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Old Sep 02, 2009, 10:47 PM
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greg
hit me up if you want some maiden help...ive had 4 wingerons before and may be able to have some good input....
.

this thread is about greg and his wingeron questions.....not my way is...
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 11:10 PM
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United States, CA, Simi Valley
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LOL If I had any wingeron experience, It would be more of, "my way is..." But this is all new to me. Quite a bit different from combat wings. Hahahaha Yea, I'd like all the help I can get, so it's ready for the classic, and not smashed all over the base of Temple Hill. I'm not sure if my daughters are going to practice tomorrow, but if they don't, I'll be at Temple Hill around 4:45. I'll pm you when I find out.

Thanks,

Dave
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gavoss
We (the competitive RC sailplane bunch) have had problems with 2.4 in our carbon infested fuselages. What we've ended up doing while waiting for the manufacturers to catch up is to make whiskers. You see, the carbon in the fuse is blocking the signal, so we make a longer antenna from each antenna on the main RX and satillite RX and put them 90 degrees around the fuse. One out the top and bottom and one out each side. You only need to have 31-32mm sticking out of the fuse. The carbon blocks out the rest of the signal. Now, if your fuse isn't completely carbon, you will probably get it to work w/o making whiskers or even have to have the existing antennae exit the fuse.

JR has already come out with a 2.4 RX that has a long antenna on it and the aircraft manufacturers are now leaving the carbon out of the fuses from the back of the canopy forward so we can use 2.4gHz RX's without having holes and wires sticking out of our expensive models. Some of us are going so far as to go back to 72mhz in our competiton planes. We are actually doubling the length of the standard antenna and leave the extra hang out in the breeze. The antenna is routed up the fin and the extra roughly 12" (depends on the length fuse you have of course) hanging out. It looks stupid, but so does crashing a $2000 model. George
Hey George,

I may just set it up with my XP7202. It's no $2000 dollar plane, but I did put a fair bit of work into it, and would rather not see it smashed at the bottom of the slope because I lost signal. Another reason I'll set it up with my 7202 is, I've only got a AR6110E receiver, not satellite. Thanks for the info.
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Old Sep 03, 2009, 12:35 AM
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LM sunday? i'll be there
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Old Sep 10, 2009, 12:06 PM
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Nice!!! I'll bring the Phoenix. The lift better be good though. After bagging the wings and adjusting the CG, she came out to 40oz. More of a Fermin ship don't you think? I tried to maiden her at Temple, but the wind was only about 12-18mph. So I didn't toss her off the hill.
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Old Sep 10, 2009, 01:02 PM
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Here is a real instance of one incident with 2.4. The modeler flies more than anyone I know. He probably flies close to 200 days a year in every coastal state and around the globe. Basically if there is a beach area, he's there selling his product tha cleans the beach of unwanted junk in the sand, leaving it clean for the public.

He was recently in Turkey flying a $2000 model on the slope. The plane was right in front of him, no more than 50' away and went into full "hold" which was setup as full flaps and a little down elevator so the plane would land itself. If he was thermal flying, it would have done just that, land itself. Unfortunately that setting is murder on the slope and the plane ballooned up and behind him, cart-wheeling its way to distruction.

He has a Data Logger on board and it showed one hold. The one that crashed the plane. Like he said to me, he can't afford to fly 2.4 and I'd have to agree with him to a point.

I use 2.4 in planes that don't have carbon in them or very little carbon in them. The manufacturers will get it figured out, on both the radio side and the construction side.

I hope the Phoenix maiden works out well for you! George
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Old Sep 11, 2009, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gavoss
Here is a real instance of one incident with 2.4. The modeler flies more than anyone I know. He probably flies close to 200 days a year in every coastal state and around the globe. Basically if there is a beach area, he's there selling his product tha cleans the beach of unwanted junk in the sand, leaving it clean for the public.

He was recently in Turkey flying a $2000 model on the slope. The plane was right in front of him, no more than 50' away and went into full "hold" which was setup as full flaps and a little down elevator so the plane would land itself. If he was thermal flying, it would have done just that, land itself. Unfortunately that setting is murder on the slope and the plane ballooned up and behind him, cart-wheeling its way to distruction.

He has a Data Logger on board and it showed one hold. The one that crashed the plane. Like he said to me, he can't afford to fly 2.4 and I'd have to agree with him to a point.

I use 2.4 in planes that don't have carbon in them or very little carbon in them. The manufacturers will get it figured out, on both the radio side and the construction side.

I hope the Phoenix maiden works out well for you! George
I have a AR6110e loaded in the tail away from the carbon, but I am going to replace it tonight before I take it out again. Thanks for the story. What condition causes a hold? Was it a drop out of the signal due to the carbon? The problem with the 2.4 as I understand it, is the reconnection time once you have a drop out. By the time the radio reconnects, your plane has become a lawn dart. No thank you. I have an extra 72MHz receiver, just didn't want to have the antenna whipping around behind the plane. But that's better then having my plane destroyed.
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Old Sep 11, 2009, 05:40 PM
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I'm not an electronics person, I'm a mechanical one, so I can't say what causes a hold. From what I've heard, you are correct stating that the time to reconnect is the issue.

In your case of hanging it out the tail you probably would have been fine. It seems the problem is mostly with full carbon or full carbon/Kevlar fuses where the signal is blocked. Having a reinforcing strip on the side isn't the same thing and like I mentioned earlier, you probably could get away without whiskers.

As far as having the antenna whipping around outside, since it's a slope plane it won't be very far away from you any time during flight. You coulld wrap most of the antenna length around a straw and let 6" or so hang out the tail and be fine. Never cut the antenna wire as that really screws things up. However, it's OK to double it. You actually can cut it if you know what dimension to cut it to.

From what I understand, we use what's called a 1/4 wave antenna, meaning the length of our antenna is 1/4 of the optimum. By doubling the antenna length we change to a 1/2 wave etc. For 72mhz, it comes out to almost exactly 1M or roughly 40". So a 160" would get the best reception. Needless to say, we don't fly 160" airplanes that often.

While I'm thinking about it, you also don't want to double the antenna back on itself either. That's just like shortening it. On a 60" foamy, I made a bunch of "S" curves in the foam fuselage so no antenna sticks out. The antenn runs the full length of the fuse though.

Let us know how the plnae flies and how the radio deal works out. I'd try it both ways, 72 and 2.4 and see if there is a difference. I doubt you'll have an issue with 2.4. George
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