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Old Oct 13, 2009, 10:00 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
12,246 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
I am flying a Hobby City Motor:
TR 28-30B 14A 1050Kv Brushless Outrunner
Max Eff: 12A
Max Load: 14A
Kv: 1050
Weight: 57.9gr (2oz)
Pull: 400~900gr
~150W with a 10x3.8 prop
Flying a Turnigy 1300mah 30C pack (4.4oz)
AUW 17.5oz on my crappy scale
That is a nice set up, with the near 2-1 power over weight, that has plenty of punch.

Thanks
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Old Oct 13, 2009, 10:06 PM
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Xpress..'s Avatar
United States, CA, Alpine
Joined Oct 2007
20,936 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by badpilotto
or are used to.
Well good then, because the Silhouette I'm used to sucks

Like I said, I put in an Astro Flight 010 geared inrunner into the nose, and it brought the weight down. Has power, but I'm for sure going down to a 3 cell 730 lipo
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Old Oct 14, 2009, 01:41 AM
BadPilot
badpilotto's Avatar
United States, IL, Custer Park
Joined Nov 2007
1,706 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
I have 3 choices for motors to put on the Silhouette.

Axi 2208/34 Silver, I have one of these on my i3D <avatar> and it is 12.5 ounces with 1/2 throtle hovers with a 3S750. It weighs 45 grams, rated at 90 WATTS.

Eflite Park 400 740Kv which I have one on a Kadet EP that is 30 ounces and it just flys like a trainer on 3S1250, weighs 56 grams, is rated as 100 WATTS.

Eflite Park 400 920Kv which I have one on a Gentle Lady 2M Glider that is 27 ounces and it will go vertical on 3S1250, weighs 56 grams, is rated as 140 WATTS.

Mark's <video I posted> came in under weight with a Eflight Park 370 and 3S710 lipo, he wants to put on a 400 since the 370 was under powered and would hover at WOT but fall out.

The Silhouette is supposed to be 14.5 to 16 ounces AUW.

I "think" the Axi could do 3D as long as the Lipo was not too large, adding additional weight to lug around, I am getting 10 minute flights with a 12.5 ounce plane with having the nose pointed up most of the time.

It is "possible" the Himax at 100 watts could pull it off if done right, it an the Axi both might lack some of the Hover "punch out", but at the same time you have dropped your wing loading and it becomes a floater that is more forgiving while doing stunts at only 1 mistake high. I am just confused how to mount it will a stick.

Badpilotto, Littleoak, what motors and Lipos are you guys running / where did your weight come in at?

Thanks
Ron

Ron,

I have not purchased the Silhouette yet however, was commenting on the weight of the ACFT to power ratio of Xpress' posted motor link.

My personal opinion, I would go with the motor that would punch an ACFT out of the hover, quickly. I am not as good as you at hovering and having that extra power comes in handy when I make a mistake.

Just my thoughts.

John
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Old Oct 14, 2009, 03:56 AM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
12,246 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by badpilotto
Ron,
I have not purchased the Silhouette yet however, was commenting on the weight of the ACFT to power ratio of Xpress' posted motor link.
My personal opinion, I would go with the motor that would punch an ACFT out of the hover, quickly. I am not as good as you at hovering and having that extra power comes in handy when I make a mistake.
Just my thoughts.

John
Power is a good thing when you are 0 mistakes high.
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Old Oct 14, 2009, 10:38 PM
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littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Flew again today, nice, had a good couple of flights.

I flew for 7 min and put back in 623mah, so I am looking at 89mah per min. Draining pack down to 80% usage (1040mah), would give me a flight time of 11.5min, with a mean amp draw of 4.7 amps. 10min flights should not be a problem with these 1300mah packs, with a motor that gives a good deal of punch. I still may order a couple of 1000mah packs to get a reasonable weight saving, and still be able to fly for 9min.

Tomorrow I am going to do the hatch mod, and probably fly again at the weekend. I have to maiden our little guys Wattage Tubby Cubby with him!
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 05:33 AM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
12,246 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
Flew again today, nice, had a good couple of flights.

Tomorrow I am going to do the hatch mod, and probably fly again at the weekend. I have to maiden our little guys Wattage Tubby Cubby with him!
I have got to pick mine up today at lunch, had a small issue with our youngest going to the ER, hobby needs to wait on those things.

Are you using the Turnigy Lipos? I have been a fan of the Rhino Lipos, they are the best I have found. I have bought a couple Turnigy and Flightmax and I have to say they are very nice as well.

Your flight times are very respectable, my 12 ounce biplane has 10 minute flights on the Rhino 3S750 with most of that in hover and 3D. The Axi Motor is very efficent and the power to weight is perfect. I am hoping to get to that same place with the Silhouette.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 06:25 AM
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D/FW
Joined Aug 2004
703 Posts
I glued the hatch in place on my Silhouette. Then I took an Exacto and cut the entire canopy off using the black lines as a guide to cut straight. I figured if you had to use tape to hold it on anyway I might as well do something to get good access to the battery compartment. It doesn't look bad either if you stay right on the border of the black line and use a new blade. As it was I felt like I was in danger of ripping the fuse apart trying to get batteries in and out of the thing.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 06:32 AM
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D/FW
Joined Aug 2004
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Daoldguy, I'm using the Park 400-890 on my Silhouette. Right now I only have two flights on it. So far the power seems anemic, but it may have been my batteries and choice of prop. I used TP 910 Prolites and didn't charge them before I flew. I also used a 10 x 3.8SF prop. The next time I go out I will use some Flightmax 800 mah 20C batteries that my friend has let me borrow. I will be expirementing with 10 x 4.7 and 11 x 3.8 props too. The same friend has let me borrow a Park 450 in case the power is still not enough.

The plane definetly didn't have 3D power the way I had it setup. I will let you know if it improves.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 06:37 AM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDirtRC
I glued the hatch in place on my Silhouette. Then I took an Exacto and cut the entire canopy off using the black lines as a guide to cut straight. I figured if you had to use tape to hold it on anyway I might as well do something to get good access to the battery compartment. It doesn't look bad either if you stay right on the border of the black line and use a new blade. As it was I felt like I was in danger of ripping the fuse apart trying to get batteries in and out of the thing.
Yes I feel the same. Here is a link to a hatch mod on another thread that I am going to do today. This should also allow me to mount the batteries flat on top of the wing, and tidy up the wiring.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...lhouette+hatch

Took a little bit of searching - Post No 27, Thanks 172AMD!
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 07:03 AM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
I have got to pick mine up today at lunch, had a small issue with our youngest going to the ER, hobby needs to wait on those things.

Are you using the Turnigy Lipos? I have been a fan of the Rhino Lipos, they are the best I have found. I have bought a couple Turnigy and Flightmax and I have to say they are very nice as well.

Your flight times are very respectable, my 12 ounce biplane has 10 minute flights on the Rhino 3S750 with most of that in hover and 3D. The Axi Motor is very efficent and the power to weight is perfect. I am hoping to get to that same place with the Silhouette.
Yes Turnigy Lipo's, I like them they have great punch. I use flightmax on my heli, and they are good also, but more expensive than Turnigy. I have used Rhino Lipo's only in an RC car and they seem just fine. I would not be surprised if all these packs are made in the same factory in China, and just repackaged with different labels.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 09:15 AM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDirtRC
Daoldguy, I'm using the Park 400-890 on my Silhouette. Right now I only have two flights on it. So far the power seems anemic, but it may have been my batteries and choice of prop. I used TP 910 Prolites and didn't charge them before I flew.
I am not familiar with the Park 400-890, is that an eflite inrunner?

The Brushless Park 400 920Kv <or 740kvare both WAY more then a 14-16 ounce plane should need. My 2 are both on 27 Ounce planes. Prop may be the issue, I am running 11X7 size props, with 3S1250. Is your TP910 a 3S

I have the Axi 2208/34 1050Kv on a 12 ounce Biplane, I add a one ounce Pen Cam and I am still vertical all over the place on a 3S750 and 9X5 prop.

Electrifry shows the battery needed to be a 3S610 which would fit just fine in the opening. Most folks here seem to be running much larger lipos, so I am confused. From all my scratch built planes, light is always the key and I never use over a 3S800.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 10:58 AM
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cayars's Avatar
Bridgeton, NJ
Joined Mar 2009
2,083 Posts
This plane flys more like a balsa plane then a typical foam plane. It handles the extra weight of the batteries just fine. With a 1000mA to 1300mA battery you get a lot more flight time.

Carlo
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 11:19 AM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
I am not familiar with the Park 400-890, is that an eflite inrunner?

The Brushless Park 400 920Kv <or 740kvare both WAY more then a 14-16 ounce plane should need. My 2 are both on 27 Ounce planes. Prop may be the issue, I am running 11X7 size props, with 3S1250. Is your TP910 a 3S

I have the Axi 2208/34 1050Kv on a 12 ounce Biplane, I add a one ounce Pen Cam and I am still vertical all over the place on a 3S750 and 9X5 prop.

Electrifry shows the battery needed to be a 3S610 which would fit just fine in the opening. Most folks here seem to be running much larger lipos, so I am confused. From all my scratch built planes, light is always the key and I never use over a 3S800.
My aim is to fly 8-9min. There is only so light you can get with this plane, and with the recommended 640mah, you are going to get around 4min. That is not an acceptable flying time for me. I'd prefer to be a little heavier, have more punch and flight time. I would say a 1000mah would be a very good compromise on the battery pack. My Silhouette does not fly like an ultra-light foamy, it fly's more like a balsa plane - but much slower, and feels lighter. It tracks great in the sky, exactly where you point it, and the slower speed makes it great for smooth 3D.
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 01:48 PM
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DaOldGuy's Avatar
United States, PA, Bellefonte
Joined Dec 2007
12,246 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by littleoak
My aim is to fly 8-9min. There is only so light you can get with this plane, and with the recommended 640mah, you are going to get around 4min. That is not an acceptable flying time for me. I'd prefer to be a little heavier, have more punch and flight time. I would say a 1000mah would be a very good compromise on the battery pack. My Silhouette does not fly like an ultra-light foamy, it fly's more like a balsa plane - but much slower, and feels lighter. It tracks great in the sky, exactly where you point it, and the slower speed makes it great for smooth 3D.
I get what you and cayars are both saying, dont take me wrong. Having a 12 ounce Biplane doing 3D and getting 10 minute flights on the 610 and 750 lipos as me spoiled, can 2 more ounces make the difference?

If you look at Marks video in Post 30, he is underpowered with a Park 370, having to fly with more throttle, and using a TP 710 lipo that was a 6 minute flight and he quit before LVC.

With a 1000 or 1300 I can see this plane flying like a balsa with the full airfoil and extra weight, I have one of those Typoon 2 3D with the 1800 lipo and it is the same way, stick the 2250 25C lipo in the thing it is a freekin rocket with the CG being a bit forward.

Being this plane is more "breakable" then my EPP builds, I tend to want it lighted so it hits the ground with less force, of course avoiding hitting the ground is even better but it happens.

I have it in the car, the testing begins
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Old Oct 15, 2009, 03:29 PM
Goats & Glocks Eat Anything
littleoak's Avatar
Houston, in the Great State of Texas
Joined Jan 2009
459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daoldguy
I get what you and cayars are both saying, dont take me wrong. Having a 12 ounce Biplane doing 3D and getting 10 minute flights on the 610 and 750 lipos as me spoiled, can 2 more ounces make the difference?

If you look at Marks video in Post 30, he is underpowered with a Park 370, having to fly with more throttle, and using a TP 710 lipo that was a 6 minute flight and he quit before LVC.

With a 1000 or 1300 I can see this plane flying like a balsa with the full airfoil and extra weight, I have one of those Typoon 2 3D with the 1800 lipo and it is the same way, stick the 2250 25C lipo in the thing it is a freekin rocket with the CG being a bit forward.

Being this plane is more "breakable" then my EPP builds, I tend to want it lighted so it hits the ground with less force, of course avoiding hitting the ground is even better but it happens.

I have it in the car, the testing begins
Got ya, let me know how you see it when you fly. I don't immediately see how you get get this plane at 14oz. But maybe with a small motor, light servos, and a 750mah pack you could get there. I did not weight the airframe or individual components as I put them in there. What is Mark's plane all up weight?
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