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Old Oct 26, 2009, 07:57 PM
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Oh, ithought perhaps it would be taboo as most of your customers seem to be builders!
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Old Oct 26, 2009, 08:49 PM
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Seeing as I have the shortest TD available season of any member so far, about 90 day's a year(june july,and august),Silver will take me 3 to 4 year's or more to complete. But thats OK in my eye's cuz I'm in this for the long hall.

You ask Any military person if shooting at the same target's, bullet after bullet after bullet for 8 hour's in a day,is worth the seamingly endless repetition . No differant as I see the silver task's (tho in a far less grander plan) that will hone the skill's of those that are willing to open their mind's to the task's as they are and not compare them to anything else out there. be it the LSF,Canadian Soaring Society,the BMFA SP,as well as any of the smaller country's own system's.

I prefer the proposed silver ver .1, not because of less task's, but the initial landing task's should stay.

Just MY view

Ken
SSP #6
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Old Oct 26, 2009, 10:58 PM
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I was going to point out how much time people take to accomplish their goals to make LV but I think Steve has done it better so, what he said.
I will say that I am going to repeat the task I made at the contest I attended this year (with better results due to the structured practice the SSP will get from me) and try to add a few more, it will only make me better.

I think that the first version is pretty good except for that pesky "distance" that keeps showing up in timed flights

Our weekend is looking shot in the @#% again and since I will be the only boss in the building Tuesday I can't play hooky and fly the only good forecasted day so far this week.
So all you folks with the weather please put in a flight for those of us with bricks in our rain gear pockets

Joe
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knormang
Oh, ithought perhaps it would be taboo as most of your customers seem to be builders!
I'm really not sure how many are actually builders. Personally, I fly everything from a flapped Ava, Tower Hobbies Vista, Radian 120", Falcon 880, and a score of others. Some I built, some were built by others and some are ARF's that I assembled. It's all good here. The sad fact is that why I have some nicer planes, the Radian probably gets the most time logged on it and I've had it the shortest amount of time. The convienience of e-power can't be ignored.
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 06:29 AM
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Have just completed the Copper level (slope option) and sent it in to Steve. After starting on the 13 September up until 2 weeks ago not much was happened with poor weather and other distractions holding progress to about 50% complete. Then about two weekends back the weather changed for the better and I mean for the better. Using a Duck combat wing for all the tasks I suddenly found the challenge not to be keeping it in the air but, to keep it from disappearing into the clouds. This was done by some hairy aerobatics which kept it in sight and eventually coming back to earth, with all tasks finally completed.
Some time back I found out that Steve was not going to continue with the slope part of the program due to lack of support and after some emails to and fro, which ended with me volunteering our club’s help we received an answer asking for suggestions for the Silver to compare with the TD Silver already published. To do this and to pass on individual responses would take more space and time so will dive in straight away and respond by using dot points.
1) Not one member consulted agrees with the duration and repeated tasks.
2) No one will carry out the program as it now stands
3) Copper level is OK for a start as it now stands. Repetitive tasks could be phased out in the future
4) Bronze level already too long and repetitive-boring!, duration should not be increased . Goal and Return and Xcountry tasks are probably impossible at 99.9% slope sites.
5) Silver TD duration is not on. When our members were shown the repetitiveness and duration the unanimous reaction was ’forget it, we are not prepared to waste our time” and thereafter totally lost interest
A few general observations:
This program is intended to encourage sporting (non competitive) flyers to become more proficient (I think?). This is not the way to go, they will be scared away. I suggest that most of those who have commented re. ‘the program is too easy’ are already competent pilots who should look towards LSF or other programs.
Regarding duration times. Power aerobatic proficiency levels manage very well with flights of +/- 10 minutes with only difficulty differing. 55 hours is ridiculous-“boring in Spades”. This demonstrates that different methods of flying systems are different, and this applies to TD and slope. Task durations will be different and level total durations have not need to be the same.
We are only too happy to be involved in creating Silver and Bronze slope levels, but not with the task repetitiveness and excessive durations stated.
I have kept this as brief as possible and may need to expand further. I would be happy to debate the above should anyone so wish. I am a member of the Maleny RC Gliding Club which to the best of my knowledge is the only club in Queensland that has until very recently has only flown slope.
Finally I wish to say this in no way is a criticism of Steve who I admire for kicking this program off when many of our so called senior flyers have been trying to ignore the flying communities wishes for years. Well done Steve.
Charles Thompson
SSP #18 Copper (pending) LSF #1748 Level 4
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 07:47 AM
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Charles T: I'll make you a deal. I was told there was a slope program started this year. Go to the slope forum, find it and look it over. If it suits your needs that's fine. I thank you for giving the SSP a try. If it doesn't work come back and let me know. As long as you work with others through this thread as well. I'll give you guys free rein to work up a program from Bronze through Platinum. Titanium is only for people who repeat the program, so Platinum should be your hard-core level. If you can make it happen, I'll vote for a change to our current Bronze to make it all TD. Then add a slope program to the Sportsman's Soaring Program. However, people will have to do one or the other not mix and match. I don't think it would work otherwise. Let me know what you guys think.
Silver ver3: Here's another one to check out.
STATS: Jim has given me some stats from the LSF to consider while deciding on the length levels should take. What he has found is that LI-LII, LII-LIII, LIII-LIV all adverage 1-2 years for the majority of people to complete. LIV-LV is normally 5+ years. There was no way to get a time for aspirant-LI.
The landing survey as I said before pretty much shows me I was close enough in my thinking on distances compared to skill level. Those who fell short admitted they felt they should practice more and thus improve their landing skills.
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 10:11 AM
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Hey Guys sorry I made an error on my last reply calling myself a LSF4 when I am only LSF3. Got a rush of blood to the head!!!. Been so close for so long but not finished.
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 11:23 AM
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Steve. I just did a search on the forum's for a "slope soaring program" and came up empty. If there is one, I would be interested in takeing a look at it.for info only . Maybe someone can send a link to it if such program exits.

Ken

SSP #6
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 12:58 PM
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I dug back throught this thread until I found the guy who mentioned the slope program. I have PM'd him to see what ever became of it. I'll let you know as soon as I hear anything from him.
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 03:09 PM
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Not wanting to go thru 35 pages of posts,
now that I have signed up do I get an e-mail with a pdf for the copper level to score my flights on?

thanks

nut
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 03:45 PM
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Yep, you sure do, along with an aspirant number. It's on the way, check your e-mail. I try to check my mail several times a day and answer e-mails as soon as I get them most of the time.
************************************************** ************************************************** ************
Anyone see a Silver Level we can agree on yet or do I need to try another one?
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 04:54 PM
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Tuesday report

Joe - as you mentioned, today's weather was better than we've been getting, or what we will have again soon. Since my parents are visiting I had the day off and went flying with my dad and sons.

It was total overcast, and the sun had been out for less than an hour earlier in the day, so I didn't expect much. I figured I would just get in some landings for Bronze. As it ended up I got into a nice soft thermal over some woods, and drifted gently for well over 10 minutes without going too high or drifting too far. I decided to go for straight duration, which for Bronze is 45 minutes. My stretched Sagitta got way up there, but after several gentle updrafts it touched down at 39:50! Not 45, but much better than what I expected today.

A little later a red tail hawk showed me a thermal that gave me about 13 minutes. I forgot that the Bronze timed flights had to be within 60 seconds of the target. I did, however, get both landings within a meter, so my 53 minutes of flying counted for two of the Bronze landings.

My 10-year-old son completed his Copper landings.

Tim
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 05:22 PM
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great to hear Tim, and a well done to Tim Jr.

Steve. Maybe Silver should be:



One Single flight

Minimum time = 60 second's

Can be Slope or TD

No Spot landing

BUT THE ENTIRE FLIGHT IS FLOWN COMPLETELY BLIND FOLDED,AND NO DIRECTION'S CAN BE GIVEN FROM THE WITNESS



This will keep the task # low and add interest to the flight.

Ken
SSP #6
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L-Spatz
great to hear Tim, and a well done to Tim Jr.

Steve. Maybe Silver should be:



One Single flight

Minimum time = 60 second's

Can be Slope or TD

No Spot landing

BUT THE ENTIRE FLIGHT IS FLOWN COMPLETELY BLIND FOLDED,AND NO DIRECTION'S CAN BE GIVEN FROM THE WITNESS



This will keep the task # low and add interest to the flight.

Ken
SSP #6
Oh... And you you have to take the battery out of the plane too.....

Radian
www.phflyers.com
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L-Spatz
great to hear Tim, and a well done to Tim Jr.

Steve. Maybe Silver should be:



One Single flight

Minimum time = 60 second's

Can be Slope or TD

No Spot landing

BUT THE ENTIRE FLIGHT IS FLOWN COMPLETELY BLIND FOLDED,AND NO DIRECTION'S CAN BE GIVEN FROM THE WITNESS



This will keep the task # low and add interest to the flight.

Ken
SSP #6
That is so wrong on so many levels especially to those of us who build from a box of wood! But you know I got my foamie trainer it might be doable.

Soar Dude
SSP#14
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