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Old Mar 13, 2012, 10:53 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evz View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flatulator
I checked continuity between the wires and the stator but not the wires to each other. I will check that from now on. How do you check ohms? Do I attach my test leads to each end of the wire?
Set the meter to Rx1 (resistance of 1 Ohm full scale) and touch the two probes together. You will see a low reading (0.1 Ohms or so) and that is the resistance in the probes and leads.

Put one tip on a motor lead and touch the second and then the third lead, readings should be low, steady, and the same. Move the first probe to the second lead and touch the first and second motor lead, again readings should be low, steady, and the same.

Some time if you wait a few seconds the reading will drop and stabilize lower than the initial reading. But all should read only one or two 1/10ths of an Ohm higher than the shorted together probes.

You would need a milliOhm meter to measure the actual resistance in a winding because it is so low. Those are a very expensive type of meter and very few of us have one because of the cost.

Some meters display OL or open line when there is no resistance. A reading of 0.0 Ohms is normally a dead short with no resistance (not an open line).

So if, as you said earlier, if you read 0.00 Ohms resistance between the stator body (one probe on a bare spot on the stator) and a motor lead (the second probe on the ESC connector) you are seeing a lead that is shorted to the stator. And that is a bad thing, as all windings should be open to the stator (not shorted).

Quote:
To check if the wires are shorted I use an ohms meter before the motor is terminated. Attach the meter to one wire end and check the other two wire ends. Do that for each wire and if the meter reads 000 ohms it should be safe to ramp. This is just checking for continuity not resistance.

Hope that helps


Lance
That check tells you if that winding is shorted to the other two windings but not it any of the windings are shorted to the stator. It is a good thing to check the end to end resistance as you finish each phase but you should also check to the stator for shorts.

On the average, I do all of those checks numerous times in the course of winding and terminating a motor.

Jack
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Old Mar 13, 2012, 09:53 PM
homo ludens modellisticus
Ron van Sommeren's Avatar
The Netherlands, GE, Nijmegen
Joined Feb 2001
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Methods for preventing shorts in post 1, method for continuously checking for shorts during winding in item #24, sticky in this subforum:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240993

Check for shorts before hooking up in delta or wye, hooking up IS a short for DC signals.


Vriendelijke groeten Ron
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Old Mar 13, 2012, 11:05 PM
evz
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I appreciate all the input and apologize, for not being clear what was I asking about. The 0.00 Ohm measurement was to say, that there are NO shorts ( continuity) to the stator or any other wires. I am pretty happy about it, you know scraping the epoxy...
My question was about NOT having the phases in right order ( I did two in clockwise order to the right of each other and one to the left side of the first two) That is why the wires did not ended next to each other. Yes, the wraps are all wound clockwise or you may say correct. If you look on the photos, maybe it is more clear what I am trying to say. So I am wondering if this will work the way it is, if I connect/solder the E1, E2, E3 wires together and terminate the S1 S2 S3.
I wish I could describe it better. Probably not using the correct terms yet. Sorry!
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 01:12 AM
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didge's Avatar
Adelaide, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evz View Post
Probably not using the correct terms yet.
No, you sure aren't - 0.00 Ohms means that you have a dead short!

Cheers
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 12:15 PM
homo ludens modellisticus
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0.00Siemens it is then.

Vriendelijke groeten Ron
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 12:24 PM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evz View Post
I appreciate all the input and apologize, for not being clear what was I asking about. The 0.00 Ohm measurement was to say, that there are NO shorts ( continuity) to the stator or any other wires. I am pretty happy about it, you know scraping the epoxy...
My question was about NOT having the phases in right order ( I did two in clockwise order to the right of each other and one to the left side of the first two) That is why the wires did not ended next to each other. Yes, the wraps are all wound clockwise or you may say correct. If you look on the photos, maybe it is more clear what I am trying to say. So I am wondering if this will work the way it is, if I connect/solder the E1, E2, E3 wires together and terminate the S1 S2 S3.
I wish I could describe it better. Probably not using the correct terms yet. Sorry!
I cannot really tell all the details from looking at your photos. But it may be that I'm missing something and the details are there.

Maybe it will help you if you compare what you have to the attached image. As I see it, it looks to me as if it would not change anything as far as the locations of the ends if the last phase was started on #3 and ended on #12 or started on #12 and ended on #3. So I don't understand why your ends come out differently.

The ends would still be in the same place even though they were swapped in doing the wind. But you would want to think of the ends as being marked S3 and E3 as per the image for doing the termination.

The second image shows the termination you intend to do and it looks to be right to me too.

The images I posted may show the turns as opposite to what you have but as long as they are all done the same way on all arms it is OK.

So if you decide it all looks OK it comes down to giving it a test. When I do that, I just give the throttle one or two clicks open and shut it immediately. If it is right the motor will run and stop. If it does not run or if it stutters do not keep trying or you run the risk of damaging the ESC.

Then if you give it two or three starts, a little longer every time, stopping and checking each arm for heat, you'll soon know if you have a good wind or not.

I think I've read that it is possible that a motor will run with a reversed wind but that that will cause the reversed arm to overheat and burn up pretty quickly. So that is why you want to sneak up on testing with more throttle and longer tests.

Jack
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 12:43 PM
homo ludens modellisticus
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The Netherlands, GE, Nijmegen
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Winding diagram 'calculator', click en for English version:
http://www.powerditto.de/bewicklungsrechner.html

Vriendelijke groeten Ron
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron van Sommeren View Post
0.00Siemens it is then.

Vriendelijke groeten Ron
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Apparently his range dial should have "Ohm/Mho" printed on it.

Back OT, nice wind evz. I usually go the other direction because it helps keep those transit wires more out of the way, but your method should result in a lower Rm (less transit wire). Anyhow, sounds like you're ready to terminate and test? The EEE bun, SSS terminals if you will, should result in a properly terminated Y. The fact that you wound backwards will only change the direction of rotation; doesn't matter as far as performance.

Kev
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 05:58 PM
evz
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It RUNS!!! Thanks guys!
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Old Mar 20, 2012, 09:56 AM
220 221 Whatever it takes
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USA, IL, Belleville
Joined Dec 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timocharis View Post
If you do have to go online, consider:
http://www.gobrushless.com/shop/inde...ref=LOCTITE410

Dan (the owner) has been a positive force in this business and can always use your support.

Did some time at Scott, so I've been through Belleville quite a few times. How are things there these days?

Dave
Same old same old. LOL I retired from the Fire Dept. back in 98 and moved to the 74th street area to get out of the city. Don't have much liking for the Old or New Mayors. Have a good one.
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Old Mar 24, 2012, 02:06 AM
Dave North
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You worked fire there huh? My respect and regards! Good on you.

Dave
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Old Apr 05, 2012, 03:12 PM
evz
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Colorado
Joined Oct 2009
54 Posts
Motor will not run

I have no idea what I did wrong.
I rewind 2730-1500 13T 24 newbie wire,Wye ABC...just like the first one (still running motor) I was pretty proud of it and had high expectations. Well it just rattles, with a prop or without. No shorted wires to the stator. My Ohm meter shows -0.26 when I test the individual terminated wires. Hopefully, I will not start another Ohm discussion.
Did I "overstuffed"it?
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 03:04 PM
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You cannot 'over stuff it'. More copper is better, as long as it gets you the KV you are after.

Back to basics:
You do have a short you missed.
You wound wrong,
You terminated wrong.
You have a bad solder joint.

It really is pretty much that simple. Unfortunately it's also that complex.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 04:09 PM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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The orginal wind was DLRK I think, not ABC. And the ABC wind will not work on 12N14P motors, only on 8P and 16P motors.

What did you use for a winding diagram?

This page will generate a good winding diagram for you if you don't have one:

http://www.powerditto.de/bewicklungsrechner.html

Jack
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 04:43 PM
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There are 2 variations on that motor I know of; most are 12/14 and dLRK.
The 12/16 is ABC.
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