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Old Sep 12, 2009, 10:01 AM
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Telemaster 40 and "what" four stroke to get back to RC flying again?

DEar Fellow RC-Groupers:

The PIPE Here...here I am, having been laid off (unemployed) for just about a solid YEAR now from my old AutoCAD drafting position (eight years of AutoCAD to September 2008, with three years of hand-drafting from '97 to 2000 at the same place), with six months still more to go, most likely, on my unemployment checks here in Mass., and yet I've still got the RC flyin' bug just gnawing at me just a small bit these days...

...I'll be re-upping with the AMA in about a month, and I am HOPING to be able to do either CAD drafting, or electronic assembly/production (my old career, which I did for some 20 years up to 1997) for some sort of work, and hope to be able get back with the Wingbusters club in Halifax, MA in 2010.

My "ancient" (built a good quarter-century ago) Balsa USA Swizzle Stick 40 is most likely going to have to be retired, as I'm going to need a really slow-flying plane that gets up off the ground QUICKLY, and from thirty years-plus of observation of other RCers and their aircraft choices, it seems like Hobby Lobby's Telemaster 40 MIGHT be a good choice for my limited budget, but I'd like SOME advice as to WHICH of my four-stroke engines, that I've already got, might be the best choice for powering the "Telly-40".

The trio of the available four strokers already in my hangar that I've got for potential use in the Telly 40 would be:

OS FS-40 "pre-Surpass" four stroke - used in the Swizzler, well-broken-in, idles like a Seiko watch, and can fly the 5-1/2 lb Swizzler at only 1/3rd to 1/2 throttle...

Saito FA-45 - VERY well run-in (it was my VERY first four stroke engine, in 1983), needs a crankcase replacement, as I had to butcher the rear half of its portside mounting lug for a custom installation in my 1/6th scale scratchbuilt Old Rhinebeck Fleet Finch scale bipe's nose, back in the early 1980s, and WOULD be available for use once the crankcase is replaced, perhaps by a place like New England's own BJ's Engine Service...

Saito FA-56 - has a good gallon of fuel run through it on my test stand, and it's the "intended" replacement engine for the FA-45 in the Fleet's nose, as the FA-45 just was NOT quite powerful enough for the 7 lb. Fleet !

I've also got a rare Enya 60-FS four stroker that's only got 70 minutes of running time on it, with no muffler, and it's in the nose of my 30% finished 1/6th scale Fokker D.VII scratchbuilt WW I bipe.

As a first "guess" of my own to start things off, I SUPPOSE I could use the Saito 56, as flying it in the Telly-40 WOULD give it a good amount of run time "in the air" to prepare it for the Fleet, when I'm ready to set it up for its somewhat "special" installation in the future, but where I DO need to retire the Swizzle Stick, with its OS FS-40 being available to use in another plane's nose, and get a Telemaster 40 for a new basic all-around SLOW flying RC aircraft, I'm mostly asking around to see what sort of four stroke engines have been used by other RCers to fly their Telemaster 40s, and just how SMALL a four stroke engine could be used to fly it decently, with a good quick takeoff and all-around satisfactory flight performance.

Hopefully, I'll be getting a licenseable copy of AutoCAD LT 2009 before too long to keep myself in practice here at home with something from Autodesk's family of CAD software, on my own PC for a potential future CAD drafting position, perhaps even doing freelancing with ACAD LT for others on my home PC. I've been using the popular-with-RCers DesignCAD series of software since late 1992 on my home PC, to keep my all-around CAD drafting skills ready for almost any work situation, and as the main environment to draft up my future series of 1/4th sized RC Giant Scale WW I aircraft, all for four stroke power.

But the main reason for this forum thread...what have other RCers flying Telemaster 40s with four stroke engines used for their aircraft's power, and among the engines I've stated as having, which would be a good choice (especially the CHEAPEST choice) to prepare for use in the Telly-40's nose, as I've got absolutely NO idea, of how LONG I'll be out of work???

Thanks in advance, and Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
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Old Sep 12, 2009, 10:38 AM
Deletedfor proving Nauga wrong
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Old Sep 12, 2009, 11:57 AM
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A lot of the Enya four strokes did not have mufflers. You may have to be more particular on locating the fuel tank so that it will draw fuel properly since it runs without a pressure line from the muffler to the tank. The Enya 60 or Saito 56 would be a good match for the Telly.
I have flown a telly some with a S-56 and it flew fine. I also have watched one fly with an Enya 53 4 stroke and it moved along pretty good too.
Fred
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Old Sep 13, 2009, 08:30 PM
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heres mine, but its powered by a bit more "reliable" power sourse

RC Seaplane Flight (1 min 53 sec)


i would think something in the 52 size would be just fine.
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Old Sep 13, 2009, 09:14 PM
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Electrics ARE rather "nice" for some aircraft I'm considering...

Dear Cessna54Tango:

The PIPE Here again...thanks very much for the great Telly-40 electroflight seaplane video...and please remember that I AM unemployed, for about a year now, and I've got to stick to using only a four-stroke engine that I've ALREADY got here at home !!!

I greatly prefer four-stroke power, as the lovely sound of a four stroker IS worth it for sport, and ESPECIALLY for WW I and Golden Age RC Scale/Giant aircraft !!!

Electrics ARE nice for certain aircraft types, though, and I've long been planning on changing my "to-be-restored" RC Assist Old-Timer Flying Aces Stick 1936 FF model (online article about it at http://www.arts.ualberta.ca/~idesign...3/fa-stick.pdf , an Adobe reader file, complete with 1936-vintage photos of the original model) over to electric power, as well as building a slightly later, a bit larger in size, and much higher performance capability, Flying Aces Rambler FF Old-Timer for RC, also to likely have electric power...

...and doing up one of Proctor's "larger-sized" Antic Bipes (as seen at http://www.proctor-enterprises.com/p...e/ant_bipe.htm ), as an electric-only model as well, is just TOO tempting to resist, for future building and enjoyment.

My choices there, for electric power, would mostly be determined as to the SAFETY of what I'd use for a lithium battery electroflight power source...

...and that has led me to basically consider using ONLY the A123 lithium battery technology as my sole source of lithium battery technology for "flight power" use on any electroflight aircraft I'd be flying myself.

But, that's all for the future only, so a four-stroke IS what I'd be flying that Telly-40 with, should I be able to get back to work sooner than I'm thinking might actually happen.

That electric 64 inch wingspan Proctor Antic Bipe that's in my future, though, what an aircraft to do a real DAWN patrol with...

Please, keep the replies coming...

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE...!!!
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Old Sep 14, 2009, 05:36 AM
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in that case the 56 will be just fine for the bird. youll have all kinds of power, and i agree all of the glow planes i used to have all had 4 strokes besides one. more torque and sound better
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Old Sep 23, 2009, 03:50 PM
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So far the Saito 56 seems to be "in the lead"...

Dear Cessna54Tango and Fellow Telly-40 Lovers...

The PIPE Here again...so far, no word on the "results" of my third interview that occurred two weeks ago (the lady I interviewed with WILL be getting a phone call and Email on Thursday afternoon this week)...for a chance at a three month temporary job doing electronic production...

...and in this thread it SEEMS that my Saito 56, sitting here in the basement with a Rev-Up 13x6 prop on it (with crankshaft bearings that seem positively "rocky" when I turn it over by hand with no glow plug in the head...might IT need new bearings from Boca Bearing in FL before I run IT again???) is the leader "so far" in deciding which of my three available engines might be best to use on a Telly-40's nose.

The OS FS-40 pre-Surpass "mill" on the Swizzler's nose COULD well be a bit weak on power for a plane that Hobby Lobby gives a 6 lb. weight when finished (the Swizzler is about 5-1/2 lb) and the Saito 45 COULD be enough power for the Telly-40, once it's fixed up a bit, but I WILL have to use an engine I've already "fully operational" for the Telly-40, should my employment picture not look good through most of next year.

Where the Telly-40 kit in new condition, from HL, costs $90.00 these days, I'll also be looking for a Telly-40 kit for sale instead from a private party before the end of this year, to TRY saving a little money...I STILL have to get my AMA dues, and a $50 deposit mailed out towards a second MS2K 50 MHz synthesized RF deck (at http://mstar2k.com/index.php?option=...2000&Itemid=11 ) to help complete my second GAA MicroStar knobby radio, at the very least, before I can even get the Telly-40.

I'd be naming the Telly 40 the Li'l Sammy, as I was going to name a planned Sr. Telemaster, for OS FS-90 REAR camshaft four stroke power the Thank You Sammy, and the whole idea of naming my Telemasters in varying versions of "Sammy" is because, my RC flight instructor from the late 1970s was named Sam Frey, from Cape Cod, MA (with his photo as an attachment to this posting) and HE was one of the best "knobby box pilots" (a fellow single stick Tx flier) I had ever seen...

...and a Sr. Telemaster he ALWAYS seemed that he had with him, with an Enya 90-FS four stroker on its nose, was so enjoyably flown by Sammy in some amazing low-altitude wingovers, inside loops that were done SO slowly that the "loops" were more like "somersaults", and other such very low altitude (mostly UNDER 50 ft up!) and VERY slow speed maneuvers.

So, either of two differently sized Telemasters (Telly-40 & Sr. Telly) of mine named "Sammy-something", will be my way of remembering my now 16-years-departed RC flying instructor, and even though I'm NOT the type of flier that could ever do the sorts of low-speed and VERY LOW altitude aerobatics that Sammy always did, it's one of the very BEST ways to remember the one person, unlike any other, who introduced me to the enjoyment of RC flying, done the SLOW way.

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
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Old Sep 23, 2009, 08:24 PM
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yep, id use the 56. as for the bearings, id run the darn thing into the ground. when it doesnt operate like it should and spits oil out all over the front of the crank then id replace the bearings. i have been flying a guys flair models fokker d7 twice a year, and thats all it flies. once for the annual trip to rhinebeck ny for the ww1 flyin and another time he brings it down the airport for our airport day. thats all it runs. been around since 95 with the same saito 80 in it. sits the rest of the year. im guessing his bearings arent the greatest but we run it and dont worry about it. every now and again it quits but what can you expect for about 10 flights a year! id run yours till it doesnt run anymore then either repair or replace it...... but thats just me
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Old Nov 16, 2009, 03:53 PM
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The "Li'l Sammy" Telemaster 40 kit got ordered today...

Dear Cessna54Tango and Fellow Telly-40 lovers:

The PIPE Here once again...and on the same day (Nov. 16th) as my 2010 AMA card arrived in the mail, my order out to Hobby Lobby Int'l for the Telemaster 40 kit went OUT to them by US Postal Service Priority Mail from a local post office.

I was planning on getting a metal motor mount for my Saito 56 that's "homeless" at present, and based on what I read on another forum's "Club Saito" thread about intake velocity stacks possible being a good way to "stretch" my fuel economy a small bit, I'll be ordering both the "dedicated" Saito-brand motor mount at http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=SAI5095 , AND the Saito-provided velocity stack at http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=SAI50GK93 , for the FA-56 that's eventually going in my Telly-40's nose.

Since I might want to give my Telly-40 a small bit of a "Helio Courier" full-scale aircraft look, I might also get a suitably sized opposed-engine style fiberglass cowl for it, as well as possibly an all-metal spinner (plastic spinners seem to be a "don't-do-it" with four strokers, and ALL my aircraft in the past used simple acorn nuts on the propshafts)...

...and cowling-in the engine a bit is not a problem, especially with Saito even having a right angle exhaust fitting of their own available at http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ickAccessories as well.

Where I've had great success with them many times previously, after first trying them in 1978 on my 1/6th scale Sig J-3 Cub from 1980 that's converted into an L-4 Grasshopper, that's only in need of a used Enya 46 four stroke engine and NEW, MUCH LIGHTER WING panels to get it going again, I'd be very likely to outfit my Telly-40 with Trexler inflatable 3-1/2 inch "airwheels" on the main gear, which the "AK Bushwheels" photo of a Helio Courier at http://store.akbushwheel.com/auto/zo...com&copied=YES equipped with the "full scale equivalent" of Trexlers...tundra tires...has been VERY inspirational in providing me with some ideas to give my Telly-40 JUST a few "full-scale" touches when it's being built into the summer of 2010.

(Please remember...MY flying season has to run from September through the wintertime, through to the following May, since a case of heatstroke nearly 30 years ago made July and August time, summer RC flying up here in New England a "don't-do-EVER-again" for yours truly!)

I'll also be designing and building an all-NEW, "flat" center section for the Telly-40, so that its wing's center section can sit fully FLAT atop the fuselage...the wing panels would each be joined onto the new center section, and as I've got some carbon fiber "wing blades" that could be epoxied edge-to-edge atop each other, a pair of carbon fiber dihedral braces, one each for the fore and aft spar sets is also a very likely upgrade for a strong center section.

Becuase I'm a strictly "old school" (1970s era) servo placement person, and I ALSO need to save MONEY when getting the Telly-40 airborne next autumn, I'd be using full-span ailerons, that would be also usable as FLAPerons at a later time, starting with only one Hitec HS-77 servo in the center section, using strip aileron linkages, for the aileron pair to use them as ailerons only for the present...when my money situation gets better, I can then get a pair of Hitec's HS-5245 mini digital servos to mount in the center with one operating each aileron separately through the same strip aileron linkups, and use my owner-built GAA MicroStar 2000 knobby radio's "canned" flaperon mix to get flaperons going on the Telly-40, once I can GET BACK TO WORK some time in the future.

Hopefully, that kit can get here before much of the holiday shopping rush gets going...I STILL have to get a roll of CORK ordered from my local Lowe's store to "upholster" a disused bathroom door here at home, to turn IT into a building board for my needs, which is something that I haven't had for two decades...

...AND that my unemployment checks can keep coming, for signup with my local RC club ($72/year) in January...!!!

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
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Old Nov 20, 2009, 06:50 AM
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Pipe, I traded a 25 size Cub and some cash for an old Hangar 9 Cub with a Saito 56. The deal was incredible as they thought the bearings in the engine were bad. I put some Marvel air tool oil in the crankcase after removing the breather nipple, removed the rocker covers to lube the rockers and shot some down the push rod tubes and some in the cylinder through the glow plug hole. After slowly spinning the engine over with the glow plug out it really freed up. I put some fuel to it and it runs beautifully so far. Try the Marvel air tool oil and see if it smooths out.
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Old Nov 20, 2009, 09:26 AM
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That's almost EXACTLY what I did with my Saito 56 quite recently...

Dear Gluemaster:

The PIPE Here once again...

...and your suggestion is almost EXACTLY what I did, not very long ago with my Saito 56, but I ALSO used a bit of naphtha-style lighter fluid along with the Marvel air tool oil, as I've used that exact oil previously as a "standardized" after-run oil for my four stroke engines in the past, as well as using the lighter fluid for priming my engines on colder days (remember, I DO NOT fly in the worst of summer heat and humidity-EVER )...

...and that combination of the Marvel Air Tool Oil and Ronsonol lighter fluid got the "rocky" feeling COMPLETELY OUT of my Saito 56's "front end" bearings, and re-established a nice, SMOOTH feeling when I turned it over both by hand, AND with my still-QUITE-strong 1976 vintage Sullivan 12 volt electric starter.

I SHOULD have mentioned it a bit earlier, I suppose, but with family health issues (with my now-78 year-old stepfather) since the first day of autumn this year, which only recently resolved themselves (he's home from the hospital now) I had forgotten to mention that I had given the air tool oil + lighter fluid "combo" a try at smoothing out the Saito's crankshaft bearings.

My Saito 56 had ALSO experienced some "screaming" bearings while I was initially breaking it in back in 2005, but just as soon as I opened up the valve covers and DROWNED the entire camshaft drive of the Saito with two good "slugs" of Marvel Air Tool Oil, one down each pushrod tube, and bolted the covers back in place, the "screaming" from the crankshaft bearings promptly ended, and has not resurfaced since.

Thanks for the tip, though...it's something I've recommended myself to new four stroke enthusiasts many times in the past !

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
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Old Nov 20, 2009, 03:06 PM
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Real sorry about your current misfortune...hope it turns around for you real soon.

If you're not totally committed to the Tele, how about the LT-40? The reason I suggest is that it is a little lighter and would certainly fly on the OS 40 FS that is already running well. Might be your best bet for now. They are really nice flying planes. The Clark Y airfoil is just a bit better than the absolute flat bottom you find in many others. It even goes inverted pretty well. Several of these at our field are just very impressive both as trainers and even for experienced pilots to fool around with. Don't underestimate them. Just a thought. Good luck. Jim
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Old Nov 23, 2009, 05:13 PM
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Where I STILL miss Sammy so much, it HAD to be the Telly-40!

Dear Buzzard Bait:

The PIPE Here again...just posted on a thread here at RCGroups about how MUCH I looove flyin' with SKIS in the winter...

...and I'd have to say that it's my emotional link to my departed (late 1920s to 1996) RC flight instructor, Sam Frey, that made the Telemaster 40 choice all the MORE appropriate.

To REALLY honor Sammy, I'd HAVE to build a Senior Telemaster (his favorite sport RC design), but where my 15 year old small Ford station wagon is reaching the end of its service life, with me having to very likely sell IT for parts by early this summer, I'll NEED to use my mother's 2003 Mercury Gran Marquis to get around in...both she AND my stepfather, being 70-somethings, have decided to give up driving themselves, so we're about to become a ONE-car family in the coming months...

...and where there just is NOT quite enough room in my mother's four-door car for a stock-built, EIGHT-foot wingspan Senior Telemaster in there, in order to get it to the field, the choice of the "slightly" smaller, six-foot-wingspan Telemaster 40 being a bit easier to get in there, AND a bit easier to afford on a limited budget, is a better one for the present.

You ARE right about the Sig Kadet LT-40 being a good plane for my OS FS-40 engine, but it was Sammy's simply ASTOUNDING slow speed, low altitude (UNDER 50 ft) aerobatic flights with HIS big Senior Telemaster that captivated me sooo long ago in the late 1970s, which he flew with "knobby" radios of HIS own (he NEVER flew "dual stick" radios for his own needs, ever!), and pretty much "nailed" the fact that I'd HAVE to get at least ONE Telemaster-family design RC aircraft for my very own enjoyment someday.

I still intend to get a Sr. Telemaster "in time", though, as I've got a 1983-vintage OS FS-90 REAR camshaft four stroker to power mine with, but for the present, and ESPECIALLY later in 2010, a brand-new Telly-40 will bring back those days in the late 1970s when Sammy WAS still around, while he taught me the basics of RC "knobby box" flying, and we enjoyed flying together for a number of years after that.

That Sig trainer IS a good one, though...

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
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Old Nov 23, 2009, 08:08 PM
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Best of luck to you; sounds like Sammy had a good friend.
Jim
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Old Nov 25, 2009, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The PIPE View Post
DEar Fellow RC-Groupers:

The PIPE Here...here I am, having been laid off (unemployed) for just about a solid YEAR now from my old AutoCAD drafting position (eight years of AutoCAD to September 2008, with three years of hand-drafting from '97 to 2000 at the same place), with six months still more to go, most likely, on my unemployment checks here in Mass., and yet I've still got the RC flyin' bug just gnawing at me just a small bit these days...

...I'll be re-upping with the AMA in about a month, and I am HOPING to be able to do either CAD drafting, or electronic assembly/production (my old career, which I did for some 20 years up to 1997) for some sort of work, and hope to be able get back with the Wingbusters club in Halifax, MA in 2010.

My "ancient" (built a good quarter-century ago) Balsa USA Swizzle Stick 40 is most likely going to have to be retired, as I'm going to need a really slow-flying plane that gets up off the ground QUICKLY, and from thirty years-plus of observation of other RCers and their aircraft choices, it seems like Hobby Lobby's Telemaster 40 MIGHT be a good choice for my limited budget, but I'd like SOME advice as to WHICH of my four-stroke engines, that I've already got, might be the best choice for powering the "Telly-40".

The trio of the available four strokers already in my hangar that I've got for potential use in the Telly 40 would be:

OS FS-40 "pre-Surpass" four stroke - used in the Swizzler, well-broken-in, idles like a Seiko watch, and can fly the 5-1/2 lb Swizzler at only 1/3rd to 1/2 throttle...

Saito FA-45 - VERY well run-in (it was my VERY first four stroke engine, in 1983), needs a crankcase replacement, as I had to butcher the rear half of its portside mounting lug for a custom installation in my 1/6th scale scratchbuilt Old Rhinebeck Fleet Finch scale bipe's nose, back in the early 1980s, and WOULD be available for use once the crankcase is replaced, perhaps by a place like New England's own BJ's Engine Service...

Saito FA-56 - has a good gallon of fuel run through it on my test stand, and it's the "intended" replacement engine for the FA-45 in the Fleet's nose, as the FA-45 just was NOT quite powerful enough for the 7 lb. Fleet !

I've also got a rare Enya 60-FS four stroker that's only got 70 minutes of running time on it, with no muffler, and it's in the nose of my 30% finished 1/6th scale Fokker D.VII scratchbuilt WW I bipe.

As a first "guess" of my own to start things off, I SUPPOSE I could use the Saito 56, as flying it in the Telly-40 WOULD give it a good amount of run time "in the air" to prepare it for the Fleet, when I'm ready to set it up for its somewhat "special" installation in the future, but where I DO need to retire the Swizzle Stick, with its OS FS-40 being available to use in another plane's nose, and get a Telemaster 40 for a new basic all-around SLOW flying RC aircraft, I'm mostly asking around to see what sort of four stroke engines have been used by other RCers to fly their Telemaster 40s, and just how SMALL a four stroke engine could be used to fly it decently, with a good quick takeoff and all-around satisfactory flight performance.

Hopefully, I'll be getting a licenseable copy of AutoCAD LT 2009 before too long to keep myself in practice here at home with something from Autodesk's family of CAD software, on my own PC for a potential future CAD drafting position, perhaps even doing freelancing with ACAD LT for others on my home PC. I've been using the popular-with-RCers DesignCAD series of software since late 1992 on my home PC, to keep my all-around CAD drafting skills ready for almost any work situation, and as the main environment to draft up my future series of 1/4th sized RC Giant Scale WW I aircraft, all for four stroke power.

But the main reason for this forum thread...what have other RCers flying Telemaster 40s with four stroke engines used for their aircraft's power, and among the engines I've stated as having, which would be a good choice (especially the CHEAPEST choice) to prepare for use in the Telly-40's nose, as I've got absolutely NO idea, of how LONG I'll be out of work???

Thanks in advance, and Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!
Hey Pipe, glad to see you back on the forum. I would use the Enya 60 FS
if it were me. I have always used OS70 or Saito 72 on the 40 size Telemaster with outstanding results. Your Enya will do just as good a job.
I just put one of the new Saito FG-20 gas engines on a Senior Telemaster and have yet to maiden it.

Best regards

sarg96 (KE4NL)
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