Ouups ... that is another kind... I thought about two cards between filed with some foam!

RogueTitan, In the general comunity I'm dealin with it is stil quit a debate on how mutch feul one can buywith for a glow plane with the price diff between the two, eg. A kit lets say 40 size is about 1500 ZAR, a motor another 800 ZAR, electric for the same size n the same kit your looking at a motor 1200 ZAR and speed controll, 1000ZAR plus bat 1500 ZAR. and the feul is 150ZAR for 5 l of feul

I've been reading through the thread, and here's my two cents.

I'm a builder, I am I think the only younger builder (28 years old) in my club. The others are older gentlemen. Now when I think about it, I have been building stuff my whole life. I started out doing lots of plastic models and even occasionally now feel the urge to go and buy one. I moved on to playing warhammer (the tabletop wargame) where the main attaction was making battlefields and painting the models. Then I have built a few wooden ships. In my professional life, I build software and used to do it a lot in my spare time. Now I build airplanes.

I have a feeling that those who build stuff are the builder types. You can't convert someone who isn't a builder to becoming one and you shouldn't aim to either. What you really want to do is to get the builder types interested into RC aircraft, and to get those who are thinking about building less intimidated by it. A workshop like suggested is perhaps a good idea

Agreed! But as you are a hidden builder as you were always able to buy what you want never had to try yourself....????? There are kids totally dumb on TV
which just know how to pay with daddies Gold Card. They never had ( the chance) to try something but consum... Poor ones, but they are lucky as they don't know better!
About myself :I have to do everything of interest for myself even if it is higher in cost than when bought!

I 'd like to try anything .. just to find out if it suites me .. did electroics .. uC programming . Mechanics, CNC, Rc and plastic modelling, cad, SFX, SQL; Programming, etc....
just for fun ... in several areas I have at laest some knowledge. It still takes more time than a professional would do it, but I'm able to produce results satisfying me!!

Satisfaction .. is created by results which fulfill the previously made expectations or are better ... some people - once forced to that point of satisfaction - get addicted to this feeling... it is not important to be satisfied by a smooth and perfect result or a less optimum result as long as someone recognizes that he still hasn't reached the limits of his skills and mind in one area of interest -> he will proceed finding this limits..... what means practize what leads to better results until the limit is reached.....

Just my opinion.....

Hansjoerg

Kids certainly are the future of R/C. However, I see people in their 30-40-50 who have no interest in the building hobby. These are people who have ARFs or buy their planes already built. These are people closer to my age, that I can relate to. I'm more interested in getting these people to build, they have kids and maybe the kids will have the building bug rub off on them. The kids glued to the TV or video games probably wouldn't be interested in any aspect of R/C, so I feel I have little I can do for them!

This reminds me of a time in college when I was walking through the plastic model airplane section of Wal-Mart. When I was growing up in a small town, that was the place I begged my dad to take me to get models, and they always had at least a full aisle full of models. So, there I am, a college student looking at plastic models for the first time in about 10 years and all I see are snap together models. I remember telling the friend with me that this foretold the eventual decline of civilization. That was 1986. Friends, I have no doubt in my mind that my prophecy is coming true and that we can track the lack of kit building directly back to those blasted snap together models.

Much in our society has changed. Some of it is good. Some of it is bad.

I've been reading this thread with interest, and more than a little amusement. I like to think of myself as a pretty fair builder, or at least a well-qualified hack. I work at the back parts counter of a Ford delaer, and I'm there from around 730 am till 6, plus I have a lovely daughter and a loving wife that I like to spend time with. I fly RC combat and Old-Timers, and in both cases I have to build my planes..there's not much in the way of ARFS for either class of aircraft. I usually have a night or two from about 830-1030 to build, and if I'm REALLY into the build, or in the case of the combat birds, pressed for time, I'll get up around 530 am on a saturday morning and have about 3 hrs of good building time before the rest of the family is up. My point is, if ya really want to build, you'll find the time, even if it's just gluing a few parts together twice a week for 30 minutes at a time. If one would rather fly arfs, and spend his/her hobby time doing more flying than building, then I say go for it!! I haven't had many ARFS, but I have had a few, and one or two stick out in my mind as really nice flhying ships. What I really miss, is a good ARC (almost ready to cover) kit. I had a real nice Zlin that started life as an ARC, flew it with an OS .61FS, traded it at a swap meet and have regretted it since..
Anyway, different strokes and all, we are all modellers, ya'll
Cash

Greeting all.
Found this thread as I was posting a new thread about my new scratch build and I just could not resist posting after reading this.
First of all, i guess it is obvious that, yes, I am a scratch builder, and I love this part of the hobby. Sometimes more than actually flying my creations. Why? I just do. Its relaxing, its a decompression time, its my creativity, its my passion.

Maybe I should give my background and reasoning at this point. First of all I am an aircraft mechanic, so working with my hands and problem solving are a daily routine. My dad, was and still is, an avid woodworker. I guess that is were I get it. Always spending time with him in the garage building or around the house fixing something when I was growing up wan more important than some dumb video game. To this day, I thank him for this skill that was past down to me. When the water heater blew at 1 o'clock on a Sunday morning, I had a new one plumbed in and was taking a hot shower by noon without having to call a plumber, a feat that my roommate, who is a car mechanic, was awestruck by... go figure.

So, you ask what can be come of someone that "builds" and not just bolts together an ARF? How about the patients and the persistence to see it through to the end and make sure it gets done right, the mental challenge and the problem solving skills that can carry over to every day life at work, learning to take pride in your work and have the confidence and the tenacity to try something new or to take on a challenge.

To me designing/building/testing is the best part of this hobby. Do I laugh at people that only fly ARFs, yeah, but only to myself, or a couple of close friends that really know me.

This past weekend as I took my latest creation to the hobby store to show it off to those who have helped with it. A couple other customers asked the standard questions. What kit is that? Where did you get the plans? Where did you get the design from? The look on their faces when I say its my design that I scratch built over the last six weeks is just priceless, and to me is the icing on the cake.

Then at the field, as I make my usual off color comment that friends don't let friends buy ARFs, a fellow flier asked why I dont like ARFs.
Well, quite simply, to me they are boring. I dont like to have the same exact plane as 10 other people at the field, with the same graphics and the same flying qualities. Building gives the builder the opportunity to build exactly what interest him or her. To be different, to expand on the possibilities, and maybe to inspire another hobbyist to try something new, maybe even a kit instead of a new ARF the next time they are at the LHS.

Sure, I wish there were as many kits out there as there are foamies and ARFs, but it just ain't gonna happen anymore. I enjoy being one of a select few at my field that are scratch builders. I enjoy testing out my latest idea and just hoping that it can sustain a controlled flight.

Do I like ARFs? No.
Do I think that they are a bad idea? No.
For the newcomer, there is nothing better. Let them get the bait and get hooked into the hobby, learn to fly, then progress to the kit or scratch build.

I may not be able to perform an inverted harrier, a rolling circle, or even knife edge, and yeah, the guys I fly with love to poke fun at me when one of my creations does not make it back to the runway on the maiden, but what fun would it be if every thing worked every time. But they dont design and build. To each their own.

I love to build, probably always will. I know that not everyone likes to build, and so be it. I would love to have someone ask me how they could learn to scratch build, and show them how to get started.

Sorry to go off on rank, but it was just my $0.02.






If I offended you, then too bad. Its just my opinion, just like you have yours.

Simple answer..

All of you got your your closets and send me any kits you have stashed away and I will build them!

We have a lot of builders in my club, I have three 1/4 scale gliders going at this point. I agree with a lot of the posts, we need to get kids involved and teach them the joy (and agony) of kit or scratch building. The art of quality craftsman ship is slowing dying..

Just my .02...

just joined in.
i have not actually built a plane from scratch yet. but i do not like arfs. most of my planes are kit built, just not by me.
after many repairs and modifications on my planes i feel confident enough to build my first kit. i'm 35 years old and feel it's time to dive in.
at first i thought building was just too time consuming but as of lately i am really getting into it.
i agree with all of you that this is really where the hobby originates from. back in the old days you could not fly anything unless you built it first.
so i bought a whytes wings piper pawnee kit which i will be building as my first build. i was thinking of starting a build thread on it to get some guidance as i move it along. would anyone want to see that?
i'm also going to scratch build (from plans) a clipped wing for my lanier 1/4 taylorcraft. the long wing is good but i want to spice it up a bit.
so as you can see, i am moving in the right direction (at least i feel) in the hobby and i can't wait to feel the sense of pride of doing my maiden on that pawnee.
this site has been an inspiration to me and i want to thank you all!

Originally Posted by EINA

RogueTitan, In the general comunity I'm dealin with it is stil quit a debate on how mutch feul one can buywith for a glow plane with the price diff between the two, eg. A kit lets say 40 size is about 1500 ZAR, a motor another 800 ZAR, electric for the same size n the same kit your looking at a motor 1200 ZAR and speed controll, 1000ZAR plus bat 1500 ZAR. and the feul is 150ZAR for 5 l of feul

In which case you have a business opportunity: buy a shedload of stuff from united hobbies, and onsell it.

Not sure what the import duties are, but when I had the problem some years back in Joburg, it was decided that 'toy spare parts' attracted the lowest tarriff - I think it was electronic components..

Als long as they don't wirte "GIFT " on a 2000 $ parcel

Originally Posted by Harpye

Als long as they don't wirte "GIFT " on a 2000 $ parcel

SSSHH. How did you know about that, the time my bosses brother in Germany stuffed a teddy bear with 3000 transistors..

So that teddy was some more powerful than the first CGA graphics unit by IBM!!!

Originally Posted by drola

i was thinking of starting a build thread on it to get some guidance as i move it along. would anyone want to see that?

Absolutely!

EJWash