HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Aug 20, 2009, 05:09 PM
Registered User
United States, GA, Ringgold
Joined Oct 2005
312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leadchucker
Guess I qualify for this group having just recently aquired my first ever Saito product. I bought a Saito 100 FA-AAC for my Great Planes Stearman to replace a OS FS 91 Surpass which proved to have not nearly enough power for the aircraft. The new powerplant is not quite ran in yet,but already is proving to be very capable of hauling the Boeing around the sky.

One note if I may: Why do people insist on calling an "engine" a "motor"???
Sorry,but this really bugs me as I make my living as an licensed Operating Engineer..would not I then be a Motorneer if it was indeed called a motor??

Slang terms are popularized by marketing folks and then the rest of us are stuck with spelling errors in perpetuity. Such as the automotive repair manuals known as "Motor Manuals". Once it is an established tradition, it is hopeless to think that you can straighten folks out.

Learn a lesson from your OS .91 Surpass experience. Four-stroke glow engines are nowhere near as strong as two-stroke glow engines of the same displacement, unless supercharging is employed with the four-stroke. Even then, I doubt if the horsepower per cubic inch is truly at parity. And no, four-strokes do not make more torque than two-strokes of the same displacement. Don't forget, the two-stroke makes two power pulses in the same time (two revolutions) that it takes for a four-stroke to complete one cycle. So, even with the two-stroke's power pulses being slightly weaker than the one power pulse produced by the four-stroke, the two-stroke has made two power pulses, which makes the power output substantially higher than that of the four-stroke engine. Yeah, I know. Lots of variables, state of tuning, etc. can affect the outcome, but this generalization holds true most of the time.

To me, that series of Great Planes models was definitely for 1.20 four-stroke glow and larger engines.


Ed Cregger
Ed Cregger is offline Find More Posts by Ed Cregger
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Aug 20, 2009, 05:18 PM
Registered User
I TOBOR's Avatar
Joined Feb 2007
2,838 Posts
LC, you won't find me calling an engine a motor. That is a pet peave with me, engines is engines. Well, then for some reason I ride a Motorcycle. Go figure.

A shot of my Saito 1.00 running on Davis Diesel fuel, it will start up stone cold with no assist what ever.
I TOBOR is offline Find More Posts by I TOBOR
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 20, 2009, 05:28 PM
TDI Abuser
flyinghigh's Avatar
Joined Sep 2002
4,125 Posts
Well I drive a motorcar so what they hey ? You can have your engine cycle!
flyinghigh is offline Find More Posts by flyinghigh
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 20, 2009, 08:17 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2008
441 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Cregger
Slang terms are popularized by marketing folks and then the rest of us are stuck with spelling errors in perpetuity. Such as the automotive repair manuals known as "Motor Manuals". Once it is an established tradition, it is hopeless to think that you can straighten folks out.

Learn a lesson from your OS .91 Surpass experience. Four-stroke glow engines are nowhere near as strong as two-stroke glow engines of the same displacement, unless supercharging is employed with the four-stroke. Even then, I doubt if the horsepower per cubic inch is truly at parity. And no, four-strokes do not make more torque than two-strokes of the same displacement. Don't forget, the two-stroke makes two power pulses in the same time (two revolutions) that it takes for a four-stroke to complete one cycle. So, even with the two-stroke's power pulses being slightly weaker than the one power pulse produced by the four-stroke, the two-stroke has made two power pulses, which makes the power output substantially higher than that of the four-stroke engine. Yeah, I know. Lots of variables, state of tuning, etc. can affect the outcome, but this generalization holds true most of the time.

To me, that series of Great Planes models was definitely for 1.20 four-stroke glow and larger engines.




Ed Cregger

in simple language what is the pro's and con's between a 2 stroke and 4 stroke engine. i don't know much about engines. i just like the sound of a 4 stroke.
gramps
gramps45 is offline Find More Posts by gramps45
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 20, 2009, 08:38 PM
Registered User
United States, GA, Ringgold
Joined Oct 2005
312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by gramps45
in simple language what is the pro's and con's between a 2 stroke and 4 stroke engine. i don't know much about engines. i just like the sound of a 4 stroke.
gramps

Just to be simple - it doesn't matter which you choose for powering your model airplane. Just follow the manufacturer's recommendations for engine sizes. Unfortunately, some manufacturers are a little slow at providing both two and four-stroke recommendations.

Yes, two-strokes are generally more powerful than four-strokes, but the four-strokes we have available in modelling are powerful enough to fly our models successfully, as long as we are aware of our flying habits and requirements.

If you typically choose a two-stroke engine size that lets you putt around at 1/3rd to 1/4 quarter throttle after takeoff, you can be reasonably assured that a four-stroke engine of the same displacement will power your model just fine. However, if your two-stroke engine is just able to power the model successfully at WOT, you will be disappointed with a four-stroke of the same size. YS excluded.


Ed Cregger
Ed Cregger is offline Find More Posts by Ed Cregger
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 20, 2009, 09:14 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2008
441 Posts
thanks alot ed! i like that explantion. will keep that in mind.

gramps
gramps45 is offline Find More Posts by gramps45
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 20, 2009, 10:58 PM
What smoke?
Lostlad's Avatar
SoCal
Joined Feb 2008
279 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leadchucker
One note if I may: Why do people insist on calling an "engine" a "motor"???
Sorry,but this really bugs me as I make my living as an licensed Operating Engineer..would not I then be a Motorneer if it was indeed called a motor??
From Wikipedia:

Motor usually refers to either an electrical motor or an internal combustion engine.

Lostlad
Lostlad is offline Find More Posts by Lostlad
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 04:00 AM
Re-kitting Expert
Tarasdad's Avatar
USA, CA, California City
Joined Jul 2009
165 Posts
Guess you can add me to the group as well. I own a Saito FA-80 that I got as a birthday present around 1988 or 1989. For the longest time it lived in a Goldberg Anniversary Cub. Way too much engine for that bird, but sure sounded pretty puttering around at 1/2 throttle or so. Due to school, work and other real-life issues it ended up in storage for 15 years or so. I just recently got it back in my possession (was stored at my dad's house), and although in need of a little TLC (new bearings and gaskets) it's in fantastic shape. As soon as I do the work that it needs I'll be looking for a new home for it to reside in - maybe a Spacewalker or another Cub.
Tarasdad is offline Find More Posts by Tarasdad
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 07:43 AM
Registered User
I TOBOR's Avatar
Joined Feb 2007
2,838 Posts
TD, that is one of the early high compression Saito .80s, I have one of those, its a fine engine and will run on 5% nitro as well as the other run on 20. I also have one the first 1.50s which is also high compression compared to todays.

In this picture I was showing off, (mostly to myself) running the old .80 on 5% nitro and inverted.
I TOBOR is offline Find More Posts by I TOBOR
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 08:07 AM
Suspended Account
Joined Mar 2008
2,937 Posts
Well now that my messages have stopped disapearing I felt it is safe to pop in and say hi . Nice photos I TOBOR and good for you all the help you have been giving in this forum - Ill bet you have the most saitos [and saito knowledge] of anyone here ! Happy Flying
init4fun is offline Find More Posts by init4fun
Last edited by init4fun; Aug 21, 2009 at 08:08 AM. Reason: spelling . again !
Reply With Quote  (Disabled)
Old Aug 21, 2009, 08:44 AM
Registered User
I TOBOR's Avatar
Joined Feb 2007
2,838 Posts
Your UserName could easily apply to me, I do this for fun, at 67 I'm still waiting to grow up, at 66 my wife is young at heart too. She has bought several Saitos for me over the years and two years ago bought me a new Harley which is rapidly approaching 10,000 miles. Maybe I'll count my Saitos today, I also have one Laser .70, one OS .52 and three Enya fourstrokes.
I TOBOR is offline Find More Posts by I TOBOR
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 12:24 PM
TDI Abuser
flyinghigh's Avatar
Joined Sep 2002
4,125 Posts
Yeah I TOBOR is a real MOTOR Head isn't he ?
flyinghigh is offline Find More Posts by flyinghigh
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 01:44 PM
Registered User
United States, GA, Ringgold
Joined Oct 2005
312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostlad
From Wikipedia:

Motor usually refers to either an electrical motor or an internal combustion engine.

Lostlad


Quoting Wikipedia as a reference on anything is like quoting Saddam Hussein's views on human rights and holding them up as vaulted moral principles.

I used to know the differentiation between motor and engine, but it has long since faded from memory. What I don't understand about memory is why can I remember that I knew, but I can't remember what it was? Getting old still beats the alternative.

Anyway, when I was a young'un, it was explained to me that rockets and electric motors were reaction devices and therefore were motors. Jets and IC devices were engines and nothing was mentioned about reaction devices. It used to be poor form for even a high school student to use the terms inappropriately.

Sorry, I do not mean to insult or embarrass the person quoting Wikipedia. I didn't know about its dubious accuracy when I first stumbled across it either.


Ed Cregger
Ed Cregger is offline Find More Posts by Ed Cregger
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 02:02 PM
TDI Abuser
flyinghigh's Avatar
Joined Sep 2002
4,125 Posts
Dont worry I don't think anyones embarrassed . We understand .
flyinghigh is offline Find More Posts by flyinghigh
Reply With Quote
Old Aug 21, 2009, 02:40 PM
Registered User
I TOBOR's Avatar
Joined Feb 2007
2,838 Posts
Yep, been known as a GearHead since I was 10 years old, when I was 13 I gave my neighbor $35 for a 1952 Indian that was a re-badged Royal Enfield 250cc flathead. It had the gear shift and brake on the wrong sides. I brought it home in 3 bushel baskets plus that frame and the wheels. My neighbor thought he'd never see it again. He was thoroughly amazed when I rode it past his house a week later. It had Lucas "non electrics" so I put an old 6v car battery in a box behind the single seat and ran it as a total loss system. It would run a week on a charge. Few people know that Indian sold such a bike. My first glow engine was McCoy .36 I got for Christmas in 1956 and I still have it. My first RC engine was an Enya .46 MKII fourstroke which I still have also.
I TOBOR is offline Find More Posts by I TOBOR
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Composites Forum on RC Groups? TGoodwin Composites Fabrication 9 Oct 01, 2004 04:49 AM
PLEASE KILL ACTIVE X on RC Groups. windsurfer Site Chat 7 Apr 19, 2004 03:16 PM
Help! Large font on RC Groups! Lenny970 Site Chat 4 Mar 20, 2004 11:52 PM