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Old Dec 26, 2009, 11:01 PM
http://www.aircraft-world
NipponDave's Avatar
American in Japan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r/cmark View Post
Battery 3000 to 4000, 4s and 5s.
ESC Phoenix 180.
actual competition.
Pls email me at supply2-ATMARK-aircraftjapan.com

David

(change "-ATMARK-" to "@" mark)
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Old Dec 27, 2009, 01:27 AM
Passion
Joined Sep 2009
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From - http://www.aircraft-world.com/prod_d...z40/z40all.htm

Quote:
We are now working on and application which matches dynamometer data to our database of measured prop constants, to make an accurate calculation of performance for any combination of motor, battery, and propeller. We hope to have this completed by Jan 15th 2006 (really!! Watch this spot for link).
It is a few days from 2010 and the spot for the link is still reserved. 4 Years down the line ??? At least remove that from the site if is will not be done.

Also:
Quote:
I'm still in the USA till Sept 1st, but will get staff to retest all the Zs motors starting tomorrow. To be frank, the employee who did the early tests on all the pre-production samples wasn't paying close attention and probably made a number of mistakes (including using some old tired battery packs). That employee is no longer withn the company, and we'll put our top tech guy on it this time, and use fresh G3 lipo packs...

David
That was post 201 in Aug.09. The PDF showing the prop data sheets is still the same as before.
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Old Dec 27, 2009, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NipponDave View Post
That data was taken with OLD generation lipo packs, and my max amp specs were pretty conservative. For the Z4020-14, the motor is best at around 55A~65A peak, but can be pushed up to about 75A and still have good overall efficiency.

The way to go is use fresh, good-quality lipo, and a logging device (or simple ammeter) to check peak current. These are the props to START with, if you have strong lipo:

5S - 14x7
4S - 15x8

David
David as discussed in previous posts, the feeling is if this data is out of date it should have either a large warning notice at the link or removed altogether.

As Swen says there was an undertaking to commence retesting some time ago but no changes to the pdf's (that I can see).

George
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 12:11 AM
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New data prop would be nice but, I understand it takes a lot of time to get it done and David probably doesn't have time to do it himself. David and the rest of the crew are busy taking care of us and/or working on new models/products.

Keep working on new models/products David and I'll keep using my watt meter and Emeter2
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 12:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Buzzkill2 View Post
New data prop would be nice but, I understand it takes a lot of time to get it done and David probably doesn't have time to do it himself. David and the rest of the crew are busy taking care of us and/or working on new models/products.

Keep working on new models/products David and I'll keep using my watt meter and Emeter2
I am certain David doesn't have time to do it himself and the purpose of my comment was to alert him to the undertaking he gave and to protect him from customers who buy on the basis of the data presented on the web site. I know from personal experience. I have been buying from them for almost 10years and AC-World have a good reputation for presenting meaningful data on all their products. It's a shame to spoil that reputation with old data that David has to alert us to when a simple message on the web site would suffice.

I too have a Watt Meter and an Emeter 2 however they can't give me any data on motors that I don't own. Hence the benefit of having meaningful specifications listed on web sites. I could only imagine the effort AC-World put in to create the data profiles on their web site has enhanced the sales of their products. I know there are a number of people in our club who rely on the data to determine their motor selection.

George
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 02:00 AM
Passion
Joined Sep 2009
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Quote:
New data prop would be nice but, I understand it takes a lot of time to get it done and David probably doesn't have time to do it himself. David and the rest of the crew are busy taking care of us and/or working on new models/products.
That maybe true, but as an organisation dealing with clients worldwide and making good turnover from it, it should take care of its past projects involving clients and prospective clients like a baby. These are information that clients want to see. If it just keeps on moving forward without maintenance of past and existing projects, something is going to give in. If one wants to run a big organisation, he must have the dissipline and ability to manage these things and the staff doing it without excuses like "I am to busy". Otherwise, do not undertake to do these things.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 03:24 AM
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Relax guys. I'm sure Hyperion is on it.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 10:16 AM
Passion
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Well, I am relaxed, very much so, thank you. Some time ago I was looking for some new motors and looked at Hyperion as an option, but I saw that they were also very relaxed, since Jan 2006 that is.
Quote:
We hope to have this completed by Jan 15th 2006 (really!! Watch this spot for link).
After I looked at the prop data sheets and the lack of response to update it I got the idee that that was the real data and there was nothing to update. I bought 2 other motors instead.

At the moment I am helping a friend with his motor choice in the 40xx size to spin a 16x8 on 8s. It must be a real efficient motor. I saw no update to the data sheets that is showing motors that are lower in efficiency as other motors that are half the cost. Again, we are now rather looking elsewhere where we know what we get.

Good luck.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swen View Post
Well, I am relaxed, very much so, thank you. Some time ago I was looking for some new motors and looked at Hyperion as an option, but I saw that they were also very relaxed, since Jan 2006 that is. After I looked at the prop data sheets and the lack of response to update it I got the idee that that was the real data and there was nothing to update. I bought 2 other motors instead.

At the moment I am helping a friend with his motor choice in the 40xx size to spin a 16x8 on 8s. It must be a real efficient motor. I saw no update to the data sheets that is showing motors that are lower in efficiency as other motors that are half the cost. Again, we are now rather looking elsewhere where we know what we get.

Good luck.
http://media.hyperion.hk/dn/zs/ZS40propdata.pdf

Page 3.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Buzzkill2 View Post
What's your point?
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 01:43 PM
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Data for Zs4025-16 below was collected using Hyperion G3 VX5500
packs. Weaker packs will result in lower current draw. Use an ammeter
to check current before flight, and motor temperatures after an initial
short flight.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzkill2 View Post
Data for Zs4025-16 below was collected using Hyperion G3 VX5500
packs. Weaker packs will result in lower current draw. Use an ammeter
to check current before flight, and motor temperatures after an initial
short flight.
That may be okay for the ZS4025-16 but Dave posted this in August -
Quote:
Originally Posted by NipponDave View Post
I'm still in the USA till Sept 1st, but will get staff to retest all the Zs motors starting tomorrow. To be frank, the employee who did the early tests on all the pre-production samples wasn't paying close attention and probably made a number of mistakes (including using some old tired battery packs). That employee is no longer withn the company, and we'll put our top tech guy on it this time, and use fresh G3 lipo packs...

David
And this on September 2 -

Quote:
Originally Posted by NipponDave View Post
Hi George,

We are re-running all the Zs40 motors under carefully controlled conditions, checking each with several ESC and ESC settings, and repeating each test several times to insure accuracy. It's a big job, and will probably be finished early next week.

David
So until Dave puts a notation on each page e.g. "OLD DATA Please contact for more information" or "Data Updated dd/mm/yy" we don't know what's accurate and what is not. There are more issues with the data that can be found in more of Dave's replies in this thread.

George
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 02:10 PM
Passion
Joined Sep 2009
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Quote:
Data for Zs4025-16 below was collected using Hyperion G3 VX5500
packs. Weaker packs will result in lower current draw. Use an ammeter
to check current before flight, and motor temperatures after an initial
short flight.
And? That was an addition of a new motor to the list, not existing data being replaced with re-tested ones.

What does that have to do with efficiency?

Check the data - Spinning a 16x10 prop at 7748 rpm and consuming 2186 watt. That is a joke.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeC View Post
That may be okay for the ZS4025-16 but Dave posted this in August -


And this on September 2 -



So until Dave puts a notation on each page e.g. "OLD DATA Please contact for more information" or "Data Updated dd/mm/yy" we don't know what's accurate and what is not. There are more issues with the data that can be found in more of Dave's replies in this thread.

George
There is a "note" at the top of each page stating that it is "old" data.
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Old Dec 28, 2009, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swen View Post
And? That was an addition of a new motor to the list, not existing data being replaced with re-tested ones.

What does that have to do with efficiency?

Check the data - Spinning a 16x10 prop at 7748 rpm and consuming 2186 watt. That is a joke.
So move on and quit complaining. That's "new" data. If it doesn't meet your requirements then you have your answer.
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