Free Flight - Page 7

Applehoney · Oct 20, 2009, 10:58 PM

Kevin, if you are covering up to a rib, leaving a bay uncovered beside it, the shrinking tissue will bow that rib inwards , or distort it on either side of a spar.

kevin matthews · Oct 21, 2009, 08:21 AM

I've had that problem with LE's and TE's bowing in due to too much spacing between ribs.

Kev

flight999 · Oct 21, 2009, 01:51 PM

..............which is probably where
your weight comes from then.

kevin matthews · Oct 23, 2009, 11:51 PM

I have all the frames built now for the TM Scout. I cut out the rear spar that was in each of the four semi-spans but left them in at the joint panels where they connect to the center sections and where the struts will attach. I sanded them flush where the rib notches are. I made the rudder 1/16" thick instead of 3/32" to save weight. I'm in the process now of covering the wings. I pinned some 1/2" sq sticks to the building board and pinned the semi-spans to those to cover the bottoms. So far I have the upper wing semi-spans covered on the bottom. Since the LE is 3/32" bigger than the TE, I added 3/32" to the 1/2" sticks so they would rest flat.

Kev

kevin matthews · Oct 25, 2009, 01:34 AM

I've got all four semi-spans covered on the bottoms. I have one semi-span covered on the top and the upper wing center section is covered on top and bottom. The ribs were laser cut so the edges are burnt. I thought about sanding that off but the TE's are delicate and I didn't want to lose any of it. What I did was glue on 3/32" wide black strips over the ribs after covering. It looks like it will take a couple more days to finish all the semi-spans.

Kev

kevin matthews · Oct 26, 2009, 05:05 PM

The four wing semi-spams are tissue covered. When I get them doped then I'll clue them on to the center sections. The covering went well. Does anyone have any thoughts on the best dihedral I should use. I've gone from adding an extra half an inch to doing it like the plane calls for. I just want it to be as stable as possible as it circles. The rudder is on the board while the glue drys. I made it so sparce it was my guess that it would be too flimsy to hold it's shape after tissue covering and shrinking. So I beefed it up some. It's still a lot lighter than it would be if I built it stock with the kit wood. I've been thinking about the trimming process for this one. If it stalls and comes down on the tail the stab and rudder will most likely break so trimming with too much nose weight to start is a good idea and then slowly reducing the amount of clay ballast. It's been my experience that the scale models actually balance further back than what the plan indicates. With this plane a bi-plane I'm thinking it will balance at 75% back from the LE of the top wing.

Kev

kevin matthews · Oct 28, 2009, 03:20 PM

I've got the fuselage covered and the cowl painted and glued on. I added black stripes at the formers to match the wings and to cover the burned edges. I cut a square hole in the front of the cowl and made a nose block to fit in it. I'll use a Gizmo Geezer thrust button. In the mean time while I'm waiting on the dope thinner I've started building the Moffett. I've started with the fuselage. My hopes are for this plane to fly for 90 seconds. I'm trying to make it as light as possible so since it is smaller than the design it's reduced in size from I'm not using the diagonal bracing which is built into the large design. I'm planning on using two loops of 3/16" rubber to power an 11" plastic propellor. My theory is that with the smaller rubber on a smaller plane I'll get as many winds as the big plane gets with it's two loops of 1/4" rubber. So the propeller will unwind slower and carry the lighter weight airplane for longer.

Kev

kevin matthews · Oct 31, 2009, 05:03 PM

Free flight is like coasting downhill on your bicycle in heavy traffic.

Kev

kevin matthews · Nov 01, 2009, 02:38 AM

I was watching the World Series game tonight and I started thinking how great it would be if there was an arena big enough to seat tens of thousands of people to watch a free flight series of competitions.

Kev

flight999 · Nov 01, 2009, 07:27 AM

Why? How would you communicate with them all?

kevin matthews · Nov 01, 2009, 09:50 AM

I just think free flight competitions should be like the other pro sports. It should get the media coverage a pro baseball game gets like with TV broadcasts. It could even be a night event with all the lights. There could be a big PA system which broadcasts to a very large audience "play by play" coverage. There could be several events at all the different stadiums. It would be close to perfect if the stadium was completely indoor.

Kev

flight999 · Nov 01, 2009, 11:01 AM

Kev, I think just about all free flighters would agree
that their hobby/sport/pastime is anything but a
spectator event. The last thing they want at a
competition site is loads of spectators asking silly
questions just as they are about to fly.

Once a flight is underway there is very little to see
or hold the attention of uninvolved watcher.

Applehoney · Nov 01, 2009, 02:13 PM

The main drawback is that the general public is not aviation-oriented, as it was in the 30's to 50's and the great majority of same would dismiss model airplanes as 'toys' with no interest in same.

Even if you had an audience there would be little to capture and retain their attention with a number of models going into the air at erratic intervals .. nothing obviously going head-to-head in terms of racing, etc. .. no excitement .. no violence ... no ongoing movement or drama. A moot point anyway . you wouldn't have an audience; they'd rather be at the TV, playing electronic games, etc.

In England, back in the early 50's, there was a demonstration of U/Control models at Wembley Stadium in the interval of the soccer Cup Final. 20 minutes of stunt, team racers, a couple of large multi engine scale models - and a Dynajet powered D.H. Vampire which captured attention with sheer noise. The show ws quite well received .. as said at start people had more interest in aviation at that time but ... they were there as a 'captive audience'. They paid good money for their seats to watch soccer and the C/L show was just a 'fill-in diversion' Had that been boosted as the main attraction the stadium would have been empty.

kevin matthews · Nov 01, 2009, 07:56 PM

It would be neat to have prime time nation wide media coverage.

Kev

kevin matthews · Nov 04, 2009, 09:15 PM

I've got all the wing semi-spans doped and the fuselage as well. There were blushing white spots but a little fingernail polish remover got rid of them. Unfortunately the semi-spans' TE's are bowed. Fortunately they are bowed the right way - up and not down. So I decided to add the dihedral I was thinking about: 1/2" more. The bottom wing dihedral will be 1 1/2" and the top wing will be 1".

Kev

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Oct 20, 2009, 10:58 PM	#91
Applehoney Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Ajax, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,647	Kevin, if you are covering up to a rib, leaving a bay uncovered beside it, the shrinking tissue will bow that rib inwards , or distort it on either side of a spar.

Oct 21, 2009, 08:21 AM	#92
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I've had that problem with LE's and TE's bowing in due to too much spacing between ribs. Kev

Oct 21, 2009, 01:51 PM	#93
flight999 flight999 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: England Posts: 1,976	..............which is probably where your weight comes from then.

Oct 23, 2009, 11:51 PM	#94
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I have all the frames built now for the TM Scout. I cut out the rear spar that was in each of the four semi-spans but left them in at the joint panels where they connect to the center sections and where the struts will attach. I sanded them flush where the rib notches are. I made the rudder 1/16" thick instead of 3/32" to save weight. I'm in the process now of covering the wings. I pinned some 1/2" sq sticks to the building board and pinned the semi-spans to those to cover the bottoms. So far I have the upper wing semi-spans covered on the bottom. Since the LE is 3/32" bigger than the TE, I added 3/32" to the 1/2" sticks so they would rest flat. Kev

Oct 25, 2009, 01:34 AM	#95
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I've got all four semi-spans covered on the bottoms. I have one semi-span covered on the top and the upper wing center section is covered on top and bottom. The ribs were laser cut so the edges are burnt. I thought about sanding that off but the TE's are delicate and I didn't want to lose any of it. What I did was glue on 3/32" wide black strips over the ribs after covering. It looks like it will take a couple more days to finish all the semi-spans. Kev

Oct 26, 2009, 05:05 PM	#96
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	The four wing semi-spams are tissue covered. When I get them doped then I'll clue them on to the center sections. The covering went well. Does anyone have any thoughts on the best dihedral I should use. I've gone from adding an extra half an inch to doing it like the plane calls for. I just want it to be as stable as possible as it circles. The rudder is on the board while the glue drys. I made it so sparce it was my guess that it would be too flimsy to hold it's shape after tissue covering and shrinking. So I beefed it up some. It's still a lot lighter than it would be if I built it stock with the kit wood. I've been thinking about the trimming process for this one. If it stalls and comes down on the tail the stab and rudder will most likely break so trimming with too much nose weight to start is a good idea and then slowly reducing the amount of clay ballast. It's been my experience that the scale models actually balance further back than what the plan indicates. With this plane a bi-plane I'm thinking it will balance at 75% back from the LE of the top wing. Kev

Oct 28, 2009, 03:20 PM	#97
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I've got the fuselage covered and the cowl painted and glued on. I added black stripes at the formers to match the wings and to cover the burned edges. I cut a square hole in the front of the cowl and made a nose block to fit in it. I'll use a Gizmo Geezer thrust button. In the mean time while I'm waiting on the dope thinner I've started building the Moffett. I've started with the fuselage. My hopes are for this plane to fly for 90 seconds. I'm trying to make it as light as possible so since it is smaller than the design it's reduced in size from I'm not using the diagonal bracing which is built into the large design. I'm planning on using two loops of 3/16" rubber to power an 11" plastic propellor. My theory is that with the smaller rubber on a smaller plane I'll get as many winds as the big plane gets with it's two loops of 1/4" rubber. So the propeller will unwind slower and carry the lighter weight airplane for longer. Kev

Oct 31, 2009, 05:03 PM	#98
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	Free flight is like coasting downhill on your bicycle in heavy traffic. Kev

Nov 01, 2009, 02:38 AM	#99
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I was watching the World Series game tonight and I started thinking how great it would be if there was an arena big enough to seat tens of thousands of people to watch a free flight series of competitions. Kev

Nov 01, 2009, 07:27 AM	#100
flight999 flight999 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: England Posts: 1,976	Why? How would you communicate with them all?

Nov 01, 2009, 09:50 AM	#101
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I just think free flight competitions should be like the other pro sports. It should get the media coverage a pro baseball game gets like with TV broadcasts. It could even be a night event with all the lights. There could be a big PA system which broadcasts to a very large audience "play by play" coverage. There could be several events at all the different stadiums. It would be close to perfect if the stadium was completely indoor. Kev

Nov 01, 2009, 11:01 AM	#102
flight999 flight999 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: England Posts: 1,976	Kev, I think just about all free flighters would agree that their hobby/sport/pastime is anything but a spectator event. The last thing they want at a competition site is loads of spectators asking silly questions just as they are about to fly. Once a flight is underway there is very little to see or hold the attention of uninvolved watcher.

Nov 01, 2009, 02:13 PM	#103
Applehoney Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Ajax, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,647	The main drawback is that the general public is not aviation-oriented, as it was in the 30's to 50's and the great majority of same would dismiss model airplanes as 'toys' with no interest in same. Even if you had an audience there would be little to capture and retain their attention with a number of models going into the air at erratic intervals .. nothing obviously going head-to-head in terms of racing, etc. .. no excitement .. no violence ... no ongoing movement or drama. A moot point anyway . you wouldn't have an audience; they'd rather be at the TV, playing electronic games, etc. In England, back in the early 50's, there was a demonstration of U/Control models at Wembley Stadium in the interval of the soccer Cup Final. 20 minutes of stunt, team racers, a couple of large multi engine scale models - and a Dynajet powered D.H. Vampire which captured attention with sheer noise. The show ws quite well received .. as said at start people had more interest in aviation at that time but ... they were there as a 'captive audience'. They paid good money for their seats to watch soccer and the C/L show was just a 'fill-in diversion' Had that been boosted as the main attraction the stadium would have been empty.

Nov 01, 2009, 07:56 PM	#104
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	It would be neat to have prime time nation wide media coverage. Kev

Nov 04, 2009, 09:15 PM	#105
kevin matthews Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: carbondale il Posts: 1,467	I've got all the wing semi-spans doped and the fuselage as well. There were blushing white spots but a little fingernail polish remover got rid of them. Unfortunately the semi-spans' TE's are bowed. Fortunately they are bowed the right way - up and not down. So I decided to add the dihedral I was thinking about: 1/2" more. The bottom wing dihedral will be 1 1/2" and the top wing will be 1". Kev