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Old Jul 17, 2011, 02:36 PM
Voices through wires? Ha!
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John, your engine looks modern because it was cutting edge glow design in 1990! That's the Irvine 20 glow crankcase; the crankshaft was altered by reducing the gas passage diameter to 7mm id (thus strengthening the crank) and the timing changed to meet the anticipated diesel rpm's (opens later, close much earlier than the Glow)...glow peaked at 23000 !!! ...PGFC (poor guy!) says the Diesel should perform thusly...

7x4 19,100
8x6 13,900
9x4 14,200
9x6 12,300
10x6 10,500
11x6 8,900

showing that the diesel does have the torque. The Glow model fell to 10,200 on the 10x6 and 8,600 on the 11x6. That extra 300 rpm requires a BHP increase approaching 30% ! They say you could even get 8,500 on an 11x7 out of the diesel, still useful power at 60mph pitch speed.

The Diesel used a jetstream carb, 5mm choke diameter, which appears to be what you have there.

It figures that DDD would recommend pressure, as most of their heads would be used on Big Bore glow conversions.

I guess the CS prices are up not because of Unions and pensions in China, but because of the flaccid US $ ; Republicans take note!
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Old Jul 17, 2011, 08:32 PM
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Thanks Chas. Keeping your info in mind, I'll never go below a 9 x6 prop, and probably use a 10x6. My glow .21's seem happy on 8x6. My old Frog 3.5 would chug along on a 12 x4 and carry a 6 ft wing with 5 lb of load.
John
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 02:02 AM
Voices through wires? Ha!
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Great stuff John...how strange you should have the very engine which just popped up in the thread!..there aren't that many of them about now.

Her Indoors is asleep and I have therefore nothing to do, so wondered if you would like a great little synopsis by PGFC.

"The first significant challenge to the traditional spark-ignition model petrol engine came in 1941, in the shape of the 2cc Dyno-1 compression ignition (diesel) motor, manufactured in Switzerland. The development and production of such engines progressed through most of the rest of the Continent (including France, Italy, Germany and Scandinavia) during the Second World War.

This considerable European activity, taking place at a time when much of the Continent was cut off by the German Occupation, remained largely unknown to the rest of the world until the end of the war in 1945 but then things moved quickly. The first quantity- produced British model diesel, the original 1.3cc Mills, appeared in 1946. Over the next few months, several British and American diesels followed - all before the announcement, at the end of 1947, of the original (Arden) glowplug. The latter was offered as an optional ignition system for the Arden .099 and .199 cu.in. spark-ignition motors that had been introduced in the previous year.

Readers are reminded of these facts simply to set the record straight, in view of a recent article published elsewhere , in which it was stated that model diesel production had been 'halted' by the War and that, as a result, glowplug engines had a 'start' of about six years.

In truth, the boot was very much on the other foot, diesels having been under way for six years prior to the introduction of the glowplug. Diesel production made immense progress in the early post-war period, particularly in the UK where almost every manufacturer (Mills, E.D., Amco, Davies-Charlton, Allbon, Elfin etc.) elected to build diesels instead of spark-ignition engines.

In America, the spark-ignition engine had been developed to a much higher level than in Europe and, although diesels appeared on the US market before the advent of the glowplug, they had a much harder nut to crack, especially so in the larger capacity classes. Powerful 5-10cc engines were much in demand in the US to cope with the rapidly increasing popularity of control-line stunt and speed flying. No diesel could compete with the likes of the spark-ignition Atwoods, Super-Cyclones, Anderson-Spitfires, Hornets, McCoys, Doolings etc. of the time.

When the Arden glowplug appeared, American modellers, anxious to discard ignition-coils, condensers, contact-breakers and airborne batteries, lost no time in trying it out in engines other than Ardens. In 1948 there was a wholesale conversion to glowplug ignition in the US. Engines which were not 100% successful on 'glow' were simply rejected in favour of ones that were. Engine manufacturers were forced, willy-nilly, to modify existing engines, or to introduce new models, to stay in business. Many other makes and grades of glowplugs appeared. Before the year was out, spark-ignition had become obsolete and American interest in diesels evaporated.

The diesel was too well established elsewhere to be abandoned so readily but, because so many previous American innovations had successfully crossed the Atlantic over the years (balsawood construction, practical, lightweight model i.c. engines, control-line models, and now the first stirrings of radio control) it was inevitable that glowplugs would follow.

These were the days when import controls, imposed by the post-war British Government, prevented the sale of American model goods in the UK, so a few British engine manufacturers tried glow conversion of existing diesels [].
E.D. introduced their 2.5cc 'Mk III' with interchangeable diesel and glow heads. It was not successful. Alan Allbon produced a 1.5cc glowplug engine, the 'Arrow', but found it made a much better diesel, the 'Javelin'. The Amco 3.5 also appeared in a glow version. It was less vicious to handle than the diesel original and broke fewer parts, but offered no extra performance.

The first successful British glowplug engines were designed as such. The 5cc Yulon 30 showed the way in C/L aerobatics and won the 1949 British Nationals stunt event. The more specialised Eta 29 followed the classic spark/glow, disc-valve, crossflow scavenged, ringed piston racing engine layout of the period and, in successively improved versions, was competetive for many years.

Diesels, however, remained the No.1 choice for most British modellers. Diesels were at their best in the under 3.5cc capacities and these were the very sizes that suited the ordinary UK modeller at the time. Subsequently, the FAI's adoption of the 2.5cc limit for World Championship class free-flight and C/L Team Racing events, was responsible for diesels reaching the peak of their development, first in free-flight, through the 1950's with, most notably, the highly-respected Oliver Tiger, then in C/L team racing and combat. Of more recent times, diesels have had their greatest successes as specialist built FAI team-racing engines, where superior fuel economy, allied to the highest-ever levels of diesel performance, have established the 2.5cc racing diesel in a class of its own.

In 1953, no doubt impressed by the popularity, outside the USA, of diesels in the smallest capacity classes, two well-established American factories, Duro-Matic Products in California (McCoy Engines) and Herkimer Tool and Model Works in New York (OK Cub engines) took another look at diesels. They each came up with interesting baby diesels which, at the time, seemed to herald the beginning of a second generation of American diesels.

These were the McCoy .049 and .09 diesels and the O.K. Cub .049 and .075 diesels..... Instead of having the usual type of contra-piston lapped to the cylinder for a gas tight fit, the McCoy and Cub contra-pistons were equipped with heatproof O-ring seals. The Cub was also fitted with a novel 'shock-absorber' to soften the mechanical effects of the model diesel's 'detonation ignition' process. This device consisted of a substantial steel spring 'spider' between the compression-screw and the top of the contra-piston. One has to say, from experience, that the Cub 074, in particular, performed well on test, running with commendable steadiness and with noticeably improved smoothness.".

Long-winded, and a helluva-lotta-hyphens, but an interesting perspective on the birth of the diesel. I love that spring spider idea...could work with any modern diesel.
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by earlwb View Post
Do post some pics. Nice find. Is it like one of the Valentine Reproductions?
ref http://www.ronald-valentine-engines....5_DR_Mk_I.html
You know, I never thought about using a fuel tank pressure tap straight off the exhaust port on the engine before.
I wonder how well that worked on generating a little fuel tank pressure.



Here are the pics of the Paul Bugl I promised. There's a picture of some typewritten text by Paul I can scan that properly and mail it if there's interest. There is one nice quote by Paul : ' a fuel for team racing is a compromise of power economie and best starting ' end of quote. There is one pic that shows the classic trick of the day shaved-off exhaust that there is some thread left of where once was a nipple, and I agree that this was ment for an epos kick start rather than a pressure nipple.
Paul advised a Bartels 7 x 71/2 type Drazec. Precise reworked. Voilą.
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 07:21 AM
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Bugl
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 07:24 AM
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more pics of the Bugl
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Chas View Post
Long-winded, and a helluva-lotta-hyphens, but an interesting perspective on the birth of the diesel.
A great post, thank you!
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 10:46 AM
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That is a nice Bugl engine. I think the box is even better and sort of steals the show from the engine.
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 05:55 PM
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Chas- good info. Really too bad it has all but disappeared. I can't remember whether or not I have the OK .074 diesel, but I do have a glow marine with "pull start". And I even used it one summer.
Reginald, very nice Bugl diesel. Is that a fuel shut off at the back?
Any "specs" on performance with props/rpm?
John
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnAV8R View Post
Chas- good info. Really too bad it has all but disappeared. I can't remember whether or not I have the OK .074 diesel, but I do have a glow marine with "pull start". And I even used it one summer.
Reginald, very nice Bugl diesel. Is that a fuel shut off at the back?
Any "specs" on performance with props/rpm?
John
Here are all the documents that came with the engine. I have never done this type of racing, I have met the Metkemeyer brothers once at a contest in Holland. I would have to start serious reading about how these engines work and all the little secrets. I bought the engine because I admire the workmanship, someone not familiar with the finesses of a diesel would'nt give a penny. My friend Harry was on the same level as Paul. He sadly did have a drinking problem, Paul that is. Seem to remember that is what killed him. I must have some pictures somewhere of his shop, he had a revolving lathe I remember.
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Reginald View Post
Here are all the documents that came with the engine. I have never done this type of racing, I have met the Metkemeyer brothers once at a contest in Holland. I would have to start serious reading about how these engines work and all the little secrets. I bought the engine because I admire the workmanship, someone not familiar with the finesses of a diesel would'nt give a penny. My friend Harry was on the same level as Paul. He sadly did have a drinking problem, Paul that is. Seem to remember that is what killed him. I must have some pictures somewhere of his shop, he had a revolving lathe I remember.
Bugl
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 08:20 PM
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Thanks Reginald. That’s a very rare find. And the paper work to go with it. All excellent material. That Bugl is a very unique racing diesel.
The power curve is around .65 hp at 20 to 21 k rpm.
Maybe someone can help us out with the rear intake set up.
There doesn’t appear to be rotor or drum intake, but an air way up to and around the cylinder lower intake area.

Does anyone have pictures of their team racers, old and or new?

John
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 08:34 PM
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John, the intake on the Bugyl was his unique bell valve. It was a very thin walled drum that was fixed to the crank pin for drive and location and fitted over the backplate where that extended into the engine. The bell had a timing hole through which the fuel/air mix passed into the engine. The clearances from the backplate were very small and a special tool was needed for assembly of the engine so that the bell did not touch anything. I hope that is understandable. BTW The little end of the conrod is also very clever and unique in its design.

Charlie
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 09:04 PM
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John, I have some pictures of my vintage team racers if that is what you want to see.
Charlie
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 09:22 PM
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Details of the Bugl can be seen here.

http://modelenginenews.org/cardfile/gp2.html

Greg
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