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Old Mar 15, 2009, 02:02 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Yippee!
New Scratchbuilt FPV Ship

Hey there, guys and gals (hopefully there's a few gals out there)...

I've posted about this project over on the Blu-Baby thread but I'm starting a new thread here to show off my new bird.

I'm just starting to get into FPV. I haven't even made my first flight yet, but the idea for an FPV bird struck me while surfing Hobby Lobby's website and spying the KMP Challenger II (since discontinued). I've done some basic AP stuff using Tony65x55's Blu-Baby AP1 platform and I wanted something of similar size and flight characteristics only with 4 channels and a pusher configuration.

I put Tony's BBAP1 plans into MSPaint and redrew the thing to fit what I had in mind. I'm calling the result the BBAP-FPV to pay homage to its Blu-Baby heritage though the final product bears little resemblance to its kin.

Here are some specs:

WS = 60" KFm3
Length = 38"
Weight less battery & camera = 25.4oz
AUW = 32-33.6oz with FPV setup and 3s/2250 lipo
Wing Loading ~7.9oz/sqft

Gear:
  • Scorpion 2215-18
  • APC 9x6SF
  • 25A Turnigy Sentry ESC
  • Castle Creations 10A CC-BEC
  • 2x HXT900 + 2x HXT9320MG servos (control surfaces) + 2x HXT500 servos (pan-and-tilt mount)
  • AR7000 Rx
Power: 17.9A, 185W, 88W/lb

And eventually I'll fly it with:
  • KX171 color CCD camera
  • 900MHz 500mW transmitter (yes, I'm getting the Technician Class license)
  • EagleTree eLoggerV2 and OSD

I have two setups for the camera--a forward facing only mount and a pan-and-tilt version that I can't use yet because I don't have a radio with enough channels.

I maidened it the other day and I'm very pleased with it. For one thing...it flies--which in itself is something of an accomplishment for me. It is also very stable which suits its purpose. It's not meant to be an aerobat though it will loop and roll and such. Despite a 60" span it's slow and nimble enough to putt around inside half a soccer field.

Unfortunately I didn't think to take any build pics and the plans are decidedly unrefined since most of it was a combination of TLAR and cut-n-paste. If it turns out that anyone is interested I could try and cobble together a set of beta plans.

Here are a few pics and a 2-minute noggin cam vid to prove it flies.

Vid is HERE.

kendall
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 04:06 PM
Geaux Saints
Hopalong X's Avatar
Grafton, Il
Joined Nov 2007
1,913 Posts
Added to Post #3 of the Tony sticky.
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 04:42 PM
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Dickeroo's Avatar
Joined Dec 2006
1,184 Posts
Just fantastic.

Kendall... you are a pro. That is a great platform you've designed. Very stable. Very smooth. It flies in a groove. Great work!
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 05:01 PM
Registered User
Fresno, CA
Joined Aug 2002
471 Posts
Hey Kendall!

Very nice! I like the idea of the forward platform for the mount! As I am on my way to the garage right now to finish my BBAP 1, I am not happy to see this one, as I like it much better!!

So.... When possible in your busy schedule (we all have busy schedules, don't we??) I would be interested in the dimensions and a drawing for the fuse. I am assuming it has the same parts with the exception of the fuse and the layout of the side view...

Did you leave the wing and stab in the same position relative to each other and just draw the fuse parts out of the side of the 'normal' fuse outline? (Thus leaving the flight dynamics of the wing and stab alone and just making the fuse more of a platform for the camera and such?)

I definitely see one of these in my future, but I just don't have the time to tinker with gettin' it right...

Added: I too am just getting into Flight Vid and have a small wireless cam, but not the nice kind like in your machine!
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 07:26 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dickeroo
Kendall... you are a pro. That is a great platform you've designed. Very stable. Very smooth. It flies in a groove. Great work!
Thanks, Dick. That really means a lot to me.

kendall
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 07:42 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Roberts
I am assuming it has the same parts with the exception of the fuse and the layout of the side view...

Did you leave the wing and stab in the same position relative to each other and just draw the fuse parts out of the side of the 'normal' fuse outline? (Thus leaving the flight dynamics of the wing and stab alone and just making the fuse more of a platform for the camera and such?)
Uh, hmmm, well I started out with that in mind. That's why I like using Tony's designs as a springboard, they tend to fly so nice and I'd like to preserve that. But this time I think I ended up changing almost everything. The only remnants of the original design that made it into the prototype are the length and curve of the "chin", the cord length, and the shape of the V-stab.

The major changes were:

1) Instead of the usual monblock/FFF construction I sculpted the fuse from 5 layers of 1/2 blue foam with some bits hotwired out for the electronics and to lighten the tail a bit.

2) The fuse height also had to be considerably increased to get clearance for a reasonably sized prop.

3) The tail moment is shortened by about 5.5" compared to the BBAP1.

4) The wing planform has a constant 10" cord rather than Tony's tapered design and I reduced the dihedral to 2" total given the increased pendulum stability of the redesigned fuse and to facilitate the use of ailerons.

kendall
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 07:48 PM
Registered User
Chitila / Romania
Joined May 2008
149 Posts
Great plane....Looks so smoth and controllable.....I look forward for drawings-plans because I want to build one.
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 07:48 PM
Geaux Saints
Hopalong X's Avatar
Grafton, Il
Joined Nov 2007
1,913 Posts
Kendall

Well it is on the Tony sticky now and can't be removed so we have to have plans.

Of course somebody will have to make a build guide.

Where's Foamenator when you need him?

Mike
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 07:53 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopalong X
Of course somebody will have to make a build guide.

Where's Foamenator when you need him?
He's busy building Tony's next 18 designs...

kendall
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 08:58 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Roberts
I would be interested in the dimensions and a drawing for the fuse...I definitely see one of these in my future, but I just don't have the time to tinker with gettin' it right...
This being a prototype, I've identified a few things I'd like to address (or some intrepid beta builder to address ) before releasing actual plans.

Some, I think, are inherent to the configuration:
1) Due to the high thrust line it likes to nose down with power. Not severely, but level flight at more than 1/2 throttle needs an extra click or two of up elevator. Angling the motor shaft upward a few degrees to the rear would probably help.
2) Likewise, it tends to torque slightly to the right, so pointing the motor shaft few degrees to the left might help there.
3) It likes lots of rudder in turns. Perhaps a result of the relatively short tail moment. Normally I just fly the left stick--no big deal. But I anticipate turn coordination could be a difficult thing to judge while in FPV without a turn coordination indicator in the instrument cluster. So in the vid I'm flying the right stick only with a 75% aileron-rudder mix in the DX7. Even so it tends to slightly drag its tail through low speed, high banking turns. In the vid you can see it in the downwind-to-base and base-to-final legs of the landing pattern. I need to play some more with the differential to see if that helps some. Increasing the size of the rudder might be a good thing too.

And a couple of things I'd like to try to polish the design a bit:
1) Ideally I should be swinging at least a 10" prop with this motor. I'd like to see what I can do get that extra 1/2" clearance. Perhaps lowering the profile of the tail boom and embedding a CF brace between the laminations.
2) I think there would be more flexibilty in gear placement/balancing if the nose platform were extended a couple of inches.

Just some things to keep in mind. I still call this a work in progress.

kendall
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Old Mar 15, 2009, 11:30 PM
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Foamenator's Avatar
Northern Nevada
Joined Mar 2007
1,581 Posts
Kendall.... Great job and video. And thanks for posting it and your other builds over on the photo spread. It's great to see pictures of those builds again. They are all fantastic. Bob
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Old Mar 16, 2009, 02:25 PM
Fremont, CA
United States, CA, Fremont
Joined Jan 2009
1,644 Posts
That's a neat plane that you designed, Kendall. The video was great!
I've designed and built a very similar AP plane (see attached), but never flew a RC plane yet. I've tried flying the SkyFly 2 but haven't gotten more than 15 seconds before it crashed. Have been practicing on a simulator.
I intend to use the plane to take stereo aerial photos.
I found a way to use channel 4 to tilt my camera and have it stay there and not having to use channel 4 until the next positioning. I'm using Ch 5 (on/off control) to operate a switch that turns the Ch 4 servo on and off. So I turn the Ch 4 switch on, position the camera, and then turn Ch 4 off.

Dan
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Old Mar 16, 2009, 06:02 PM
Postcards From The Purple Edge
tuppertn's Avatar
United States, OK, Sand Springs
Joined May 2007
3,919 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by djacob7
I've designed and built a very similar AP plane (see attached), but never flew a RC plane yet.
You're designing before you can fly? Wow. I wouldn't have had any idea where to start when I was at that point in the hobby.

Your bird must be quite a hauler if it can lug around that 14oz battery and a camera. Strong work there.

kendall
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Old Mar 16, 2009, 09:45 PM
Fremont, CA
United States, CA, Fremont
Joined Jan 2009
1,644 Posts
Thanks, Kendall. I will ask an experienced friend to test-fly this bird, and I won't fly it myself until I've achieved some confidence flying lesser models.
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Old Mar 17, 2009, 01:43 PM
Registered User
Chevy Chase, MD
Joined May 2006
134 Posts
Kendall,
Great design--really like it. I actually have just finished building the Challenger II for FPV and am going to maiden her this weekend. Check her out http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...i#post11655403
Peter
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