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Old Jun 16, 2009, 03:51 PM
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Joined May 2009
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tail wag with Logo 600 and 110hv

I keep getting a constant tail hunt/wag with the newest software and firmware. I have tried everything from set rpm to gov high, from gov gain 5 up to 30 and i just cant get rid of the wag. Its not a tail gyro issue, I have put the Vstabi gain at different positions from 50 to 92 with no help. The other issue with the speed controller is that when I use my flight power 10s packs, I can use gov high, set at 2280, but when I use my Zippy 5sx2 pack, it sends my headspeed way up to 2500+. I don't change anything and it just increases the headspeed without and reason. I want to use gov high, but I am stuck with set rpm, and I notice that the headspeed fluxuates more in set rpm. Its driving me crazy, any ideas?
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Old Jun 16, 2009, 04:43 PM
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Patrick del Castillo's Avatar
Olathe,KS,USA
Joined Oct 2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxxteezy
I keep getting a constant tail hunt/wag with the newest software and firmware. I have tried everything from set rpm to gov high, from gov gain 5 up to 30 and i just cant get rid of the wag. Its not a tail gyro issue, I have put the Vstabi gain at different positions from 50 to 92 with no help. The other issue with the speed controller is that when I use my flight power 10s packs, I can use gov high, set at 2280, but when I use my Zippy 5sx2 pack, it sends my headspeed way up to 2500+. I don't change anything and it just increases the headspeed without and reason. I want to use gov high, but I am stuck with set rpm, and I notice that the headspeed fluxuates more in set rpm. Its driving me crazy, any ideas?
It sounds like you aren't governing at all -- is the LED on all the time while flying?
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Old Jun 16, 2009, 07:08 PM
A man with too many toys
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Joined Feb 2001
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Try a smaller pinion.
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Old Jun 17, 2009, 03:35 AM
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I set everything in the software and send it to the esc. I used mr.mels hs calc on rh and it gave me the the pinion size of 11th/106th to get my 2300 at +-85%. What would keep the governor from governing? I am pretty savy with a computer, I do all of the FBL setups in my club, so I don't think I am doing anything terribly wrong. I don't know how to check the light while im flying, its a pretty big, scary bird. I don't want to get that close to it.
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Old Jun 17, 2009, 06:50 AM
A man with too many toys
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What software version is loaded in your ESC?

What throttle curves do you have in the transmitter?

.
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Old Jun 17, 2009, 09:11 AM
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I installed the latest version that they just released. I am running a 50% curve now, at first I was able to run a 78% curve. But now its just plan weird, one pack is 2300, the next will go up to 2550. I will load a cap of my settings later.
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Old Jun 17, 2009, 06:14 PM
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Olathe, KS (next to the Castle)
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If the LED is on all the time the governor is maxed out and not governing. If that is the case try setting with Set RPM gov mode which will calculate how well the set up will work and allow you to tune gearing in software without going through the hassle of actually changing gears until you get a set up that will work.

Bernie
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Old Jun 18, 2009, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Wolfard
If the LED is on all the time the governor is maxed out and not governing. If that is the case try setting with Set RPM gov mode which will calculate how well the set up will work and allow you to tune gearing in software without going through the hassle of actually changing gears until you get a set up that will work.

Bernie
hmm...Interesting. I've never actually thought about "lying" to the software to adjust for results. I will try that in the morning. So I should tell it that I have a smaller pinion or larger? I flew it again today and it was overspeeding and bogging like a muther. I have the gain down to 7, and you can really tell. I try and look at the light and see if its staying on the entire time.
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Old Jun 18, 2009, 06:50 AM
A man with too many toys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxxteezy
hmm...Interesting. I've never actually thought about "lying" to the software to adjust for results. I will try that in the morning. So I should tell it that I have a smaller pinion or larger? I flew it again today and it was overspeeding and bogging like a muther. I have the gain down to 7, and you can really tell. I try and look at the light and see if its staying on the entire time.
If itís over speeding and bogging you definitely have a serious setup problem and the ESC is not operating in itís governing range. What motor and battery parameters have you entered in the software?

Please post all your helicopter and ESC setup information.


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Old Jun 18, 2009, 11:07 PM
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Ok, I went out to fly today and you could hear the throttle going up and down as if it was pulsing. He are my settings. I am on a mac so I can't print screen on here.

Type Heli
Throttle type Gov
Thr Response 5
Gov Gain 15
In Spl Up Rate 8
HS Change Rate 5
Auto Rte No
Gov Mode Type High
Batt Type Lipo
Cell Count 10, 37.00 Volts
Gear Ratio 9.6364:1
Pinion 11
Main Gear 106
Motor KV 630
Poles 8
Desired Headspeeds 2240, 2260, 2280
Batt Cutoff 12vlt
Motor Start Low 39
Timing Normal
Direction Foward
PWM Rate Outrunner
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Old Jun 19, 2009, 12:09 PM
A man with too many toys
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If you use switch to the Set RPM mode you might get it to work a lot better.

1. Select the SET RPM mode.
2. Make sure that your motor and gearing parameters are correct.
3. Make sure the 3 headspeed settings are what you want. Why do you have all the headspeed so close together? Something like 2000, 2100, 2200 may be a better place to start and adjust from there. 2280 sounds a bit high to me for a 600 helicopter. I fly my 600 helicopters at 1900, 2050, 2150.
4. Set you transmitter curves to 30 for Normal mode, 65 for Idle UP 1 (stunt mode 1), and 100 for Idle Up 2. That will select the three headspeeds when you switch flight modes.
5. To get the ESC armed and for shutdown I activate the transmitter hold function and set the value to about Ė10 (somewhere between 0 and Ė10 is good for most transmitters). You use the hold switch for arming and shutdown.

As an alternative some just set the first value in the normal curve to 0.


Let me know how that works out.


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Old Jun 19, 2009, 09:33 PM
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Tried everything that you mentioned, took the gain all the way from 1 to 30, and every number in between. I even adjusted my tail gain from the bottom all the way up and the wag is about 1 1/2 ft wide, and violent, no matter what numbers I enter. Is there a way to revert to the old firmware?
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Old Jun 20, 2009, 06:32 AM
A man with too many toys
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Joined Feb 2001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxxteezy
Tried everything that you mentioned, took the gain all the way from 1 to 30, and every number in between. I even adjusted my tail gain from the bottom all the way up and the wag is about 1 1/2 ft wide, and violent, no matter what numbers I enter. Is there a way to revert to the old firmware?
Sounds like the gyro gain is way too high to my but you need to contact Tech Support directly.


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Old Jun 20, 2009, 01:10 PM
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Ok, I believe the problem has been located. Anthony Jager found it in about 2 mins. We pulled the motor because it had some vertical play, and slop, and upon removal we noticed that the can, nearest the pinion was bent to hell. The gap at the bend location went to almost closed at that position. He says that he is almost positive that its the problem, because everything else is practically new. I have been having weird vibrations and everything, and this has to be the culprit. The wag was so bad that I couldn't even get it off the ground.
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Old Jun 20, 2009, 01:32 PM
A man with too many toys
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Joined Feb 2001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxxteezy
Ok, I believe the problem has been located. Anthony Jager found it in about 2 mins. We pulled the motor because it had some vertical play, and slop, and upon removal we noticed that the can, nearest the pinion was bent to hell. The gap at the bend location went to almost closed at that position. He says that he is almost positive that its the problem, because everything else is practically new. I have been having weird vibrations and everything, and this has to be the culprit. The wag was so bad that I couldn't even get it off the ground.
WOW that must have gone through one heck of a crash to bend the motor can than badly. I donít recall reading what motor that you have.

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