Poll How many people ran Fasst versus Spektrum

[NoFlyZone]

Originally Posted by ekotil

RC Report is no longer available as a written monthly magazine but it is still available on-line. It was the most un-biased and truthful RC publication there was. Two of their biggest advertisers were Tower and Horizon. One sells one 2.4 and the other sells the other one! Unfortunately telling it like it is was their un-doing. Check what we have left in RC magazines. They basically report that they like everything they test.

"I never met a man I didn't like." - Will Rogers, American humorist.

"I never reviewed a free plane I didn't like." - RC plane reviewer; any.

Chuck

[GD5015]

Originally Posted by ekotil

RC Report is no longer available as a written monthly magazine but it is still available on-line. It was the most un-biased and truthful RC publication there was. Two of their biggest advertisers were Tower and Horizon. One sells one 2.4 and the other sells the other one! Unfortunately telling it like it is was their un-doing. Check what we have left in RC magazines. They basically report that they like everything they test.

There is no such thing as unbiased when you depend on advertising dollars to stay in business. That's just the way it works. If they review one of their main advertisers biggest products and pan it, you can't tell me they didn't know what was coming. Sounds like maybe a little tit-for-tat.

John

[going4speed]

This is like trying to read a womans mind

Originally Posted by sonicjet

I'll put it this way,it was the competitor of their big sponsor.

[going4speed]

I find this test interesting as I did have longer boot times than normal.

I have to wonder if this was caused by the receiver. This receiver I used had been in a rather severe crash and later caused the crash of a newer plane.

There may be something to using a reciever that has been subjected to an unsubstantiated g load.

This may be a good one to send to horizon for a look see

Originally Posted by flieslikeabeagle

All 2.4 GHz systems are NOT the same. It makes no sense to speak of "these 2.4 GHz systems". Each manufacturers systems are different, and some are based on much better engineering than others. Some will fail, some will not, with multiple units operating in close proximity.

Some brands (Assan, Corona) have neither redundant channels nor frequency agility, and have been tested and shown to fail dismally in the presence of high levels of 2.4 GHz RF (I posted links to tests earlier). XPS systems apparently also fail spectacularly in these conditions.

However, as it happens, there has been some well documented third-party testing of this issue (performance with multiple other RC systems turned on simultaneously). The testing was done on Spektrum/JR DSM2 systems. I quote from a series of tests performed by Cal Orr and later published in Fly RC magazine:

There you have it. Third party testing of Spektrum systems found NO increase in latency, NO lost frames for the AR 9100 and only a few lost ones for the other receiver, and NO holds at all, in the presence of forty other DSM systems operating at the same time.

Similar testing was also performed by Cal Orr with 20 DSM systems and 20 "other" 2.4 GHz systems simultaneously turned on in the near vicinity of the JR system under test. The same results were obtained.

See attached screenshot of the magazine article, also available online here:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Articles...ID=1789&Page=2

-Flieslikeabeagle

[theKM]

Originally Posted by flieslikeabeagle

There are also technical issues regarding Spektrum's use of multiple receivers to minimize the chance of RF shadowing, and the question of FHSS vs DSSS spread-spectrum technology.

...man, the first time I saw an ad for their "extra Rx's" deal, I cracked up. "Our stuff is so solid you need to multiply your investment to get a good setup you can actually rely on". Single box was all that was needed during all those 72mhz years, now they're trying to spin that they're awesome because you can plug in extra Rx units. What a joke. Funny to read though.

[theKM]

Originally Posted by flieslikeabeagle

Or...

(the post is above)

...I was flying with a Futaba transmitter (a 7CAP, to be exact).

-Flieslikeabeagle

I like empirical results, like the posts linked out of this post here... http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=510

Public relations aside, I think that saying "Spektrum's technology is better" would be a silly statement given the information at hand. If it was superior and did everything that it promised, there would have been less DSM2 issues at SEFF including low voltage problems that apparently everyone likes to say is user error.

[aeajr]

Originally Posted by theKM

...man, the first time I saw an ad for their "extra Rx's" deal, I cracked up. "Our stuff is so solid you need to multiply your investment to get a good setup you can actually rely on". Single box was all that was needed during all those 72mhz years, now they're trying to spin that they're awesome because you can plug in extra Rx units. What a joke. Funny to read though.

Perhaps you had not taken into consideration that it is much easier to block/mask a 31mm antenna as compared to a 39 inch antenna.

Give it some thought and you will see the difference.

[aeajr]

Originally Posted by theKM

I like empirical results, like the posts linked out of this post here... http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=510

Public relations aside, I think that saying "Spektrum's technology is better" would be a silly statement given the information at hand. If it was superior and did everything that it promised, there would have been less DSM2 issues at SEFF including low voltage problems that apparently everyone likes to say is user error.

Low voltage IS user error.

If DSM2 didn't represent 80% of the radio systems present then there would also have been less reports. More people, more systems in use, more chances of a report. Of course many of those reports could be caused by something other than the radio.

There were probably very few reports of problems with Hobby City 2.4 systems. Of course there were probably very few of them there, if any.

[theKM]

I don't think that "but there were so many more of them and it's just a numbers game" and user error explains all of this particular story. So many people had problems that just never had problems before. And finding a DSM2 user that had an issue was easy to find because the problem was more prevalent outside of just x% of users will have issues on the day. I haven't heard of a FASST user being hit outside of explained circumstances but yet friend of mine was smashed on DSM2 when I was standing next to him and a few other times throughout SEFF when I wasn't there.

[GD5015]

Originally Posted by theKM

I don't think that "but there were so many more of them and it's just a numbers game" and user error explains all of this particular story. So many people had problems that just never had problems before. And finding a DSM2 user that had an issue was easy to find because the problem was more prevalent outside of just x% of users will have issues on the day. I haven't heard of a FASST user being hit outside of explained circumstances but yet friend of mine was smashed on DSM2 when I was standing next to him and a few other times throughout SEFF when I wasn't there.

Well since you haven't heard of it happening, we should close the book. FASST is the winner hands down.

That was a silly statement.

John

[WTFLYR]

Originally Posted by David Hogue

I had a horrible experience with Futball's service just prior to 1991, with a brand new receiver that had an intermittent issue. That rx model gained a rep for problems, which Futaba never acknoledged and did not fix for me under warranty because I did not fly the system until 6 months after I bought it. Back then there werent many arfs, you had to build just about everything...well that plane(Ace 4-40) was destroyed. Sent the radio in, they charged me 75.00 to tell me they found nothing wrong.

Sounds like a case of:

Originally Posted by WTFLYR

"Let's see, turn on the prototype transmitter, servo moves, It's for sale!!!"

No brand bias intended, just can't pass up these cases.

Charging $75 bucks to tell you nothing is wrong, sounds like telling you to NEVER send anything in period.
While Horizon, HP, and others are not "brands", service is an issue.

[Wrend]

The FASST system seems slightly more reliable than other 2.4 radios to me, hopping frequencies every 2 milliseconds. Even if there was an interference problem, it would be so short lived that it would be unnoticeable. I have a Futaba 6EX radio, and have never had any problems with it at all. It has a nice and low current drain of 170mA, and with the 2000mAh rated Eneloop hybrid NiMH batteries I use in it, I get a continuous run time of a little over twelve and a half hours. I mostly just fly WWI biplanes and the like, so I don't need too many channels.

[Whiptail11]

Originally Posted by Wrend

The FASST system seems slightly more reliable than other 2.4 radios to me, hopping frequencies every 2 milliseconds. Even if there was an interference problem, it would be so short lived that it would be unnoticeable. I have a Futaba 6EX radio, and have never had any problems with it at all. It has a nice and low current drain of 170mA, and with the 2000mAh rated Eneloop hybrid NiMH batteries I use in it, I get a continuous run time of a little over twelve and a half hours. I mostly just fly WWI biplanes and the like, so I don't need too many channels.

I noticed that you have a 6ex. I would like to change to a 2.4 gig Futaba 6ex to use with my Hanger 9 Arrow trainer. This is my first plane BTW. If I install the Futaba receiver in the plane will the JR servos plug into the Futaba reciever?

[aeajr]

Yes,

JR servos will plug into all but the Futaba micro 2.4 receiver. That has different plugs, but you would not likely use that one in your Arrow.

[aeajr]

We seem to have gotten away from the Topic. This thread is supposed to be about what happend at SEFF.

Have we played that out? If so, we probably should have the thread closed.