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Old Mar 24, 2009, 03:50 AM
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Madison, WI
Joined Feb 2004
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Kmp Cl-215

Marnochs, Looks great! Interesting battery set-up. What are the specs and how is it wired? You stated you're keeping the wing as a two piece for ease of transport. Is that your modification or is the wing designed to be either a 2 piece or 1 piece? Good luck on the repaint. Thanks for sharing.
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Old Mar 24, 2009, 09:22 AM
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Canyon Country, California
Joined Dec 2006
94 Posts
Battery picture does look a wee bit confusing, battery on top is a 2-cell and 3-cell 4000mAh and the one on the bottom is a 5-cell 3200. The 2-3 battery has a series connector installed between the two batteries and the wing connector to make it a 5-cell. Batteries are from existing stock to economize
Wing comes as a two piece unit with aluuminum jointer rods
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Old Mar 24, 2009, 10:08 PM
115 inches of 'hog
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Joined Aug 2004
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Thanks marnochs for posting the pictures.

I am a little worried about your battery setup... By running 2 different capacity packs (I mean the 2 5S packs) you are going to have different RPM's on each motor if you run each pack separately to each motor. If you connect both 5S setups in parallel to both motors, you run the risk of the smaller pack over-discharging before the larger pack. Which is also bad. Either way, you are risking a single-engine out scenario.

Also, what ESC's are you using? I always recommend disabling the voltage cutoff on twin electric setups. I suggested this many times in the E-Flight P-38 build thread, and most people did not listen, had one motor cut out and destroyed the plane, and batteries. Fly with a timer. I have accidentally run my big lipos down 100% and they recharged with no problems. Now these are name-brand Lipos, like Thunder Power and Flightpower..Some other packs may puff a cell and be trash. But ask yourself this, which is cheaper (and easier) ...a new lipo or a new plane?
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Old Mar 25, 2009, 01:12 AM
Thanos Papantonopoulos
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Edessa, Greece
Joined May 2007
439 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaleBrad
Thanks marnochs for posting the pictures.

I am a little worried about your battery setup... By running 2 different capacity packs (I mean the 2 5S packs) you are going to have different RPM's on each motor if you run each pack separately to each motor. If you connect both 5S setups in parallel to both motors, you run the risk of the smaller pack over-discharging before the larger pack. Which is also bad. Either way, you are risking a single-engine out scenario.

Also, what ESC's are you using? I always recommend disabling the voltage cutoff on twin electric setups. I suggested this many times in the E-Flight P-38 build thread, and most people did not listen, had one motor cut out and destroyed the plane, and batteries. Fly with a timer. I have accidentally run my big lipos down 100% and they recharged with no problems. Now these are name-brand Lipos, like Thunder Power and Flightpower..Some other packs may puff a cell and be trash. But ask yourself this, which is cheaper (and easier) ...a new lipo or a new plane?
I totally absolutely agree!!
At my project initially i wanted to build my plane as electric.
To do that i chose 4260 Dymond motors and 60A ESC's.
My battery pack was 2 3cell 5000mAh LiPO in series.
But the batteries were identical. That would ensure (not guarantied of course!!) that they would discharge almost equally avoiding me from BAD suprices!!
I believe that running Parallel batteries on ESC's setup is better than each run separately.
In the worst case its better you have both ESC's cut of the same time. Imagine one motor to stop at 500 faraway from you and suddenly to see your plane putting one wing and dive!!!
On the other hand you could use twin sync but thats another story....!!
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Old Mar 25, 2009, 07:16 AM
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On my electric twins, I run both batteries in parrallel, or one large capacity pack, so both motors always have the same voltage.
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Old Mar 25, 2009, 10:11 AM
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Canyon Country, California
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Thanks for the concern over the batteries - The speed controllers are Castle Creations Phoenix 60's with the bec disabled. Of intrest, one is a brand new controller and the other is two years old. The new controller has a the ability to spin the prop at a much lower RPM than the older unit. Both SC are programed the same with the castle link unit. Medium and high RPM track
Flight timer is a good idea with any power plane, I'm estimating if I fly at full throttle I'll have 6 minutes on the smaller battery ( both motors draw 30A ) so I will limit the flights to that, and then see how much goes back into the batteries. From other flight reports I'm anticipating most of the flight will be at half throtttle or less.
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Old Mar 25, 2009, 11:12 AM
Thanos Papantonopoulos
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Edessa, Greece
Joined May 2007
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You have to take also in consideration that 3 blade props have less efficiency.
Thus it might be a good idea to reconsider your power output.
If i was in your shoes i would chose 6cell instead of 5 (in case the ESC can stand more than 5).
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 07:41 AM
115 inches of 'hog
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I ran into a minor problem last night. I am missing one of the carbon spars for the horizontal stab. I'll have to stop by the LHS to see if I can find something to work, maybe some 'glass rod, although I am afraid I may need a metric size. The stab is tubed, so drilling the hole larger is not an option. Good thing I took pictures when I first unpacked the plane, saves me having to look everywhere in the workshop for something I thought I may have misplaced.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=2410668
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaleBrad
I ran into a minor problem last night. I am missing one of the carbon spars for the horizontal stab. I'll have to stop by the LHS to see if I can find something to work, maybe some 'glass rod, although I am afraid I may need a metric size. The stab is tubed, so drilling the hole larger is not an option. Good thing I took pictures when I first unpacked the plane, saves me having to look everywhere in the workshop

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=2410668
Brad,

Since you are close to completing your plane, I'll just send you one of mine. Just replace it when you can since I'm not starting mine for some time yet. Call Raidentec and see if they'll send you a new one.

Perry
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudderman98
Brad,

Since you are close to completing your plane, I'll just send you one of mine. Just replace it when you can since I'm not starting mine for some time yet. Call Raidentec and see if they'll send you a new one.

Perry
Thanks for the offer. Before I take you up on that , let me check first tonight, I do have some tubing at home, it was late last night and was too tired to look for it.
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaleBrad
Thanks for the offer. Before I take you up on that , let me check first tonight, I do have some tubing at home, it was late last night and was too tired to look for it.

Okay.

Perry
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 08:58 PM
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Thanks for the offer Perry. I got lucky and found at the LHS a Mini Funtana wing tube, which is thick wall aluminium that is the perfect fit. I found a 1/4 diameter tube will fit also, but could not find this size tube in CF or 'glass locally.

So..on with the build.

Make sure to install and bend the elevator wire joiner before gluing the horizontal stabs in place.
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 11:11 PM
115 inches of 'hog
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Joined Aug 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marnochs
Thanks for the concern over the batteries - The speed controllers are Castle Creations Phoenix 60's with the bec disabled. Of intrest, one is a brand new controller and the other is two years old. The new controller has a the ability to spin the prop at a much lower RPM than the older unit. Both SC are programed the same with the castle link unit. Medium and high RPM track
Flight timer is a good idea with any power plane, I'm estimating if I fly at full throttle I'll have 6 minutes on the smaller battery ( both motors draw 30A ) so I will limit the flights to that, and then see how much goes back into the batteries. From other flight reports I'm anticipating most of the flight will be at half throtttle or less.
Just a thought, did you program both esc's to "fixed throttle" as opposed to "auto calibrate?" "Fixed Throttle" may help your low RPM issue
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Old Mar 26, 2009, 11:53 PM
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Canyon Country, California
Joined Dec 2006
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Found out that the older speed controller firmware wasn't up to snuff. CastleCreations released new firmware that helps with outrunner startup. Updated the old controller and the both function the same with auto-calibrate. I was about 17 version behind on the old controller.

All up weight is 13lbs - Motor batteries weigh 35oz total (19oz for 3-2 and 16 for 5-cell). Had to add about 5 oz of lead shot and epoxy to the nose for balance.

AR9100 receiver has two battery inputs, so I have two 2450mAh 4 cell AA NiMh packs in the nose - of course two switches between batteries and receiver.

How are the stabilizer fins attached? -
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Old Mar 27, 2009, 09:34 AM
115 inches of 'hog
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Joined Aug 2004
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Each stab fin is 2 pieces. There are 2 holes drilled through the stab from the factory, and a piece of piano wire runs through the stab into each fin and glued. Then the fins are glued to the stabs with thin CA.

This morning in the sunlight I noticed my horizontal stab on the right side is warped. If you look closely at the picture from the front you can see the angle of attack towards the outer edge has negative incidence compared to the left stab. Tried to twist it and rshrink the covering but the stab is full sheeted and wouldn't move. Nothing I can do about it now Hope it won't affect the flying qualities too much.
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