - so it can be done up front.
Eddie P is offline Find More Posts by Eddie P
RCG Plus Member
Old May 12, 2012, 03:08 PM
Registered User
Australia, NSW, Hillsborough
Joined Feb 2008
92 Posts
Dionysus

Hey mate,
How about another inspiratioinal video to keep this thread alive. Hate to see it die off totally
Steve
heliclown is offline Find More Posts by heliclown
Reply With Quote
Old May 12, 2012, 04:39 PM
Registered User
Southwestern VA
Joined Nov 2009
476 Posts
Planning a couple more flights on mine tomorrow. On 6s she flies like a big trainer for the most part. Does anyone else's F-100 seem to take a whole lot (as in almost full) elevator in the turns and it wanting to nose down slightly? I've got my CG right at 265mm. Thinking of moving it back just a bit.
jpbrimmer is offline Find More Posts by jpbrimmer
Reply With Quote
Old May 13, 2012, 10:41 AM
Registered User
4stripes's Avatar
Canada, ON, Burlington
Joined Jan 2009
2,930 Posts
280mm works well for mine with no unusual elevator forces needed.
Cheers
4stripes is offline Find More Posts by 4stripes
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Some photos of the EDF fleet!
Reply With Quote
Old May 13, 2012, 01:19 PM
Registered User
Southwestern VA
Joined Nov 2009
476 Posts
Thanks 4stripes! I'll give that a try. Didn't get to fly her today. One of my retracts keeps collapsing so I need to sort that out first.
jpbrimmer is offline Find More Posts by jpbrimmer
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Alert ···SCOOP···RBCkits F-100 Super Sabre···SCOOP··· Prop-er Electric Ducted Fan Jet Talk 71 Feb 16, 2009 02:57 PM
Build Log - contest - Micro EDF30 F100 Super Sabre metroidrc Scratchbuilt Indoor and Micro Models 119 Feb 19, 2008 05:50 PM
F-100 Super Sabre lebardemelon Pusher Prop Jet Models 5 Apr 20, 2005 08:34 AM
F-100 Super Sabre Tim H. Electric Ducted Fan Jet Talk 22 Apr 28, 2002 08:26 AM
F-100 Super Sabre Ed Couch Electric Ducted Fan Jet Talk 6 Dec 30, 2001 10:12 AM