XFC Nightfly Complete Embarrasment - Page 2

MCART · Jun 15, 2009, 04:41 PM

Here is the text from the XFC website:

In addition to an amazing Fireworks show at the end of the evening, imagine having the likes of Terry Hahn, Yuri Higuchi, Marcus Kim, Daniel Katzav, Jerry Smith and others dazzling you with a brilliant light and flying demo. But wait... there's more! Imagine the same show with pyrotechnics mounted on the planes and helis!!! That's right, PYROTECHNICS! With the assistance of the AMA Executive Council, the XFC will be setting new standards for night flying, while introducing a new element into the XFC. The AMA has had a long standing regulation that does not allow pyro equipment to be allowed on the aircraft. With new stringent regulations in place, this can now be achieved!

Was there a single airplane or helicopter with pyrotechnics mounted on the aircraft? No. Was there even a single airplane with lights mounted on it other than glow sticks? No.

This isn't just misleading. You cant make these claims just hoping that someone would show up with pyrotechnics mounted to the planes. This was hyping something that would take a while to setup and work out. Something that was happening for the first time ever.

Skaluf · Jun 15, 2009, 06:58 PM

Perhaps a few explanations (as I understand them) will help here.

First I've already apologized for a choice for one particular song that I evidently played. This had nothing to do with the competition, it was simply filler music. I picked the majority of the filler music from the ATF top 100 listing in an attempt to bring music that would apeal to the attedees (I'm old). This song has already been deleted from the record case, and I'll not make the same mistake twice.

I can understand why some may have been disappointed at the night fly. However, please understand the night fly and the team competition are the only part of the event that the XFC does not invite and get confirmations from the participants that they are attending. Both are open events that anyone showing up can fly in after approval from the XFC committee. A couple of "big names" had to withdraw at the last minute and this left a pretty big hole in that part of the event. It's unfortunate but it happens all of the time. I applaud the guys that answered the committees call and stepped up to fly (at the very last second) in the night fly.

It's important to remember that this is a model airplane competition, not a professional show produced for the sole entertainment of the crowd. Perhaps the XFC has risen to the level that it seems like it is an entertainment event (I know I'm very entertained by the entire event).

My hope is that you had a great time, despite a night fly that did not live up to expectations. I know I did eventhough I spent four days in a trailer playing music and could only see aircraft if they were below 10'!

If I know those involved in the organization of XFC, they are already figuring out how to avoid a similar issue for next year; and make the event better than ever.

Steve

XPO · Jun 15, 2009, 11:40 PM

I was a vendor there at the XFC. But just as well, I have been a modeler many times longer than an entrepreneur.

Although very tired after what was a work day for me, I stuck around till the very last firework, AND I am glad I did.

I approach this whole thing with humility and will never take away credit when credit is clearly due. The bottom line is that the folks there put out there best foot forward and the pilots present at the competition are idolized by me no matter who they are. After all, I can only achieve their skills in my wildest dreams...

The bottom line, I drove over nine hours to get there, had my fill as a vendor and as a spectator...and in the end saw amazing and talented folks taking our hobby to the next step and making our hobby what it is today.

I don't buy the next great aircraft because I want to own one, but rather because I want to be one tenth as good as those guys I saw there...

I have only great things to say and applaud the folks who put it all on for us. XFC - you can count on me coming next year. The weather was great, the food was great, the weekend was great and the people I met there and shook hands with were all awesome.

Bohica35 · Jun 16, 2009, 12:12 AM

First I'll introduce myself as the latest resident newb. So hello to all of you that surely know more about this stuff than I.

After reading this thread, I felt compelled to register and share my experiences at the XFC, from the eyes of a newcomer to the sport/hobby/whatever.

It's safe to say that I am an "outsider", and I'm not part of the RC aero clique. So I find it rather ironic that I am here to defend the event from it's own enthusiasts. I'm not here to contradict what anyone else has said. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I would just like to share MY opinions of the event.

I was not present Friday, so I cannot comment on that day. I arrived around noon on Saturday and stayed till close. I returned Sunday again around noon and stayed to the end.

Competition

I found the competition to be PHENOMINAL. I personally felt privileged that I was able to see the best pilots from all over the globe. I didn't count the countries, but I heard mention of pilots from Germany, Israel, Mexico, Puerto Rico, UK......I'm sure there are more that I forgot. For someone like myself that just tries not to crash......it was amazing to see guys performing maneauvers that seem to defy physics. I have been to a couple of fun flies and have seen some great pilots. Correct me if I'm wrong (my experience in the hobby is limited), but I found the lowest placing pilots to be leagues better than anyone I see locally. So it was a great opportunity. I definitely got some ideas of things I would like to learn, and will definitely be investing in a simulator. (I don't know anyone that could AFFORD to practice these things in real life)

The airplanes were great. It's cool to see such large models performing with such agility. I kept trying to imagine the G forces exerted on these things. It's a wonder they don't self destruct. (by the way I learned that they are not referred to as "airplanes", as I call them, but "fixed wing". So now I feel cool knowing the lingo)

I can't remember the names of all of the pilots, but Jason Knoll really stuck out to me. The patterns he flew seemed very sharp and almost perfectly geometric.

However, the helicopters blew my mind. These guys seemed to be pushing it to the very limit. The crashes are testament to how far they are pushing it.

I was also shocked at the young age of some of the pilots. Apparently the hours and hours of video games are paying off for these kids. Jaimie Roberts (I think 15 years old) was insane. And as the competition progressed you could really see the other pilots stepping up their game to compete with him.

Again, I don't remember all of the names, but Jaimie Roberts, "high voltage" Watts, the guy with the streamer thing (that was sick), and Justin Chi (sp?) all stuck out. That Justin Chi kid (6 years old!) was amazing. I can't imagine having that kind of persistance at that age. There were other guys that I made sure to watch after I saw their first flight, but regrettably I forget their names.

Perhaps I have strayed from the OP......

Music

This is probably the aspect that most prompted me to post.... I thought it was a good idea to have a live band. The "Boat Drunks" were good, and I thought the singer sounded a lot like Jimmy Buffet. I thought the live music broke up the monotony of watching flights for 9 hours straight. Good idea.

As for the now infamous song that has been mentioned several times in this thread.....Black Eyed Peas - My Humps.....that song is played on the radio. I had my young daughter with me, and was never uncomfortable. I don't know that she really listened to the words of any of the music. She danced and had fun all the same. As for the lyrics.....are they something I would want to read to my grandma? No. Were they innapropriate? Not any more inappropriate than any other song on the radio. I don't know if any of you take your kids to the pool, but listen to the music they play there. It's all about booty shaking. It's not my kind of music, but I think you would have to be pretty uptight to make a thread complaining about mention of the word "ass" or "breasts". Even so, if someone finds two little words inappropriate out of hours and hours of music.....that's a win. Seriously, tune your radio into a pop radio station for 9 hours straight. You might be surprised to find out that the kids aren't listening to Frank Sinatra all day.

Night Fly

Was the night fly over-billed? Perhaps. Was it entertaining? Absolutely. There were props, and an overabundance of pyrotechnics. Granted the helicopter flying with the pyro did crash, so the pyro went on after the crash. I don't fault the pilot for that. He was REALLY hanging it out, and when you do that, sometimes you crash. Things happen. (I enjoy crashes, so it was kind of a guilty pleasure for me anyway) I didn't find the lux level of the lights to be distracting at all. I know someone mentioned that they were dim....or whatever, but I had no problem seeing them.

Perhaps it is my inexperience showing, but I found it to be entertaining. And even if it someone considered it to be lacking, I thought of the night fly as kind of a novelty anyway. The main competition, was the clear draw. Complaining about having 4 night fly pilots instead of 7 is similar to complaining that Mick Jagger lip sync'd during the halftime at the super bowl. Only in this case, the super bowl lasted for three days straight instead of 1 hour.

Also, as noted earlier in this thread, the XFC seems to have already taken action to improve next year's nightfly by offering a $1,000 purse to the winner. I don't know what it takes to get into this competition, but I'm willing to detonate my airplane (sorry, fixed wing) in a fiery explosion if it will earn me $1k.

But something tells me that with that kind of money on the line, it might take more than that to win next year.

Fireworks

The fireworks display was very professional and very impressive. To be frank, I expected a lot of "off the shelf" type fireworks. That wasn't the case. These were BIG, BIG fireworks that rival most 4th of July displays. I think it was about 30 minutes long and given that we were sitting so close, the display was much better than most July 4th displays.

I know my wife, daughter, and I enjoyed them. Also, they gave out tons of freebie glow necklace thingies.

Value

After recently spending over $300 on two tickets to a Cirque du Soleil show, the entertainment value was astonishing to me. In a time when it costs me over $30 to take my wife and daughter to a stinking movie (not including refreshments) I think we got our money's worth. I don't know how the XFC can put on this caliber of a show for $7. For the cost of a Chipotle burrito, you can watch a whole day of elite, world class aerobatics, a live concert, a night fly, and a professional fireworks display. Hell, I regularly spend $5 on those glow necklaces for my daughter at various events. She got 4 of them for free. I saw other kids that were in 7th heaven with 10 or more of them. So we made our money back on glow necklaces alone!

As a bonus, I thought it was very cool to be able to walk through the "pits" or whatever they're called and look at the pro's setups. The pilots were all very friendly and were willing to talk. The general mood amongst pilots and fans alike was very fun-loving and upbeat. I walked away from the event with an overwhelmingly positive feeling about the hobby. I immediately started looking for the next event to go to, and I will DEFINITELY be back at XFC next year, and will probably take some friends along with me to introduce them to the hobby.

I respect the TS's opinion, but I think words like "complete embarassment" are a little overdramatic, and nitpicky. Not to mention counterproductive. I think it could have been worded a little more constructively.

I don't know how many people were at the event, but I would guess it was in the thousands. I saw probably 20 RVs, and probably as many tent campers. I think there were 40 international pilots total, not including the exhibition pilots, several vendors, giveaways, silent auctions........it just seems to me that a WHOLE lot of effort and planning went into a great event that seems to gain positive exposure for the hobby. This kind of nitpicking in such a public way seems like it could undue a lot of progress.

Luckily, from the vibe I got from the event, and the people I talked to, these opinions are in the vast minority. I know I can't wait until next year.

Kudos to the XFC!

As the new guy, I don't mean to offend anyone. Just my $.02

Dr. Sandy Frank · Jun 16, 2009, 08:16 AM

agreed !!!!

with the above 2...

MCART · Jun 16, 2009, 10:15 AM

Bohica35,
Welcome to RC Groups. Great thing about America is everyone is entitled to their own opinions!
Mike

Acefredbaron · Jun 16, 2009, 04:29 PM

I've been going to the XFC ever since it was held in Troy Ohio but this will be my last XFC. The problem wasn't the music alone. The problem was the timing. You just finished talking about the future of the hobby being our youth and children just comming up in the sport. You handed out kids toys and light rings so that every kid there was front and center and then you played music that was filled with sexually unacceptable lyrics for children. I saw more than a few people pick their kids up and leave before the fireworks even began. Is this really the image the AMA wants to promote to the public? If that is what you want to promote to our children next time hand out little pole dancer dolls and BK childrens booty meals so we'll know what to expect. I was also really impressed with the Futaba F.U. tee shirts. "Futaba put the F.U. in fun"? I think Futaba put the F.U. to the AMA and it's public relations. It's not like we don't have enough problems with public relations and the noise connected with the hobby without adding this kind of crap. Flying model aircraft was one of the last safe venues for our children to participate in and now even that has gone to dogs. I don't even want to get started on how the AMA and Futaba treated the JR and Horizon half of the hobby by not allowing them to market and promote their products. Didn't anyone wonder why there were no flags or booths or banners for JR? Yes I know, they could have come if they wanted to as long as they didn't fly any banners or flags with the scarlet letters on them. I saw that other RC products and manufacturers were allowed to pomote their products. In America we thrive on competitiion. Americans are not afraid to compete with fair rules applied to ALL the competition, not just the ones favored by those running the event! If the event was held at a private Futaba field I could understand it but it was held at the AMA world headquarters paid for by OUR AMA dues. My buddies and I drove many hours to see the state of the art night flying and could not have been more dissappointed. Next time the AMA ballot comes in the mail, I'm going to vote the bums out!!!

Skaluf · Jun 16, 2009, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acefredbaron

I've been going to the XFC ever since it was held in Troy Ohio but this will be my last XFC. The problem wasn't the music alone. The problem was the timing. You just finished talking about the future of the hobby being our youth and children just comming up in the sport. You handed out kids toys and light rings so that every kid there was front and center and then you played music that was filled with sexually unacceptable lyrics for children. I saw more than a few people pick their kids up and leave before the fireworks even began. Is this really the image the AMA wants to promote to the public? If that is what you want to promote to our children next time hand out little pole dancer dolls and BK childrens booty meals so we'll know what to expect. I was also really impressed with the Futaba F.U. tee shirts. "Futaba put the F.U. in fun"? I think Futaba put the F.U. to the AMA and it's public relations. It's not like we don't have enough problems with public relations and the noise connected with the hobby without adding this kind of crap. Flying model aircraft was one of the last safe venues for our children to participate in and now even that has gone to dogs. I don't even want to get started on how the AMA and Futaba treated the JR and Horizon half of the hobby by not allowing them to market and promote their products. Didn't anyone wonder why there were no flags or booths or banners for JR? Yes I know, they could have come if they wanted to as long as they didn't fly any banners or flags with the scarlet letters on them. I saw that other RC products and manufacturers were allowed to pomote their products. In America we thrive on competitiion. Americans are not afraid to compete with fair rules applied to ALL the competition, not just the ones favored by those running the event! If the event was held at a private Futaba field I could understand it but it was held at the AMA world headquarters paid for by OUR AMA dues. My buddies and I drove many hours to see the state of the art night flying and could not have been more dissappointed. Next time the AMA ballot comes in the mail, I'm going to vote the bums out!!!

The FU shirts had absolutely nothing to do with Futaba. They belonged to a team there.

Horizon Hobby most certainly was invited and most certainly could have flown their flags and banners as they have in the past. I suspect like most of us they too are feeling budget crunches.

barracudahockey · Jun 16, 2009, 05:16 PM

The GTO or Go Team Orange was a group of pilots and their families, they had/have nothing to do with Futaba.

As for the music, I wouldn't have known either. I've gotten crap at hockey games for the same thing. I try to find the music the kids are listening to, if I had to preview every word of those songs before hand I would have to drill a hole in my skull.

jbourke · Jun 16, 2009, 05:32 PM

I didn't hear or see anything at the XFC that I wouldn't encounter at a typical shopping mall, gas station, state fair, or any other public venue.

That might not make the scene acceptable to every parent, of course.

Jim

BladeMan · Jun 16, 2009, 05:49 PM

For what it's worth the wife and I had a great time. The price was affordable to get in, and the BBQ for $8 -great deal. The only thing I would change would be to have lights in the port-a-pot's. I had to go in with her and hold a flashlight... a new bonding experience for us...

Why can't the AMA have regular bathrooms? Probably $$$$

I would love to see next year an open fly (for all AMA members) in the dead time while waiting for it to get dark (just to have something in the air) I have a order in for some LED lights for my foam planes and yes, I have a 2.4 radio

My 2.5 cents - I will be there next year, Thanks for a good show!!! The kids loved the free glow sticks. And one more thing - How about some country music? Never any bad words.

xfc3dcd · Jun 16, 2009, 06:02 PM

I firmly believe and encourage everyone to express their constructive opinions about our event. We have solicited input from day one and it has been vital to evolving the XFC to its present form. I must admit I do get discouraged when the comments are false, harsh and mean spirited however. I don't know that all people realize that this is a volunteer effort and not a profit motivated one. The sole mission of the XFC has always been to promote and grow the sport of model aviation.

Obviously the world is made up of people with a wide range of sensibilities. Case in point, we had persons who traveled as far away as Alaska specifically to attend the XFC and enjoyed themselves. We have others who were local that felt misled and disappointed. What a surprise!

We won't always get it exactly right but we will always attempt to and we are fully capable of learning from our mistakes. For those who think we don't care about family values please read this verbatim quote from the XFC rulebook:

"Music

Obscene, vulgar or objectionable lyrics are not permitted and use of such will result in a zero score for the flight. Since the audience includes families and children, lyrics should be "PG" rated. Contact the Contest Director if unsure."

The XFC Committee implemented this rule unsolicited many years back. As Steve mentioned the "R" rated song played before the night fly was an honest mistake. I do find it somewhat amusing that those who object the loudest about issues of morals/values always assume they are intentional and are often the ones who are not capable of exercising the golden value called forgive and forget.

It is not XFC policy to threaten pilots with bodily harm should they cancel Night Fly attendance at the last minute due to crashes, loss of jobs, illness, family issues, etc. (all of which occurred by the way).

Regarding misinformation, I would like to correct some.

1. JR was asked to attend the event and provide banners, as in previous years, but declined for financial reasons. They were an event sponsor once again and to say their involvement is important and appreciated is a huge understatement.

2. Some people left after the night fly because they did not hear the announcement or otherwise knew that the regular fireworks were about to start immediately afterward.

3. The AMA has always emphasized the need for family values for the XFC and we agree. The event happens in real time and is supervised by four individuals. It gets larger every year and so can be a challenge to keep perfectly on track. Each year we have a long laundry list of corrections for the following year.

Overall we feel this was the best XFC to date. Sure the night fly with pyro stumbled out of the gate but just wait til next year!

Wendell Adkins
XFC Contest Director

Acefredbaron · Jun 16, 2009, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbourke

I didn't hear or see anything at the XFC that I wouldn't encounter at a typical shopping mall, gas station, state fair, or any other public venue.

That might not make the scene acceptable to every parent, of course.

Jim

Your right Jim. I just didn't expect to hear it over the loud speaker at a AMA event after a pitch about the future of the sport being our children. I don't think the language standard for the AMA should be the same as the standard for unsupervised teens at a mall and I'm not suggesting that it is. As for the JR, Horizon account, it happened in the past and that is why they are not there anymore. I stand by my account. Sorry if I offended anyone by being offended.
Thank God we can agree to disagree.

xfc3dcd · Jun 16, 2009, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acefredbaron

Your right Jim. I just didn't expect to hear it over the loud speaker at a AMA event after a pitch about the future of the sport being our children. I don't think the language standard for the AMA should be the same as the standard for unsupervised teens at a mall and I'm not suggesting that it is. As for the JR, Horizon account, it happened in the past and that is why they are not there anymore. I stand by my account. Sorry if I offended anyone by being offended.
Thank God we can agree to disagree.

So are you speaking on behalf of JR/Horizon?

Acefredbaron · Jun 16, 2009, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xfc3dcd

So are you speaking on behalf of JR/Horizon?

No, I am not connected with JR or Horizon in any way whatsoever. Just my opinion. Sorry if I have ruffeled any feathers. Best regards.

Jun 15, 2009, 04:41 PM	#16
MCART Watts happening? Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Waynesville, Ohio Posts: 154	Here is the text from the XFC website: In addition to an amazing Fireworks show at the end of the evening, imagine having the likes of Terry Hahn, Yuri Higuchi, Marcus Kim, Daniel Katzav, Jerry Smith and others dazzling you with a brilliant light and flying demo. But wait... there's more! Imagine the same show with pyrotechnics mounted on the planes and helis!!! That's right, PYROTECHNICS! With the assistance of the AMA Executive Council, the XFC will be setting new standards for night flying, while introducing a new element into the XFC. The AMA has had a long standing regulation that does not allow pyro equipment to be allowed on the aircraft. With new stringent regulations in place, this can now be achieved! Was there a single airplane or helicopter with pyrotechnics mounted on the aircraft? No. Was there even a single airplane with lights mounted on it other than glow sticks? No. This isn't just misleading. You cant make these claims just hoping that someone would show up with pyrotechnics mounted to the planes. This was hyping something that would take a while to setup and work out. Something that was happening for the first time ever. Last edited by MCART; Jun 15, 2009 at 04:51 PM.

Jun 15, 2009, 11:40 PM	#18
XPO Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 26	my thoughts on XFC I was a vendor there at the XFC. But just as well, I have been a modeler many times longer than an entrepreneur. Although very tired after what was a work day for me, I stuck around till the very last firework, AND I am glad I did. I approach this whole thing with humility and will never take away credit when credit is clearly due. The bottom line is that the folks there put out there best foot forward and the pilots present at the competition are idolized by me no matter who they are. After all, I can only achieve their skills in my wildest dreams... The bottom line, I drove over nine hours to get there, had my fill as a vendor and as a spectator...and in the end saw amazing and talented folks taking our hobby to the next step and making our hobby what it is today. I don't buy the next great aircraft because I want to own one, but rather because I want to be one tenth as good as those guys I saw there... I have only great things to say and applaud the folks who put it all on for us. XFC - you can count on me coming next year. The weather was great, the food was great, the weekend was great and the people I met there and shook hands with were all awesome.

Jun 16, 2009, 12:12 AM	#19
Bohica35 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 7	First I'll introduce myself as the latest resident newb. So hello to all of you that surely know more about this stuff than I. After reading this thread, I felt compelled to register and share my experiences at the XFC, from the eyes of a newcomer to the sport/hobby/whatever. It's safe to say that I am an "outsider", and I'm not part of the RC aero clique. So I find it rather ironic that I am here to defend the event from it's own enthusiasts. I'm not here to contradict what anyone else has said. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I would just like to share MY opinions of the event. I was not present Friday, so I cannot comment on that day. I arrived around noon on Saturday and stayed till close. I returned Sunday again around noon and stayed to the end. Competition I found the competition to be PHENOMINAL. I personally felt privileged that I was able to see the best pilots from all over the globe. I didn't count the countries, but I heard mention of pilots from Germany, Israel, Mexico, Puerto Rico, UK......I'm sure there are more that I forgot. For someone like myself that just tries not to crash......it was amazing to see guys performing maneauvers that seem to defy physics. I have been to a couple of fun flies and have seen some great pilots. Correct me if I'm wrong (my experience in the hobby is limited), but I found the lowest placing pilots to be leagues better than anyone I see locally. So it was a great opportunity. I definitely got some ideas of things I would like to learn, and will definitely be investing in a simulator. (I don't know anyone that could AFFORD to practice these things in real life) The airplanes were great. It's cool to see such large models performing with such agility. I kept trying to imagine the G forces exerted on these things. It's a wonder they don't self destruct. (by the way I learned that they are not referred to as "airplanes", as I call them, but "fixed wing". So now I feel cool knowing the lingo) I can't remember the names of all of the pilots, but Jason Knoll really stuck out to me. The patterns he flew seemed very sharp and almost perfectly geometric. However, the helicopters blew my mind. These guys seemed to be pushing it to the very limit. The crashes are testament to how far they are pushing it. I was also shocked at the young age of some of the pilots. Apparently the hours and hours of video games are paying off for these kids. Jaimie Roberts (I think 15 years old) was insane. And as the competition progressed you could really see the other pilots stepping up their game to compete with him. Again, I don't remember all of the names, but Jaimie Roberts, "high voltage" Watts, the guy with the streamer thing (that was sick), and Justin Chi (sp?) all stuck out. That Justin Chi kid (6 years old!) was amazing. I can't imagine having that kind of persistance at that age. There were other guys that I made sure to watch after I saw their first flight, but regrettably I forget their names. Perhaps I have strayed from the OP...... Music This is probably the aspect that most prompted me to post.... I thought it was a good idea to have a live band. The "Boat Drunks" were good, and I thought the singer sounded a lot like Jimmy Buffet. I thought the live music broke up the monotony of watching flights for 9 hours straight. Good idea. As for the now infamous song that has been mentioned several times in this thread.....Black Eyed Peas - My Humps.....that song is played on the radio. I had my young daughter with me, and was never uncomfortable. I don't know that she really listened to the words of any of the music. She danced and had fun all the same. As for the lyrics.....are they something I would want to read to my grandma? No. Were they innapropriate? Not any more inappropriate than any other song on the radio. I don't know if any of you take your kids to the pool, but listen to the music they play there. It's all about booty shaking. It's not my kind of music, but I think you would have to be pretty uptight to make a thread complaining about mention of the word "ass" or "breasts". Even so, if someone finds two little words inappropriate out of hours and hours of music.....that's a win. Seriously, tune your radio into a pop radio station for 9 hours straight. You might be surprised to find out that the kids aren't listening to Frank Sinatra all day. Night Fly Was the night fly over-billed? Perhaps. Was it entertaining? Absolutely. There were props, and an overabundance of pyrotechnics. Granted the helicopter flying with the pyro did crash, so the pyro went on after the crash. I don't fault the pilot for that. He was REALLY hanging it out, and when you do that, sometimes you crash. Things happen. (I enjoy crashes, so it was kind of a guilty pleasure for me anyway) I didn't find the lux level of the lights to be distracting at all. I know someone mentioned that they were dim....or whatever, but I had no problem seeing them. Perhaps it is my inexperience showing, but I found it to be entertaining. And even if it someone considered it to be lacking, I thought of the night fly as kind of a novelty anyway. The main competition, was the clear draw. Complaining about having 4 night fly pilots instead of 7 is similar to complaining that Mick Jagger lip sync'd during the halftime at the super bowl. Only in this case, the super bowl lasted for three days straight instead of 1 hour. Also, as noted earlier in this thread, the XFC seems to have already taken action to improve next year's nightfly by offering a $1,000 purse to the winner. I don't know what it takes to get into this competition, but I'm willing to detonate my airplane (sorry, fixed wing) in a fiery explosion if it will earn me $1k. But something tells me that with that kind of money on the line, it might take more than that to win next year. Fireworks The fireworks display was very professional and very impressive. To be frank, I expected a lot of "off the shelf" type fireworks. That wasn't the case. These were BIG, BIG fireworks that rival most 4th of July displays. I think it was about 30 minutes long and given that we were sitting so close, the display was much better than most July 4th displays. I know my wife, daughter, and I enjoyed them. Also, they gave out tons of freebie glow necklace thingies. Value After recently spending over $300 on two tickets to a Cirque du Soleil show, the entertainment value was astonishing to me. In a time when it costs me over $30 to take my wife and daughter to a stinking movie (not including refreshments) I think we got our money's worth. I don't know how the XFC can put on this caliber of a show for $7. For the cost of a Chipotle burrito, you can watch a whole day of elite, world class aerobatics, a live concert, a night fly, and a professional fireworks display. Hell, I regularly spend $5 on those glow necklaces for my daughter at various events. She got 4 of them for free. I saw other kids that were in 7th heaven with 10 or more of them. So we made our money back on glow necklaces alone! As a bonus, I thought it was very cool to be able to walk through the "pits" or whatever they're called and look at the pro's setups. The pilots were all very friendly and were willing to talk. The general mood amongst pilots and fans alike was very fun-loving and upbeat. I walked away from the event with an overwhelmingly positive feeling about the hobby. I immediately started looking for the next event to go to, and I will DEFINITELY be back at XFC next year, and will probably take some friends along with me to introduce them to the hobby. I respect the TS's opinion, but I think words like "complete embarassment" are a little overdramatic, and nitpicky. Not to mention counterproductive. I think it could have been worded a little more constructively. I don't know how many people were at the event, but I would guess it was in the thousands. I saw probably 20 RVs, and probably as many tent campers. I think there were 40 international pilots total, not including the exhibition pilots, several vendors, giveaways, silent auctions........it just seems to me that a WHOLE lot of effort and planning went into a great event that seems to gain positive exposure for the hobby. This kind of nitpicking in such a public way seems like it could undue a lot of progress. Luckily, from the vibe I got from the event, and the people I talked to, these opinions are in the vast minority. I know I can't wait until next year. Kudos to the XFC! As the new guy, I don't mean to offend anyone. Just my $.02 Last edited by Bohica35; Jun 16, 2009 at 12:23 AM.

Jun 16, 2009, 06:02 PM	#27
xfc3dcd Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 34	I firmly believe and encourage everyone to express their constructive opinions about our event. We have solicited input from day one and it has been vital to evolving the XFC to its present form. I must admit I do get discouraged when the comments are false, harsh and mean spirited however. I don't know that all people realize that this is a volunteer effort and not a profit motivated one. The sole mission of the XFC has always been to promote and grow the sport of model aviation. Obviously the world is made up of people with a wide range of sensibilities. Case in point, we had persons who traveled as far away as Alaska specifically to attend the XFC and enjoyed themselves. We have others who were local that felt misled and disappointed. What a surprise! We won't always get it exactly right but we will always attempt to and we are fully capable of learning from our mistakes. For those who think we don't care about family values please read this verbatim quote from the XFC rulebook: "Music Obscene, vulgar or objectionable lyrics are not permitted and use of such will result in a zero score for the flight. Since the audience includes families and children, lyrics should be "PG" rated. Contact the Contest Director if unsure." The XFC Committee implemented this rule unsolicited many years back. As Steve mentioned the "R" rated song played before the night fly was an honest mistake. I do find it somewhat amusing that those who object the loudest about issues of morals/values always assume they are intentional and are often the ones who are not capable of exercising the golden value called forgive and forget. It is not XFC policy to threaten pilots with bodily harm should they cancel Night Fly attendance at the last minute due to crashes, loss of jobs, illness, family issues, etc. (all of which occurred by the way). Regarding misinformation, I would like to correct some. 1. JR was asked to attend the event and provide banners, as in previous years, but declined for financial reasons. They were an event sponsor once again and to say their involvement is important and appreciated is a huge understatement. 2. Some people left after the night fly because they did not hear the announcement or otherwise knew that the regular fireworks were about to start immediately afterward. 3. The AMA has always emphasized the need for family values for the XFC and we agree. The event happens in real time and is supervised by four individuals. It gets larger every year and so can be a challenge to keep perfectly on track. Each year we have a long laundry list of corrections for the following year. Overall we feel this was the best XFC to date. Sure the night fly with pyro stumbled out of the gate but just wait til next year! Wendell Adkins XFC Contest Director Last edited by xfc3dcd; Jun 16, 2009 at 06:07 PM.

Jun 15, 2009, 06:58 PM	#17
Skaluf Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Sadorus, IL Posts: 139	Perhaps a few explanations (as I understand them) will help here. First I've already apologized for a choice for one particular song that I evidently played. This had nothing to do with the competition, it was simply filler music. I picked the majority of the filler music from the ATF top 100 listing in an attempt to bring music that would apeal to the attedees (I'm old). This song has already been deleted from the record case, and I'll not make the same mistake twice. I can understand why some may have been disappointed at the night fly. However, please understand the night fly and the team competition are the only part of the event that the XFC does not invite and get confirmations from the participants that they are attending. Both are open events that anyone showing up can fly in after approval from the XFC committee. A couple of "big names" had to withdraw at the last minute and this left a pretty big hole in that part of the event. It's unfortunate but it happens all of the time. I applaud the guys that answered the committees call and stepped up to fly (at the very last second) in the night fly. It's important to remember that this is a model airplane competition, not a professional show produced for the sole entertainment of the crowd. Perhaps the XFC has risen to the level that it seems like it is an entertainment event (I know I'm very entertained by the entire event). My hope is that you had a great time, despite a night fly that did not live up to expectations. I know I did eventhough I spent four days in a trailer playing music and could only see aircraft if they were below 10'! If I know those involved in the organization of XFC, they are already figuring out how to avoid a similar issue for next year; and make the event better than ever. Steve

Jun 16, 2009, 08:16 AM	#20
Dr. Sandy Frank Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Muncie,IN 47304 USA Posts: 547	agreed !!!! with the above 2...

Jun 16, 2009, 10:15 AM	#21
MCART Watts happening? Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Waynesville, Ohio Posts: 154	Bohica35, Welcome to RC Groups. Great thing about America is everyone is entitled to their own opinions! Mike

Jun 16, 2009, 04:29 PM	#22
Acefredbaron Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: New Lebanon, Ohio Posts: 27	I've been going to the XFC ever since it was held in Troy Ohio but this will be my last XFC. The problem wasn't the music alone. The problem was the timing. You just finished talking about the future of the hobby being our youth and children just comming up in the sport. You handed out kids toys and light rings so that every kid there was front and center and then you played music that was filled with sexually unacceptable lyrics for children. I saw more than a few people pick their kids up and leave before the fireworks even began. Is this really the image the AMA wants to promote to the public? If that is what you want to promote to our children next time hand out little pole dancer dolls and BK childrens booty meals so we'll know what to expect. I was also really impressed with the Futaba F.U. tee shirts. "Futaba put the F.U. in fun"? I think Futaba put the F.U. to the AMA and it's public relations. It's not like we don't have enough problems with public relations and the noise connected with the hobby without adding this kind of crap. Flying model aircraft was one of the last safe venues for our children to participate in and now even that has gone to dogs. I don't even want to get started on how the AMA and Futaba treated the JR and Horizon half of the hobby by not allowing them to market and promote their products. Didn't anyone wonder why there were no flags or booths or banners for JR? Yes I know, they could have come if they wanted to as long as they didn't fly any banners or flags with the scarlet letters on them. I saw that other RC products and manufacturers were allowed to pomote their products. In America we thrive on competitiion. Americans are not afraid to compete with fair rules applied to ALL the competition, not just the ones favored by those running the event! If the event was held at a private Futaba field I could understand it but it was held at the AMA world headquarters paid for by OUR AMA dues. My buddies and I drove many hours to see the state of the art night flying and could not have been more dissappointed. Next time the AMA ballot comes in the mail, I'm going to vote the bums out!!!

Jun 16, 2009, 05:16 PM	#24
barracudahockey Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Jacksonville Craig, Florida, United States Posts: 1,241	The GTO or Go Team Orange was a group of pilots and their families, they had/have nothing to do with Futaba. As for the music, I wouldn't have known either. I've gotten crap at hockey games for the same thing. I try to find the music the kids are listening to, if I had to preview every word of those songs before hand I would have to drill a hole in my skull.

Jun 16, 2009, 05:32 PM	#25
jbourke Administrator Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Corvallis, Oregon, United States Posts: 4,419	I didn't hear or see anything at the XFC that I wouldn't encounter at a typical shopping mall, gas station, state fair, or any other public venue. That might not make the scene acceptable to every parent, of course. Jim

Jun 16, 2009, 05:49 PM	#26
BladeMan Nuke em and lets fly... Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 84	For what it's worth the wife and I had a great time. The price was affordable to get in, and the BBQ for $8 -great deal. The only thing I would change would be to have lights in the port-a-pot's. I had to go in with her and hold a flashlight... a new bonding experience for us... Why can't the AMA have regular bathrooms? Probably $$$$ I would love to see next year an open fly (for all AMA members) in the dead time while waiting for it to get dark (just to have something in the air) I have a order in for some LED lights for my foam planes and yes, I have a 2.4 radio My 2.5 cents - I will be there next year, Thanks for a good show!!! The kids loved the free glow sticks. And one more thing - How about some country music? Never any bad words.