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Old Oct 21, 2009, 08:10 PM
The END.....ha!
KCV6's Avatar
Australia, SA, Edinburgh
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Mel, the CB180Q and CB180D (I have a D) are very stable and nice to fly. Hovers like a coax but flys like a FP as in during turns it still wants to drift off in it's original course so the turns require rudder and cyclic to get nice banking turns. if you play around with the head linkages (bell or hiller which ever it really is) you can get reasonable FFF out of it. My only gripe with it is the stock tail rotor is easily broken but I got around this by using a 2 bladed #52 tail rotor. Far more flexible and forgiving. All in All a nice medium sized FP. I'm waiting the outcome of more peoples brushless trials before I do any other mods to mine.

Cheers... Mark
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KCV6
Mel, the CB180Q and CB180D (I have a D) are very stable and nice to fly. Hovers like a coax but flys like a FP as in during turns it still wants to drift off in it's original course so the turns require rudder and cyclic to get nice banking turns. if you play around with the head linkages (bell or hiller which ever it really is) you can get reasonable FFF out of it. My only gripe with it is the stock tail rotor is easily broken but I got around this by using a 2 bladed #52 tail rotor. Far more flexible and forgiving. All in All a nice medium sized FP. I'm waiting the outcome of more peoples brushless trials before I do any other mods to mine.

Cheers... Mark
Thanks Mark! Too bad about the tail rotor though. I would have thought that rear skeg would have protected it somewhat. Maybe you could use the "tail rotor" off the 400D....lol...

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 12:43 PM
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Anyone know where to buy the 400D from a US vendor?

Thanks!
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Doubletap
Anyone know where to buy the 400D from a US vendor?

Thanks!
You can try asking WowHobbies if they plan to carry the 400D since they do carry a number of Walkera Helis now.

wowhobbies.com

bananahobby.com has the 400 but not the 400D.

Methinks if you want a 400D, it will be from China or you have to settle watching the videos of them on YouTube...:-(

I've be watching for the last month and a half and even getting one from China is tough, they always seem to be on the verge of "out of stock".. Not to mention spare parts can be a challenge to find at times (like blades..)

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:09 PM
It flies!!! ... so who cares ?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wabbitguy
You can try asking WowHobbies if they plan to carry the 400D since they do carry a number of Walkera Helis now.

wowhobbies.com

bananahobby.com has the 400 but not the 400D.

Methinks if you want a 400D, it will be from China or you have to settle watching the videos of them on YouTube...:-(

I've be watching for the last month and a half and even getting one from China is tough, they always seem to be on the verge of "out of stock".. Not to mention spare parts can be a challenge to find at times (like blades..)

Mel
Looks quite a bit like the situation in Germany, if I see that right ...

But then again,
what is the big problem about ordering them in China anyways?? I know, shipping is quite the PITA, but even if you would get it here in the states - would be basically paying the same, as it is less shipping but more base price!

On another note:
If the CB180(D) would not be as big as it is and a single rotor, I would actually get that from xheli ... because of the same reason I mentioned above.
But I am still looking to get a medium sized singlerotor ... I would love the Kestrel 500. But if that one is cheap, it is also out of stock!!

Sven
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by blacksteel
if it.s the transmitter dose this mean that it will increase the range mike
Mike, I was hunting around for a US source of 400D's, and apart from the fact I didn't find any, what I did find at Banana Hobby was a spec they posted for the 400 (the original with the 7.4V battery). The only difference is the RX that I could see. The 400 uses a RX2413 and the 400D uses RX2419:

Control system: 4CH Multifunctional 2.4 GHz Transmitter WK-2401 and 4-in-1 Receiver RX-2413
Radio Control Range: 3300 feet (1000m)

Notice the RANGE spec? 3300 feet. I'm thinking at that distance flying would be "interesting" (bet Mark could do it..I'm kidding Mark)...

Although at a third of that distance I watched one of my sailplanes just float away. We tried to chase it in the car, but when it crossed the inlet my car couldn't. The highlight was I got it back. Two days later. The guy that found it said he got up one morning and wondered what the heck was on the top of his motorhome...fortunately I had my address info inside and it was only dinged up a bit.

Walkera says the only different is the 2413 is 7.4V, the 2419 is 11.1V. Range should be more than you are experiencing!

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:49 PM
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In KCV6's original post, he said that the rate adjustment was set from the factory to about 1/4 of it's travel and did not permitting much movement of the swash. When I turned the extent all the way up (clockwise), the swashplate still barely moves, maybe 1 or 2 mm at most. Even if I were push on it, it still barely moves. Is this normal?

The reason I am asking this is because every time I take off, my helicopter flies in a random direction. There is no pattern in my flight behavior. When I first received the heli, it kept spinning CCW so I turned the extent pot all the way up. Should I readjust the "extent" again? Also, should I leave sensitivity switch on the RX alone?

Thank you
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erdnuckel2
Looks quite a bit like the situation in Germany, if I see that right ...

But then again,
what is the big problem about ordering them in China anyways?? I know, shipping is quite the PITA, but even if you would get it here in the states - would be basically paying the same, as it is less shipping but more base price!

On another note:
If the CB180(D) would not be as big as it is and a single rotor, I would actually get that from xheli ... because of the same reason I mentioned above.
But I am still looking to get a medium sized singlerotor ... I would love the Kestrel 500. But if that one is cheap, it is also out of stock!!

Sven
Yep, I agree Sven, I don't have a problem with ordering from China, that's how all mine have ended up here in the hanger.. I have noticed that shipping rates have gone up quite a bit, but then so have the heli sizes and weights. So maybe that has something to do with it.

I think xheli is one of the few I've never ordered anything from. I heard a guy describe them once as the "Walmart of helicopter stores" and I got a chuckle out of that.

My ulitmate FP would be one that hovers like a coax (just as easy) and one that I don't have to overthink when trying to control it. Mark has indicated the 180D is a good candidate for this so I'm fence sitting at the moment. My 4GB1 hovered, but it wasn't pretty. Ugh. Probably should have picked the Honey Bee instead.

I thought the Kestral 500 was a Coax? It looks sort of like my 53Q3 but slightly smaller. Or is there another Kestral 500? And the 53Q3 is a horrid thing to fly as fas as I am concerned (especially compared to the 400D).

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 02:57 PM
It flies!!! ... so who cares ?
erdnuckel2's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wabbitguy
...

I thought the Kestral 500 was a Coax? It looks sort of like my 53Q3 but slightly smaller. Or is there another Kestral 500? And the 53Q3 is a horrid thing to fly as fas as I am concerned (especially compared to the 400D).

Mel
Hi Mel,

yes and no. The Kestrel 500 actually IS a CoAx - but then there is the "other" Kestrel 500 (which was available from bphobbies for 99.95$ about a week ago - unfortunately its out of stock now ... I REALLY wonder why )

just a short vid (this is NOT me !!) to let you see what I am referring to (and what I soooo would love to get, because its just a tad bigger then a Lama4 ... but what would I do with my HBFP then ??? )

Kestrel 500 SX - Hughes MD500E (0 min 42 sec)


Sven
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xterx
In KCV6's original post, he said that the rate adjustment was set from the factory to about 1/4 of it's travel and did not permitting much movement of the swash. When I turned the extent all the way up (clockwise), the swashplate still barely moves, maybe 1 or 2 mm at most. Even if I were push on it, it still barely moves. Is this normal?

The reason I am asking this is because every time I take off, my helicopter flies in a random direction. There is no pattern in my flight behavior. When I first received the heli, it kept spinning CCW so I turned the extent pot all the way up. Should I readjust the "extent" again? Also, should I leave sensitivity switch on the RX alone?

Thank you
I took three photos and composited them so you can see how much my swash plate moves on my 400D:



Left image is MAX forward, middle is yep;middle, right image in full back. You can easily see that at 5/8 of full travel, I'm getting a lot more than 1-2mm of travel.

The extent pot won't do anything for the spinning, you want to change the sensitivity pot (gyro).

You might have mixed up the two?

I've never seen one spin like mad out of the box unless the trim on the TX was all the way over when I started and didn't notice (I have learned to check now)...

Sounds to me like the heli is flying pretty much like normal out of the box though. If you're outside, any breeze at all, out of the box will move it where ever the breeze goes. You don't get a lot of flight control. And it takes quite a bit of stick movement to make it do otherwise.

For a spinning bird, that sounds like the gyro isn't doing its job very well.

I'd take the canopy off it and go through every nut and bolt on it to make it's doing it's job. Then I'd take the control rods off the swash plate make sure the plate moves freely and not binding on something. Last, before you connect the push rods back up to the swash, I run a servo test to make sure they are moving properly too. If your 400D is misbehaving I'll wager you find something wrong at some point along the way.

Good luck!

Mel

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by erdnuckel2
Hi Mel,

yes and no. The Kestrel 500 actually IS a CoAx - but then there is the "other" Kestrel 500 (which was available from bphobbies for 99.95$ about a week ago - unfortunately its out of stock now ... I REALLY wonder why )

just a short vid (this is NOT me !!) to let you see what I am referring to (and what I soooo would love to get, because its just a tad bigger then a Lama4 ... but what would I do with my HBFP then ??? )

Sven
Ah HA! Good video. Won't be me either, looked like the guy had some control..;-) Two different 500's. Thanks for the clarification. That's a good price too.

Which brings me to another interesting topic, that being one of size. I got coaxs from an air hogs Havoc; I don't believe I just admitted that but it is the one that got me started, to the 400D. Some fly good, some don't.

The 400D out flies any of them for me. Now is that because an engineer took more than 38 seconds to design it, or just because it's big? Maybe just good mojo?

I've only been flying these for a little over a year, so I'm a noob. Mark, you've flown a lot of different helicopters for some time. Is bigger easier to fly or learn to fly on or is there a point where it's going to bite you anyway? Does it work the same in FP and Coax?

Since I got the 400D, my FP sits on the shelf. Think I'm going to make it into a static display or let the grandkids use it for a pinata...

Mel
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 04:07 PM
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mel that's brill ; a range of 1000m is good enough for me .i wounder if it was a freak gust of wind then i lost control. you were lucky to get your sailplane back after such a journey .i like the idea of the address on the hli or plane .i have already lost one ;think its in a tree or the pond next to it .1000m is good .thanks again mike
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 04:37 PM
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Mel, your post means a lot to me. Thank you so much. I have spent hours trying to determine the problem. Its just that when I take off, it will always fly in a random direction. For example, it will fly diagonally to right sometimes when the take off. When I turn down the throttle so the blade stops, and rethrottle it, it will fly randomly in another direction. I can't seem to do any adjustments on the trim because there is no going pattern that I can base the adjustments on.

For now, I will follow your post and see whats going on with the swash plate. I will play around with the sensitivity pot to see what it will do.

Again, thank you Mel.
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 04:44 PM
It flies!!! ... so who cares ?
erdnuckel2's Avatar
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Hey Mel,

I just found another vid for the Kestrel 500 SX - must see as example for hands free hover with FP (sorry for highjacking the thread a bit - but I think that might even be interesting for all coax flyers ...)

again not me (unfortunately )

nine eagle kestrel 500sx (3 min 56 sec)


Take a look at what happens around 3:00

Sven
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Old Oct 22, 2009, 08:22 PM
The END.....ha!
KCV6's Avatar
Australia, SA, Edinburgh
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Been a bit busy, my eight year old son broke his arm yesterday morning.

Heya Sven, no problems at all, no hijacking

Mark
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