Question Turnigy BATTERIES

[tclaridge]

Himalaya,
So summarize all the data for me. Are they good batteries?

[pvtzemerak]

I love Turnigy Batteries.
They work great. but expect about 10% less flight time compared to Name brand batteries of the same MAH Voltage, and C rating.
--PvT

[rampman]

Here is some good info on these and others from HC.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=91

Rick

[Himalaya]

Originally Posted by Wayne Giles

Himalaya said:-


"Look like the cells have much lower pulse IR then static value. I measured with my Hyperion EOS0720i hooked to a PC. In a 3.2A discharge process with 3 second pauses(0A) every minute, I got this graph. From the voltage pulse height we can read the IR=8mV/3.2A = 2.5mΩ. That means with 150A (30C) current it will have only 0.375V/cell voltage drop, not too bad isn't it? "



Nice to see someone else doing proper analysis!

From other general testing I have previously done in this area,those results all makes sense. I noticed 3-4 years ago that the latest Kokams (which were a significant step-up over the originals) showed ESR varying with current. This was a new effect I had never seen and have never seen referred to by anyone else. At 15deg.cent the ESR was 24% lower at 50A than 10A. The effect was less as temperature increased.
The other factor is temperature itself. I always soak any pack for 24hours in a temp. controlled enclosure at 25deg.cent (77F.) before testing, which is fairly high but a good benchmark. What temperature did you take your readings at??
Looking at the plots below which are all 3S2200 20-C packs you can see how important temperature is and how much the temperature coefficients vary both in value and slope. (sorry its a rubbish file but just about readable)

The 2.5 milliohms is, as you say, pretty impressive with a theoretical drop of 0.25V at 20C and 0.375V at 30C. In fact the actual drop will be a fair bit less because of these two factors above, falling further as the pack warms up.

Wayne

I did not pay much attention to thermometer reading when doing the test, it was a comfort temp for me though, guess it's around 20℃.

Yes, temperature does play HUGE role in ESR performance. I did the test again last night, heated the packs up to 30℃ and got a more pleasing reading, 1.5mΩ/cell。Right before that it was around 2.8mΩ at 18℃ room temperature. So you're absolutely right, we must setup a fixed bench mark like 25℃ for a fair comparison between different packs.

For the ESR vs load current effect, that's really interesting. Months ago I did some comparison with Eagle Tree e-logger data and it seems pretty linear, looks like a fixed IR. Probably the self-heating under heavy load made that effect? will test again to comfirm this effect(it is a great effect making batteries handle more power), but I must include the lead/connector resistance as well 'cause Eagle tree readings includes those factor but Hyperion charger reads cell voltages through the balance tab which obviously is pure cell terminal voltage excluding the output wire/connectors.

Originally Posted by tclaridge

Himalaya,
So summarize all the data for me. Are they good batteries?

Yes they are great packs comparable to any big name products with 1/3 if not even lower prices.

[Wayne Giles]

Originally Posted by Himalaya

For the ESR vs load current effect, that's really interesting. Months ago I did some comparison with Eagle Tree e-logger data and it seems pretty linear, looks like a fixed IR. Probably the self-heating under heavy load made that effect? s.

My initial thoughts were that it is a heating effect, but I don't think so as earlier lipos did not do it and I found that I could start at a 5A pulse and take readings every 5A up to 100A and then immediately take another set of readings on the way back down to 5A, getting the same values. I can do a double run like that in about 2 minutes. If it was a heating effect you would expect the second set of figures to be lower and the heated part would have to have a very small thermal capacity, which is very unlikely.
I have posted a copy of my original plots for a Kokam 3S3200 20C which were made in 2005. Note that the effect is very apparent at low temperatures but has virtually disappeared by 30Cent.
My pulse tester also only uses the power connectors to take the current and the voltage step measurement is also taken via the balance connector which enables me to measure cell ESR, lead and connector resistance and even the cell interconnection resistance. This is sometimes revealing as many makes just interconnect cells with inadequate PCBs and fail to reinforce the track electrically.
If you look earlier in the thread, "Golem" posted a picture of a Turnigy 3S1000 30C Pack fitted with a JST connector, which is ludicrous. JST connectors are rated by the maker at 3A and they are using them at 30A (!) I have measured JSTs at 7.4 milliohms/pole, so at 30A the dissipation in the connector is 13.3Watts! About 10 - 15seconds should do it!!! - don't worry about the cable, the connector will melt first.

Wayne

[SpookiePower]

I have just bought my first Lipo, a Hyperion G3 CX - 3S 2100mAh (25C). In Denmark this battery cost 61$. Today I search through Hobbyking and found this Turnigy 2200mAh 3s 20c http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...(DE_Warehouse) for only 17.95 $ That's a pretty big different, compared to the Hyperion. I can see that the Turnigy is more heavy, and that the quality might be lower than Hyperion. But should I take more care, when using a Turnigy because of the lower quality ? What I mean is, can a Turnigy more easy catch fire or explode ?

[Wayne Giles]

Originally Posted by SpookiePower

I have just bought my first Lipo, a Hyperion G3 CX - 3S 2100mAh (25C). In Denmark this battery cost 61$. Today I search through Hobbyking and found this Turnigy 2200mAh 3s 20c http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...(DE_Warehouse) for only 17.95 $ That's a pretty big different, compared to the Hyperion. I can see that the Turnigy is more heavy, and that the quality might be lower than Hyperion. But should I take more care, when using a Turnigy because of the lower quality ? What I mean is, can a Turnigy more easy catch fire or explode ?

There seems to be little correlation between lipo pack's performance in delivering power and their price. If you look at the testing I did at
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1087725
you will see that the worst pack cost nearly 3 x the price of the best performing pack. The fact that the best pack runs cooler suggests it will last longer, but only prolonged controlled testing could prove it. I have not tested the Hyperion you mentioned but I have tested the Turnigy 3S2200 20C and was very impressed with the performance. At that price why not buy one and use them both under the same conditions, ensuring that you treat them equally and see how their lives compare.
It may well be that the Quality Control is inferior in the Turnigy, but we are only guessing. I think a bigger factor is that many suppliers charge customers what they can get away with on the pretext of selling them a "premium" brand.
Wayne

[barry wilson]

Originally Posted by SpookiePower

I have just bought my first Lipo, a Hyperion G3 CX - 3S 2100mAh (25C). In Denmark this battery cost 61$. Today I search through Hobbyking and found this Turnigy 2200mAh 3s 20c http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...(DE_Warehouse) for only 17.95 $ That's a pretty big different, compared to the Hyperion. I can see that the Turnigy is more heavy, and that the quality might be lower than Hyperion. But should I take more care, when using a Turnigy because of the lower quality ? What I mean is, can a Turnigy more easy catch fire or explode ?

The risk for fire or as you call it explosion. Explosion my mind is just a faster fire is probably about the same.

If you push both batteries to their absolute limits there might be less risk with the more expensive label. What to concern yourself about more in my opinion is how you are going to use a battery. If conservative it should last longer. Further reducing the already small risk of any bad episode occuring.

[outngo]

I have a 2s tunrigy 3000mah for a glider, seems ok.

[kevinb120]

Originally Posted by SpookiePower

I have just bought my first Lipo, a Hyperion G3 CX - 3S 2100mAh (25C). In Denmark this battery cost 61$. Today I search through Hobbyking and found this Turnigy 2200mAh 3s 20c http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...(DE_Warehouse) for only 17.95 $ That's a pretty big different, compared to the Hyperion. I can see that the Turnigy is more heavy, and that the quality might be lower than Hyperion. But should I take more care, when using a Turnigy because of the lower quality ? What I mean is, can a Turnigy more easy catch fire or explode ?

Nope, I think they are on par with a lot of expensive batteries I have(before finding HK). Just follow the recommended charging ratings (most are 2C) and the same low voltage precautions you would with any battery.

[Himalaya]

Originally Posted by kevinb120

Nope, I think they are on par with a lot of expensive batteries I have(before finding HK). Just follow the recommended charging ratings (most are 2C) and the same low voltage precautions you would with any battery.

Turnigy said they are going to print 5C charge on new labels once the old stickers are used out.

[RC Man]

I have a couple of the new 4s 5000 30C packs and they are the most powerful packs I have ever used. I charge them at 2C and it takes about 25 minutes after a typical flight. They are not hot after a flight so I can charge them right after the flight.



I don’t think that my charger has enough watts to charge at 5C.

[Jocke]

Been doing testing on HC Lipo and other low price brands, so far, with very bad results, as of today started test of the latest Rhinos, doasent look to good.... could someone of you HC guys recomend me a Lipo battery that is good!? brand, Crate, config, size?

Proove me wrong, and recomend me a good Lipo from HC!!!!

[Wayne Giles]

Originally Posted by Jocke

Been doing testing on HC Lipo and other low price brands, so far, with very bad results, as of today started test of the latest Rhinos, doasent look to good.... could someone of you HC guys recomend me a Lipo battery that is good!? brand, Crate, config, size?

Proove me wrong, and recomend me a good Lipo from HC!!!!

I am not an "HC Guy" but an independent tester of any Lipos. I am not supporting any side - Why does everybody have to be on one side or the other? All we want to do is to find out which lipos are the best performing and/or best value?

Try the 3S2200 25C Turnigy at http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s..._25C_Lipo_Pack
Its only $16.95 so you won't lose much. Post the results and we can compare them as I have already tested one.

Wayne

[everydayflyer]

Turnigy 25C and others here

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=88