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Old Jul 26, 2010, 12:03 PM
What could possibly go wrong!!
In Bedfordshire, UK.
Joined Oct 2008
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Good video John but nowhere near as exciting as Winterton, not even a wing flutter!!!

Chas
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Old Jul 29, 2010, 08:39 AM
It was a GLITCH! Honestly!
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Stourport on Severn ,Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Joined Dec 2007
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Heres a video of Chas battling the wind at Winterton...a brave man


RPG at Winterton...very windy!! (2 min 6 sec)
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Old Jul 29, 2010, 11:43 AM
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The Cotswolds
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Great piloting, but appalling airmanship. Flying while standing on the runway, taking off towards the pits, overflying the pits. He wouldn't have been allowed to fly like that at any club where I was safety officer.
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Old Jul 29, 2010, 03:47 PM
It was a GLITCH! Honestly!
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Stourport on Severn ,Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Joined Dec 2007
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Fair comment Russel,

This video was taken on the Sunday when the weather conditions had worsened, the wind was strong and had swung around 90 degrees to the West to East runway. It was decided at the beginning of the day to take off from this position as it was the safest place for pilots and spectators (who were about 15 metres back from the 'normal condition' pits). This area was at the back of the runway at least 20 metres from the 'standard pits' maybe further. Because of these conditions only one model was flown at any given time.
If the normal pits would have been used that would have meant the pilot taking off directly towards themselves possibly putting themselves at risk.
You have to take into account the weather conditions on any particular flying day, sometimes at our field we can move the pits 2 or 3 times in one session. To have a fixed pits and for someone to state (by the rule book)that these must be used under adverse conditions is a disgrace and a danger to themselves and others.
I think most of us had travelled quite a way so we all wanted to fly at some point.
I'm sure that everyone who attended would agree that it was well organised, fun and safe fly-in. I'm also sure you would agree if you had of have attended.
Saying that I do agree with not flying over the temporary pits or over head (the pilot)but we all do that from time to time, but we all break the speed limit too.

Sorry you looked at a very good flight in such a negative way.


Regards Rich
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Old Jul 30, 2010, 06:24 AM
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The Cotswolds
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On 35Mhz systems (as well as 72, 50, 40 etc) all transmitters will emit a little interference on the entire range of channels that we use for model flying purposes. Also, the signal strength of a transmitter falls rapidly with distance. The interference check that the BMFA recommends is adequate for the situation where the transmitters will all be grouped together because as the model is flown away from the controlling transmitter and the signal strength drops, the signal strength from any intereference from the other transmitters will also drop. However, when a model is flown significantly closer to another transmitter than the one that is controlling it, the interference on that transmitter can be significantly stronger, resulting in loss of control of the model.

I used to belong to a model club where they routinely flew facing the pits with the airspace above the pits itself designated as a no fly area. Having witnessed several crashes in, near and beyond the pits due to interference from transmitters in the pits (on different channels, I should add). Including a plane crashing into the very chair I was sitting in (I rolled to the right to avoid it and, the plane crashed into the base of the chair). I can attest to just how dangerous this is.

Even the situation you see at many american model clubs, with well spaced designated pilots boxes arranged along the side of the runway can cause problems when someone lands or takes off while standing in the box furthest from the begining of the runway when someone else is occupying the one closest to the beginning.
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Old Jul 30, 2010, 07:59 AM
It was a GLITCH! Honestly!
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Stourport on Severn ,Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Joined Dec 2007
4,904 Posts
Russel,
Yes I am aware of the complications regarding 35 mhz, I think these problems have happened at most flying clubs. Its just a good job you weren't hurt from the incident you mentioned.
At Winterton..like any other flying club there was peg board in operation. But apart from maybe 3 people flying on 35 mhz (over the weekend and one at a time) most were on 2.4 mhz so this interference problem with different strength signals is totally eliminated.
This flying club also hosts LMA events so I think they know in ins and outs of safety.

Sorry for the off topic guys, maybe we can get back on track to what its all about...having fun (safely of course)



Regards Rich
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Old Aug 01, 2010, 04:47 PM
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Hi Guys, just back from my holidays and just checking through to see whatís been happening whilst I was away.

Iím a little upset that Russel should make a comment about the airmanship at our field
Iím sorry Russel but I donít remember being introduced to you when you attended the Gyro Meet, did you attend both days or just on the Sunday?

One thing I will emphasise to those unfamiliar with our field is that the runway is very wide and the prospective from the video Rich had taken whilst I was stood with him may make it look as though Chase was very close to the pits when in fact he was stood pretty close to the opposite side of the runway and at no point during his take off run or flight did he encroach the pit area.
Winterton Model Club prides itself in the fact that we are a club for modellers to have fun and enjoy our hobby and most importantly fly safely.

Below is a picture of the site, the crop behind Chase is growing in the area you can see ploughed

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Cali
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Old Aug 02, 2010, 07:40 AM
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The Cotswolds
Joined Jul 2007
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Hi Cali,

I see from the photo you provided that your Pits is in fact adjacent to the edge of the runway. So standing the other side of a "very wide runway" and flying towards the pits means you could end up with a model that is several times closer to another transmitter than the one that is controlling it. My experience is that it only needs to be 4 or 5 times closer and you can have a loss of control accident due to interference.

I'm sorry to have put a damper on your weekend. But I make no apologies for pointing out dangerous practices when I see them. I would hope that rather than just become upset, you would give some serious consideration to what I have said.

If flying towards the Pits is currently allowed at your club. Then get that rule changed. Discuss it with your club committee, point out to them how the layout and operation of your club is contrary to the BMFA guidelines. Consider what impact this may have on any possible insurance claim you may try to make (I am assuming yours is a BMFA registered club and that you all carry the BMFA third party liability insurance that comes with BMFA membership). Put some substance behind that Pride in Safety.

If flying towards the Pits is not allowed at your club, then don't be upset at me, I'm not the one that broke the rules and put my fellow modellers at risk.

To answer your question, I didn't attend either day.


Regards,

Russell
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Old Aug 02, 2010, 12:30 PM
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DeRidder LA.
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Russell,

You've made a valid point that has been heard. Anything more on the same topic is just redundant bable that tends to upset the reader. Most folks are resistant to the steamrolling method of sharing safety information. I was a little surprised to see that RCgroups doesn't have a dedicated "Safety" section(Unless I've missed it that is).

The rest of you that "attended" the event,
Please keep posting the pics and videos! I hope the thread can get back on topic now.

Best Regards,
-Mike
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Old Aug 03, 2010, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussellA View Post
Hi Cali,

I see from the photo you provided that your Pits is in fact adjacent to the edge of the runway. So standing the other side of a "very wide runway" and flying towards the pits means you could end up with a model that is several times closer to another transmitter than the one that is controlling it. My experience is that it only needs to be 4 or 5 times closer and you can have a loss of control accident due to interference.

I'm sorry to have put a damper on your weekend. But I make no apologies for pointing out dangerous practices when I see them. I would hope that rather than just become upset, you would give some serious consideration to what I have said.

If flying towards the Pits is currently allowed at your club. Then get that rule changed. Discuss it with your club committee, point out to them how the layout and operation of your club is contrary to the BMFA guidelines. Consider what impact this may have on any possible insurance claim you may try to make (I am assuming yours is a BMFA registered club and that you all carry the BMFA third party liability insurance that comes with BMFA membership). Put some substance behind that Pride in Safety.

If flying towards the Pits is not allowed at your club, then don't be upset at me, I'm not the one that broke the rules and put my fellow modellers at risk.

To answer your question, I didn't attend either day.


Regards,

Russell
The pictuire showing the pits adjacent to the flightline wasn't taken on the same day, but is the usual layout which is perfectly safe. Your comments about overflying active radios is not valid as they had agreed only one was flying at once so there will have been no active 35MHz sets with the aerial up. I have attended many very well run events at Winterton, the safety is always excellent. It is very easy to make comments about safety but perhaps not a good idea unless you are armed with all the relevent information.

You have picked up on a very important word but I suspect not grasped the meaning of it, "GUIDELINES" they are not hard and fast rules and are regularly adapted by clubs to suite their local conditions, there are very few (if any) clubs that operate exactly to the guidelines. It does not make them unsafe
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Old Aug 03, 2010, 02:39 PM
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South Africa, GP, Nigel
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Hi Chas

That was some good flying, you saved that gyro to fly another day.

Regards
Martin
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Old Aug 03, 2010, 02:44 PM
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Homer Glen, Illinois, United States
Joined Sep 2001
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I think that this has been enough B.S. about safety at a flying field. I hope we can get back on subject about autogyros. I'm tired of listening to all this belly aching. Enough is enough!!!!!!!! Put an end to it. It's over and done with.
Pete
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Old Aug 09, 2010, 06:22 PM
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Joined Apr 2009
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Hi Guys!

Below is an e-mail received from one of the visitors to the Gyro Meet

First of all, I hope that I have found the correct e-mail & your correct name. I
visited your super Autogyro event on the Saturday which at the time
unfortunately suffered weather that would was not too kind to flying models.
However, you all seemed to make the most of it and had a go as soon as possible.
Congratulations on such a good turn-out considering and many thanks for your
most hospitable welcome. Cups of tea much appreciated. I managed to confirm my
build plans with Rich and found inspiration from others to try alternative
gyro's.

I thought our 2 1/2 hour journey was tiring but then quite a few of your
visiting members had travelled some distance for a good annual meeting. I am
just putting the finishing touches to my DAG2 and hope to test fly in the week
if weather remains calmish! I have enclosed a picture of progress to-date. Just
requires fuel proofing and fitting OS48 four stroke and of course the rotors
need finishing. Also I have enclosed a copy of the KLAMC monthly magazine hot
off the press. You are most welcome to Roydon Flying Field for the Open on
August 1st 2010 or for the Late Summer Fly-In 26th September - Just drop me an
e-mail.

Hope to see you next year with a autogyro model to fly! If you want to use any
photos, fell free.

Best regards,

Gerry Betts - King's Lynn Aero Modelling Club



Cali
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Old Aug 09, 2010, 06:36 PM
It was a GLITCH! Honestly!
SafeLandings's Avatar
Stourport on Severn ,Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Joined Dec 2007
4,904 Posts
Cali,
Makes it all worth while with an email like that!...you did really well mate
How about buttering him up about that event in September? maybe a few of us could go if its alright with Gerry?



Rich
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Old Aug 11, 2010, 06:23 AM
autogyro andy
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South UK
Joined Feb 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cali View Post
Hi Guys!

Below is an e-mail received from one of the visitors to the Gyro Meet

First of all, I hope that I have found the correct e-mail & your correct name. I
visited your super Autogyro event on the Saturday which at the time
unfortunately suffered weather that would was not too kind to flying models.
However, you all seemed to make the most of it and had a go as soon as possible.
Congratulations on such a good turn-out considering and many thanks for your
most hospitable welcome. Cups of tea much appreciated. I managed to confirm my
build plans with Rich and found inspiration from others to try alternative
gyro's.

I thought our 2 1/2 hour journey was tiring but then quite a few of your
visiting members had travelled some distance for a good annual meeting. I am
just putting the finishing touches to my DAG2 and hope to test fly in the week
if weather remains calmish! I have enclosed a picture of progress to-date. Just
requires fuel proofing and fitting OS48 four stroke and of course the rotors
need finishing. Also I have enclosed a copy of the KLAMC monthly magazine hot
off the press. You are most welcome to Roydon Flying Field for the Open on
August 1st 2010 or for the Late Summer Fly-In 26th September - Just drop me an
e-mail.

Hope to see you next year with a autogyro model to fly! If you want to use any
photos, fell free.

Best regards,

Gerry Betts - King's Lynn Aero Modelling Club



Cali
Yes Cali it was a good weekend, too short!

I like the idea of a Sept event. I will drop him an email via his club web site.

Andy
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