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Old Oct 15, 2009, 03:42 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
Got ya, let me know how you see it when you fly. I don't immediately see how you get get this plane at 14oz. But maybe with a small motor, light servos, and a 750mah pack you could get there. I did not weight the airframe or individual components as I put them in there. What is Mark's plane all up weight?
He said he was a bit under the suggested weight, but didn't shoot any details. I have a Digital Paint mixing scale that has the capacity for 5000 grams. I will scale out all the parts and see how this thing weighs out.

What servos and RX are you using weight wise?
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 04:29 PM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
He said he was a bit under the suggested weight, but didn't shoot any details. I have a Digital Paint mixing scale that has the capacity for 5000 grams. I will scale out all the parts and see how this thing weighs out.

What servos and RX are you using weight wise?
HXT900's x 4 @ .32oz each, 1.28oz total
Rx Spektrum 6100, very light 3.5g (0.125oz)

Motor is not significantly heavy (2.1oz), esc is 0.8oz

Basically battery is 50% of the additional component weight therefore primary focus should be there for weight savings. But I can still only shave 1oz by dropping to a 1000mah pack. I will keep working on it, I have no complaint re flight and I can elevator to ground nicely.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 05:58 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
HXT900's x 4 @ .32oz each, 1.28oz total
Rx Spektrum 6100, very light 3.5g (0.125oz)

Motor is not significantly heavy (2.1oz), esc is 0.8oz

Basically battery is 50% of the additional component weight therefore primary focus should be there for weight savings. But I can still only shave 1oz by dropping to a 1000mah pack. I will keep working on it, I have no complaint re flight and I can elevator to ground nicely.
No Question, the planes do very well with the heavier lipos, there are plenty of them here that prove that, in some outdoor condition, the extra weight is helpful. I am just trying to understand what others are doing so I can sort out my goals.

So the motor is around 59 grams which is the Park 400 outrunner range, that is not real heavy at all.

Their recomended motor is....................54 grams
Their recomended esc is.......................14 grams
Their recomended lipo is........................56 grams
Their recomended servo is 8 grams X 4 32 grams <I use these>

My RX is .....6 grams <corona Synth> <those Spektrum's are LIGHT>
3S750 is ....68 grams
Axi 2208 is .45 grams
GWS props are very light
my esc is ...12 grams

The plane it's self already has plenty of holes in it, unless you cut the entire cockpit off like JoeDirtRC, I wasnt sure if that was a perminent removal of if he just made a bigger hatch.

The Rimfire motors seem heavy for the power the put out <hearsey of course> and I feel the Axi will compete with it with 10 grams less weight. The only other thing that could add weight is glue, or getting carried away with it. It doesn't look like there is a lot to glue, I have been wrong before.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 07:41 PM
Pilon_1
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Kingsburg CA
Joined Nov 2007
39 Posts
My Silhouette

Finally got to fly mine last weekend, What a blast to fly! After a little trimming the Silhouette flew straight and smooth with no bad tendencies. I did a full removable canopy because there was no way I was going to be able to reach inside with my short fingers. It has plenty of power with the Grayson's 2212-13 and 800mha 3 cell battery. I also bent up a new landing gear and went to 2" wheels setting the nose up at a higher angle of attack making it easier to take off of the grass. Had to make new wheel pants to go with the new wheels. Looking forward to putting a few more flights on it this weekend. Has anyone had trouble with the rudder warping? Mine does, I think it is do to the printing being heavier on one side than the other. I made a foam block to form it straight while it is stored.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 07:48 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilon_1
Finally got to fly mine last weekend, What a blast to fly! After a little trimming the Silhouette flew straight and smooth with no bad tendencies. I did a full removable canopy because there was no way I was going to be able to reach inside with my short fingers.
Very nice, now that I can see the canopy mod, I understand the end result. Any idea how your AUW is? I am just unrapping mine, with the KIEF event starting tomorrow, no flying it this weekend.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 10:08 PM
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United States, PA, Bellefonte
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Parts are scaled
Wing ...............................90.8
Fuse ..............................67.0
Spats ..............................3.1
Wheels and parts ................9.5
Push Rods ..........................7.9
Elevator ............................9.1
Landing Gear ......................11.8
Sub .................................199.2 or 7.02 ounces

Axi with Radial Mount and X.....49.8
GWS 9050DD ..........................7.0
ESC 15 amp Scorpion ..............22.0
2 servo extension .....................6.0
Servos ..................................32.0
RX ........................................10.0
Rhino 3S750 ............................68.0
Total ....................................394.0 or 13.89 ounces
Stickers and advetisements not included.

I already used my 12 gram ESC on another project so it fattened up a bit. I will have a spinner on it as well so that will be a bit more.

The wing is a bit softer then I expected, sort of scared I will break it.
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Last edited by DaOldGuy; Oct 15, 2009 at 10:56 PM.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 10:28 PM
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Xpress..'s Avatar
United States, CA, Alpine
Joined Oct 2007
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12OUNCE ESC?! That's a MONSTER!
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 10:33 PM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
Parts are scaled
Wing ...............................90.8
Fuse ..............................67.0
Spats ..............................3.1
Wheels and parts ................9.5
Push Rods ..........................7.9
Elevator ............................9.1
Landing Gear ......................11.8
Sub .................................199.2 or 7.02 ounces

Axi with Radial Mount and X.....49.8
GWS 9050DD ..........................7.0
ESC 15 amp Scorpion ..............22.0
2 servo extension .....................6.0
Servos ..................................32.0
RX ........................................10.0
Rhino 3S750 ............................68.0
Total ....................................394.0 or 13.89 ounces
Stickers and advetisements not included.

I already used my 12 ounce ESC on another project so it fattened up a bit. I will have a spinner on it as well so that will be a bit more.

The wing is a bit softer then I expected, sort of scared I will break it.
Thanks, good job, right on 14oz. I need to check my scales to get a better measurement.

Nice, let me know when you fly.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 10:35 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
Thanks, good job, right on 14oz. I need to check my scales to get a better measurement.

Nice, let me know when you fly.
Well they seldom match the parts break out, always a little heavier even with padding. I blame it on Glue and humidity.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 11:45 PM
Pilon_1
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Kingsburg CA
Joined Nov 2007
39 Posts
AUW came out to 15.2 oz, not real light but under the max weight and it flies off of grass. Did any of you have a problem with the wing fit? Mine had a good size gap. I made filiets with my foam cutter instead of building it up with thick CA as the plans sugest.
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 05:30 AM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilon_1
AUW came out to 15.2 oz, not real light but under the max weight and it flies off of grass. Did any of you have a problem with the wing fit? Mine had a good size gap. I made filiets with my foam cutter instead of building it up with thick CA as the plans sugest.
Keeping the weight down helps with the grassy take offs. You mentioned the rudder warping in a past post, mine came packed with a peice of styro split part way so it could be slid over the TE of the Rudder. Looking at that design it may just be wise to glue a piece of .5 x 3.0 carbon fibre strip to that TE with UHU Creativ <POR> just to prevent it from warping.
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 10:58 AM
Pilon_1
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Kingsburg CA
Joined Nov 2007
39 Posts
I was thinking more like imbedding a piece of carbon fiber horizontally in the black strip because that is where the warp is the worse. A foam block slipped over the rudder with a notch curved in the opposite direction of the warp has worked fine for now. My hobby room isn't air-conditioned and gets a bit warm this time of year. On one side of the rudder the red is printed very lightly, you can see through the red, its almost pink. I think the difference in the two sides causes the warp. Kind of like the old days of covering with tissue and having to dope the surfaces evenly or they would shrink and warp. Covering with tissue, now I am dating myself!
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 11:04 AM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilon_1
I was thinking more like imbedding a piece of carbon fiber horizontally in the black strip because that is where the warp is the worse. A foam block slipped over the rudder with a notch curved in the opposite direction of the warp has worked fine for now. My hobby room isn't air-conditioned and gets a bit warm this time of year. On one side of the rudder the red is printed very lightly, you can see through the red, its almost pink. I think the difference in the two sides causes the warp. Kind of like the old days of covering with tissue and having to dope the surfaces evenly or they would shrink and warp. Covering with tissue, now I am dating myself!
That would work, I am always worry about cutting into something warp, it may warp more. Bad lumber has got me there. This is my first ARF and really First Dupron type material, I am sure I am going to learn a few things.
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 07:50 PM
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Picked up a few Items at the Kief show, to bring the weight down some more I picked up a 13.4 gram esc.

I met with the AMA's Park Pilot program team and editor of the quarterly Mag, Jeff Troy. I was looking through the Fall Copy and there is a Pilots Choice write up on the Silhouette by Jacob Ramsey.

"The fun thing about a foam-built park model is that their absence of weight practically makes them ignore gravity. About the only thing that aggravates these models is the wind, but because of their better then 2 to 1 power to weight ratio and great control authority, light breezes and the occasional gust can be tolerated."

He further commented that Great Planes strongly recomended useing the 20C version of the 3S640 and not the 15C. He also added the 40mm Du-Bro Electric spinner, it really is a nice touch.

Ron
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Old Oct 17, 2009, 09:32 AM
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D/FW
Joined Aug 2004
703 Posts
I finally got my power issues worked out. The Park 400 is plenty of power for this plan IMO. My problem was the old TP Prolites I was using. A friend loaned me two Zippy Flightmax 800 mah 20C. The plane had ample power with this setup. I was very impressed with how it flew. Unfortunately my GWS receiver took a hit and it rolled into the ground. The fuse is broke into two pieces, but it's a very clean break. I will glue it, reinforce it, and run some clear tape down the sides. Very great flying plane though.
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